-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 01/02/2008 08:51 AM: > Well, feedback loops begin and end too, and that displays an even > greater 'inefficiency' for causation... Just plane old bloody gaps. > The rub is that systems of loops originate for no efficient cause. > That's why I turned the sci method around to warch them since it's > clear we can't explain them.
I disagree. First, to say that feedback loops begin and end is an _assumption_ of a discrete ontology. I.e. feedback loops may not have a beginning or an end, they may merely be bounded. Second, most of what people seem to point at when they use the phrase "feedback loop" is an aggregation of phenomena caused by an aggregate set of mechanisms. Hence, even if the ontology is discrete or discretizable, we may not be able to discuss them in the same language (attributes, properties, predicates, operators, etc.) we use to discuss the phenomena and mechanisms of which they're composed. And further, not only may we need a different language, they may not even give rise to the same categorization of actual behaviors. I.e. the components can be very different from the composition. To conflate the two is to commit the fallacy of composition/division. And third, we might posit that "feedback loop" is _merely_ an ascription having nothing to do with the ontology and _everything_ to do with our psychology. I.e. "feedback loops" may not actually exist except as a convenient lexical structure we use to describe the world. In the first case, we can't make the logical leap to say that feedback loops have no efficient cause. In the second case, the cause of the loops is _complex_... and we've had that discussion recently. And in the third case, feedback loops do have an efficient cause... _us_. [grin] I'm not saying that any of these are true; but they are certainly defensible positions... as defensible as the assertion that the loops have no efficient cause. - -- glen e. p. ropella, 971-219-3846, http://tempusdictum.com When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators. -- P.J. O'Rourke -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHe+JXZeB+vOTnLkoRAhrvAKCNlM31w5lG4mLCJdQh6+8KxMAvggCdFb8r v9bMfdkZPoDUCrJTxolKpWs= =Ji8l -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
