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--------------Boundary-00=_VGLHQ7B2QL8000000000"
X-Mailer: IncrediMail (5652991)
From: "Phelps--
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Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 15:49:37 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
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charset="US-ASCII"
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: RE: Two
Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
In a electrical box
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------
Hey,
Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
answer a question more on my level...
You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors when
used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you want
Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is information
on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the batterry
pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it cheap.
Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
Hope this helps.
Paul
________________________________
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Two
Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6 100
Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
To: EV <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: RE: full size truck conversion
MIME-Version: 1.0
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 13:51:19 -0600
From: Tim Humphrey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
around 6000lbs. But yeah, it ain't light.
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
I-5, Blossvale NY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G
> Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 2:53 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: RE: full size truck conversion
>
> John Waylands truck was a toyota mini truck. It weighed in at 3000
> pounds before conversion I believe. I think a 2500 4x4 dodge weighs in
> at 8000 pounds before conversion.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Dan Frederiksen
> Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 14:37
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: full size truck conversion
>
> Didnd't John Wayland recently mention that he built a truck and despite
> massive battery weight could do 120miles per charge?
>
> Also while I'm not well versed in this I get the initial impression that
> batteries waste a lot of their capacity at high discharge so rather than
> drive on one bank at a time it will probably give you better range to
> drive on all. lower discharge per battery thus more efficient thus
> longer range. from what I understand
>
> curiously enough the wiki on rolling resistance seems to indicate that
> truck tires have relatively better rolling resistance which might be why
> the extra weight in the truck doesn't translate to eating the extra
> battery capacity. maybe hgher tire pressure in truck tires?
> might be a significant advantage in getting speciel low resistance tires
> too if they exist for trucks. or maybe they already are
>
> Dan
>
>
> S. Love wrote:
>> anyone ever actually complete the conversion on a full size truck?
>> I know there were a couple in the making, but have never seen one
> actually
>> completed.
>> what were the results?
>>
>> Any tips or pointers to convert a fullsize dodge 2500 4X4?
>>
>> I know, I know, the 4X4 is not the best for a conversion, but I
> regularly
>> drive through the dirt on jobsites, and the clearace (and 4X4) is
> really
>> handy.
>>
>> I know it will carry the battery weight without a problem, when I got
> the
>> truck, the only thing the bed was used for is signage, they are big
> sheets
>> of plastic, and sometimes wood, they are big, but they are not heavy.
>>
>> I was thinking of losing the engine, and transmission, and bolting the
>> electric motor directly to the transfer case..
>> the motorbay and under the bed will all be reserved for batteries.
>>
>> 3 or maybe 4 banks 144v each? or more? is this plausable? when one is
> low,
>> switch to the other and then the other? I am concerned about the
> additional
>> weight of the batteries actually subtracting from the distance
> achieveable.
>> I know each bank will end up weighing like 800 pounds, which is not
> much in
>> the grand scheme of things, but 800X3=2,400 pounds. and 800X4=3,200
> pounds.
>> and that is alot.. (the current motor and transmission weigh about
> 1,600
>> and also subtracting the cooling systems, and exhaust, and fuel tank,
>> pumps, etc, I think I can get it to a little over breakeven, but I
> know
>> lighter is better for an EV)
>>
>> any help is appreciated
>>
>> thank
>>
>>
>>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 11:55:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: EV count
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Ya,
you will never get anything but a guess. There are
lots more than you think. I have had 8 at one time
none of which ever made to the Austin site. Just the
electric scooter and bicycle sector has 100's of
1000's most did not go 45 mph but I have had some that
did. just make your own and then there will be one
more...
--- Myles Twete <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Indeed.
> I know hundreds of EVs that are not in the EV album.
> In fact, looking at pre-1935 EVs, there are at least
> 300 known survivors,
> including at least 50 Milburns alone. Same story
> for Detroit, Rauch&Lang,
> Baker, Waverly and a lesser number of the others
> including Studebaker, Pope,
> Argo, Babcock, Standard, etc.
> There are 3 old-timey EVs in the archives Including
> 1 Baker, 1 Detroit and 1
> Milburn (mine) and then one under construction (my
> 1911 Hupp-Yeats.
> So for old-timey EVs, the ratio is 1% of the known
> remaining cars are in the
> EV album.
> On the other hand, that's probably about the
> percentage that are daily or
> occasional drivers...
> -Myles
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Cor van de Water
> Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 5:41 AM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: RE: EV count
>
> I know several EV's that are not in the EV album,
> in fact, I would be surprised if 10% of all EVs
> around here have made it into the EV Album, so if
> you take the EV Album figures, then keep in mind
> that you may be looking at less than 10% of the
> EVs that are driving or existing out there in the
> world.
>
> Just my observation from seeing EV shows and
> looking at EVs in the area, most of which were
> not in the EV album (many are still not) even
> while they are owned by EAA members, who are
> likely to know about the EV album.
>
> The ability of an EV to be a daily driver can
> change from day to day, dependent on battery
> maintenance, suddenly occurring breakdowns,
> availability of knowledge or a facility for repair
> and so on.
>
> Just my $0.02
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private:
> http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD#
> 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Second Life:
>
www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Jay Caplan
> Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 5:42 PM
> To: Bob Bath; ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: EV count
>
> Thanks, I was wondering about how many EVs (3 or 4
> wheeled private licensed
> vehicles capable of 40 mph+) driven on a daily or
> near daily basis there
> are, not to include NEV, golf cart, LSEV, public
> trolleys, trains, buses
>
> I only know of 2 in my area of 1MM+ population. So
> are there only 500 or so
> in the US, by extension?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 3:02 PM
> Subject: Re: EV count
>
>
> > Dear fellow EV enthusiast, this is quite the
> complex
> > question.
> > Start with the 1137 EVs listed on the EV
> discussion
> > list:
> > -some of these are hybrids.
> > -some are not daily drivers; more like a science
> > experiment on wheels. Do they count?
> > -the Bay Area Rapid Transit (BART) in San
> Francisco is
> > one of the most successful EVs around. Yet it is
> a
> > public commuter. What about SFO's "MUNI" electric
> > commuter buses?
> > -what about golf carts. Technically, they are
> EVs.
> > Yet I wouldn't drive one daily to work. So are
> you
> > including LSEVs (low-speed EVs) and NEVs)
> > (neighborhood electric vehicles)?
> >
> > I wish I could be of more help, but this is just
> the
> > tip of the iceberg...
> > I think the more important thing, is "What is the
> > _growth_ of EVs in the US and worldwide?"
> >
> > peace,
> >
> >
> > --- Jay Caplan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > Is there an estimate of how many EVs are in
> daily
> > > (or near daily) use in the
> > > USA?
> > > JLC
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
> > has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch
> too!
> > Learn more at:
> > www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
> > ____
> > __/__|__\ __
> > =D-------/ - - \
> > 'O'-----'O'-'
> > Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe
> came out of the steering
> wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> ________
> > Get the Yahoo! toolbar and be alerted to new email
> wherever you're
> surfing.
> >
>
http://new.toolbar.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/index.php
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
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Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 14:54:38 -0500
From: "Brandon Kruger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Two
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
house circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
Brandon Kruger
http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
http://cafepress.com/altfuel
On 6/11/07, Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
> In a electrical box
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------
>
>
> Hey,
> Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
> answer a question more on my level...
>
> You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors when
> used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
> arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
> theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you want
> Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
> switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is information
> on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
> Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
> Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the batterry
> pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
> suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
>
> I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
> cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it cheap.
> Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Paul
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
> Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Two
>
>
>
> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6 100
> Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>
>
>
--
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 16:04:34 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
Content-Type: Text/Plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Two
Well what I learned is school is that 1000 watts is a 1000 watts AC or DC
Mitchell
-------Original Message-------
From: Brandon Kruger
Date: 6/11/2007 3:56:54 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Two
I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
House circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
Brandon Kruger
http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
http://cafepress.com/altfuel
On 6/11/07, Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
> In a electrical box
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------
>
>
> Hey,
> Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
> answer a question more on my level...
>
> You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors
when
> used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
> arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
> theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you
want
> Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
> switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is
information
> on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
> Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
> Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the
batterry
> pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
> suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
>
> I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
> cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it cheap.
> Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Paul
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
> Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Two
>
>
>
> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6 100
> Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>
>
>
--
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 07:22:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Yahoo! Auto Response
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
I probably won't be able to check my emails until Thursday. Pls. phone 739 77
17, if you need an answer asap. Cheers!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 16:08:13 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
Content-Type: Text/Plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Two
Or should I say volts or amps
Watts law volts times amps is watts
Mitchell
-------Original Message-------
From: Brandon Kruger
Date: 6/11/2007 3:56:54 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Two
I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
House circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
Brandon Kruger
http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
http://cafepress.com/altfuel
On 6/11/07, Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
> In a electrical box
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------
>
>
> Hey,
> Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
> answer a question more on my level...
>
> You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors
when
> used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
> arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
> theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you
want
> Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
> switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is
information
> on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
> Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
> Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the
batterry
> pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
> suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
>
> I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
> cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it cheap.
> Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Paul
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
> Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Two
>
>
>
> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6 100
> Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>
>
>
--
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 13:17:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: EV Dakota and Chargers on eBay
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
I can't believe it, but this truck went for $13,000.
Jeff
--- Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> If anyone is interested, search electric vehicle on
> eBay. Several big boy Enerpro chargers and Magne
> chargers. Also this Dodge Dakota. 160124329720
>
> I rode in this truck back in '94 or '95. Had a nice
> Prestolite 9" series wound traction motor (MNF type
> I
> think). At that time it was mounted under the hood
> coupled to a pulley/belt CVT, from a snowmobile, I
> think. Well, the designers and converters did a
> really nice job of installation of the electric
> equipment, but neglected to comprehend how that CVT
> would interact with the series motor. The result
> was
> a top speed of about 25 mph.
>
> The utility company drove it around a little and
> showed it off at company picnics, but never did much
> else. Very few miles. I have no idea what the
> range
> was. You get too tired going at 25 to care. Years
> later I talked with a couple a power plant mechanics
> who had the truck. They threw out the snowmobile
> pulley crap and installed the motor near the rear
> axel
> with a fixed ratio gear box or belt or chain. I
> never
> saw that up close or know any more about it.
>
> I think the seller on eBay tells the story as best
> he
> can. There is a top speed of 90 mph and range of
> 80+
> listed. I think this is totally a dream. Maybe the
> original intent, but I suspect never realized.
>
> Having said all this, I live near this guy. Well 50
> miles. So if anyone is interested in bidding, I
> could
> assist to some degree.
>
> Later,
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
> Finding fabulous fares is fun.
> Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel
> sites to find flight and hotel bargains.
> http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
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Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "(-Phil-)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Two
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 13:21:04 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
A circuit breaker designed for AC may not handle a fault interrupt on DC.
Higher voltage DC breakers (>48v) also need a way to quench the arc.
You also should never use them as switches!
-Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: Two
> Well what I learned is school is that 1000 watts is a 1000 watts AC or DC
>
> Mitchell
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Brandon Kruger
> Date: 6/11/2007 3:56:54 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: Two
>
> I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
> House circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
>
>
> Brandon Kruger
> http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
> http://cafepress.com/altfuel
>
> On 6/11/07, Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
>> In a electrical box
>>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> ----------------------
>>
>>
>> Hey,
>> Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
>> answer a question more on my level...
>>
>> You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors
> when
>> used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
>> arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
>> theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you
> want
>> Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
>> switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is
> information
>> on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
>> Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
>> Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the
> batterry
>> pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
>> suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
>>
>> I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
>> cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it
>> cheap.
>
>> Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>> Paul
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
>> Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
>> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>> Subject: Two
>>
>>
>>
>> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6
>> 100
>
>> Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Two - now - AC and DC breakers
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 16:23:34 -0400
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
>Subject: Re: Two
>Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 16:04:34 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)
>
>Well what I learned is school is that 1000 watts is a 1000 watts AC or DC
>
>Mitchell
That's true, Mitchell,
But, that doesn't mean you can safely use a house circuit breaker ( designed
to interrupt AC, not DC) in the battery loop of your EV.
AC switches and circuit breakers take advantage of the moments of zero
current as the AC current changes direction. This allows these devices to
stop the current without excessive arcing.
With DC current, there is no momentary zero current flow. So, the arc can
continue until the contacts are far enough apart to extinguish the arc.
Some relays and contactors designed for DC use magnets to deflect the arc,
and make it's effective path longer.
An AC-designed relay, switch, or contactor, may not be able to extinguish
the arc. It could continue until the device melts down - not a safe result.
Phil
Phil
>
>-------Original Message-------
>
>From: Brandon Kruger
>Date: 6/11/2007 3:56:54 PM
>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>Subject: Re: Two
>
>I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
>House circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
>
>
>Brandon Kruger
>http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
>http://cafepress.com/altfuel
>
_________________________________________________________________
Picture this share your photos and you could win big!
http://www.GETREALPhotoContest.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "(-Phil-)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Two
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 13:23:39 -0700
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If you do this, then your batteries become unbalanced. The first battery is
going to get worked much harder than the last. You'd definitely have to
charge them separately, and then rotate them to insure one doesn't die
first.
You also lose the amperage by not using all batteries in parallel. A
controller can use all batteries together equally, and when low speed but
high amperage is needed, all batteries help and you get less sag. (and thus
battery damage)
-Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 12:14 PM
Subject: Two
> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6 100
> amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>
> Second.. Where is a good cheap place to get a 400 amp controller..
> Not having seen one before .. Is it like a light dimming switch that you
> turn when you want more power??
>
> Thanks Mitchell
>
>
>
Date: 11 Jun 2007 20:27:31 -0000
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: EV@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: TdS Report #6: Results of the Competitions
TdS Report #6: Results of the Competitions
I know, I know. It's kind of dumb to present the results before you know
anything about the entrants, but that's how it's going to be this year. I'm up
to my eyebrows, so narrative structure be damned.
The results are presented in this HTML page:
http://www.autoauditorium.com/21CAC_Reports_2007/21CAC-2007-AltFuelScore-FINAL.html
and this PDF file:
http://www.autoauditorium.com/21CAC_Reports_2007/21CAC-2007-AltFuelScore-FINAL.pdf
or
Stay tuned for photos of and interviews with the teams.
- - - -
The 2007 TdS Reports are actually about the "21st Century Automotive
Challenge" hosted by the The Eastern Electric Vehicle Club (EEVC).
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2007 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2007
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2007 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the "21st Century Automotive Challenge", see the web page at
http://www.EEVC.info
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Two
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 15:28:03 -0500
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If you look at just about any switch, I believe they have two current
ratings on them, one for AC and one for DC. I believe it's because it's
much harder to keep DC from arcing across the contacts as they open. The
arc tends to extinguish when switching AC because the voltage across the
contacts passes through zero 120 times per second, at which time the arc
tends to extinguish. That's why all these DC contactors are big, have big
gaps between the contacts, and cost so much.
Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phelps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:08 PM
Subject: Re: Two
> Or should I say volts or amps
>
> Watts law volts times amps is watts
>
> Mitchell
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Brandon Kruger
> Date: 6/11/2007 3:56:54 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: Two
>
> I thought AC and DC circuit breakers worked differently. A 100amp
> House circuit breaker may not work well in your EV.
>
>
> Brandon Kruger
> http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/
> http://cafepress.com/altfuel
>
> On 6/11/07, Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Have you thought about using 100 amp house circuit breakers?
>> In a electrical box
>>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> ----------------------
>>
>>
>> Hey,
>> Being that I am inexperenced but maybe with enough knowledge to finally
>> answer a question more on my level...
>>
>> You can use switches to switch in batteries. They are called contactors
> when
>> used for such high amps. Similar to relays but heavier duty. You should
>> arrange and wire the batteries in a series/ parallel arrangement so that
>> theyare all discharging at 24, 48 and 96 volts, or whatever voltage you
> want
>> Older controllers were called contactor controllers. They mechanically
>> switched voltages, I imaging kinda like shifting gears. There is
> information
>> on the EVDL pertaining to their construction. I could send you past posts
>> Ive saved. I plan to make a controller using a Parallax microcontroller.
>> Programmed to energize different contactors remotely placed at the
> batterry
>> pack depending on the position of my throttle potentiometer. (anyone with
>> suggestions on this im open to suggestions).
>>
>> I think a cheap controller can be had from a junked golf cart? Some club
>> cars have a pretty decent sized controller and maybe you can get it
>> cheap.
>
>> Otherwise I think you are gonna spend atleast 500 dollars.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>> Paul
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phelps
>> Sent: Mon 6/11/2007 2:28 PM
>> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>> Subject: Two
>>
>>
>>
>> Two simple questios..first..why use a controller.. Why not just 4 or 6
>> 100
>
>> Amp switches that add one more battery with every flick??
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 14:48:03 -0500
From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Corded mower
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Hey don't knock the Robomower. Small, 24v system, slow, but it's
automatic and mows all by itself. Neat toy and one of the few tech toys
with real-world practical value.
Danny
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Having used some of the push-type electrics, I'd assume you'd want to use
>a large guage wire for a rider w/ a 200' distance. Maybe you could install
>a couple more plugs around the yard?
>
>
>
>>I have some ideas to deal with the cord. I was thinking about using one
>>of those cord reel setups. We'll have to see how it holds up reeling under
>> load. Or maybe a coiled cord affair with a mast on the mower and
>>elevated attach point on the house. The farthest point is around 200'+
>>from the plug.
>>
>>I have almost an acre under grass and It will get kind of dicey out on
>>the edge where about a 1/3 acre chunk has a dozen trees on it.
>>
>>The main question that I have is: The current ICE motor on it is a 19HP
>>Briggs. What HP electric motor do I need to replace that?
>>
>>David
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 21:40:12 +0100
From: Thomas Ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Safety of inverter/controller or whole system?
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could the power to the normally closed contactor also be delivered
through a fuse which shorts in the event of motor runaway or other such
fault?
Phil,
when you say cheap contactor do you mean ev200 cheap or potter and
brumfield 240V AC cheap or GE 48V contactor off ebay cheap ?
(-Phil-) wrote:
>
>
> A simple (but not cheap) backup DC safety measure would be to put a
> normally closed contactor across the motor. If the power is
> interrupted then the contactor closes and shorts the motor. The power
> to this contactor would be maintained by a separate safety monitor
> microcontroller acting as a watchdog. In the event of a fault, it
> opens the main contactor, and drops power to the motor shunt
> contactor. After the aforementioned 2 faults on my little EV during
> controller testing, this is basically what I did. (I used a SPDT
> relay that cut power and shorted the motor) The contacts on such a
> device may not enjoy ever being used, but it would add no resistance
> or loss if there was no fault. You could also use a cheap contactor
> w/o arc suppression.
Subject: Re: Chevy motor adapters
From: Steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 14:35:55 -0600
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On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 08:23 -0700, Electric Vehicle Discussion List
wrote:
> Why would you want a racing flywheel? Just get a stock
> flywheel for a 1 piece rear main seal chevy.
Two reasons:
to deal with the external/internal balance issue: there probably are
no stock, neutral balance/3" hub flywheels. The research we have done
so far says no such combination came from the factory. They are
available from the racing community because of the MANY engines that
are built up with parts from various sources.
its aluminum, much lighter, hence more energy efficient. One paper I
read on the subject claims an aluminum flywheel makes the car "look"
300+ lbs lighter. rotational mass is much more costly than static
weight.
> Those flywheels are guaranteed not to fly apart at 8,000 or
> 9,000 rpm. For he RPM the electric motor is turning (5500 rpm
> max) a stock flywheel is perfectly fine.
But the AC motor I will be using revs to 9000-10000 RPM.
> You can shave off the ring gear to cut down on the weight if
> you want.
Another benefit of the above flywheel, being aluminum, the ring gear is
steel, bolted (+ safety weld) on to the flywheel proper. It is a
do-it-yourself operation to remove. It will want dynamic balancing
after removal, but given the other custom parts used, dynamically
balancing the motor/hub/flywheel would be a good thing anyway.
---
Steve
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To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
From: Tom Gocze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Doers vs talkers, was Otmar is getting rich?
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 17:01:05 -0400
Just a quick comment:
Last I checked this is a capitalist system, Otmar can sell his
product for whatever he thinks it is worth and whatever we want to
pay. The marketplace is a wonderful filter.
I applaud your idea to make a better cheaper controller, so buy a
Zilla or a Curtis, open it up and copy what you like and make a
better one.
Once you do that, everyone will love you and you will be happy.
In the meantime, you need to realize that people need to feed their
families, make a product that works, pay their employees, warranty
their product and pay rent and taxes AND Liability Insurance
([EMAIL PROTECTED],000A would scare any insurance man worth his salt!!).
It is slightly different than a creative economy job like graphic
design. Perhaps before starting to produce this new thing, a few
business courses might be warranted.
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: full size truck conversion
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 15:06:01 -0600
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You should not have any problems running a 6000 lb vehicle if have the low
end gear ratios. My vehicle at one time weigh 7850 lbs which included 3400
lbs of 300 AH cobalt 180 volt battery pack.
The overall gear ratio in 1st gear was 19.5:1 to keep the motor ampere below
200 amps and battery ampere at about 50 amps.
The final ratio which is the same as the axle ratio is a 5.57:1 which was
use only after 45 mph.
I have reduce the battery pack weight so the EV weighs about 6800 lbs. I am
using a Warp 9 motor, while my GE 11 is in maintenance. At any speed up to
50 mph, I can keep the motor ampere at or below 200 amps with the Warp 9.
The GE-11 can maintain a continuous motor ampere of 175 amps at 60 mph in
the 5.57:1 overall ratio.
As time go's on, battery weight will come down. My next pack will drop me
another 1160 lbs to 5690 lbs which was about the original weight of the
vehicle.
Roland
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of S. Love
> Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 15:19
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: full size truck conversion
>
>
>
> anyone ever actually complete the conversion on a full size truck?
> I know there were a couple in the making, but have never seen one
> actually completed.
> what were the results?
>
> Any tips or pointers to convert a fullsize dodge 2500 4X4?
>
> I know, I know, the 4X4 is not the best for a conversion, but I
> regularly drive through the dirt on jobsites, and the clearace (and 4X4)
> is really handy.
>
> I know it will carry the battery weight without a problem, when I got
> the truck, the only thing the bed was used for is signage, they are big
> sheets of plastic, and sometimes wood, they are big, but they are not
> heavy.
>
> I was thinking of losing the engine, and transmission, and bolting the
> electric motor directly to the transfer case..
> the motorbay and under the bed will all be reserved for batteries.
>
> 3 or maybe 4 banks 144v each? or more? is this plausable? when one is
> low, switch to the other and then the other? I am concerned about the
> additional weight of the batteries actually subtracting from the
> distance achieveable.
> I know each bank will end up weighing like 800 pounds, which is not much
> in the grand scheme of things, but 800X3=2,400 pounds. and 800X4=3,200
> pounds.
> and that is alot.. (the current motor and transmission weigh about 1,600
> and also subtracting the cooling systems, and exhaust, and fuel tank,
> pumps, etc, I think I can get it to a little over breakeven, but I know
> lighter is better for an EV)
>
> any help is appreciated
>
> thank
>
>
Subject: Re: Chevy motor adapter
From: Steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Content-Type: text/plain
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 15:06:42 -0600
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On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 09:53 -0700, Electric Vehicle Discussion List
wrote:
> I can tell you for a fact that the new bolt pattern 1 piece
> rear main
> seal 350 flywheel IS neutral balanced.
Not according to General Motors:
http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/performance_parts/store/catalog/Category.jhtmlCATID=883.html
quote >
SEAL DEAL
Production small-block V8 and V6/90-degree Chevrolet crankshafts were
redesigned in 1986 to use a leak-resistant one-piece rear seal. The
diameter of the crankshaft flywheel flange was reduced to fit this new
seal. The engine block, oil pan, pan gaskets, and flywheel were also
redesigned to accommodate this one-piece seal.
Crankshafts designed for one-piece seals have a smaller flywheel bolt
pattern than pre-1986 production cranks. All small-block and
V6/90-degree cranks which use a one-piece seal require a counterweighted
flywheel for proper engine balance.
< endquote
---
Steve
--- End Message ---
