Dan, have you ever listened to developer commentary in any video game that was ever made? Time and time again, developers need to create "hints" to point players in the right direction. Ever played Portal? Do you remember how in the earlier levels that teach you how to "fling", the spot on the wall where you're supposed to place a portal is on a protruding panel?
That was an intentional design decision from the developers to draw the player's attention. It's no different in menu UIs. The fact that the Quickplay button is so much larger and more prominent than the Servers button is no accident. Many players don't want to mess around in menus, they just want to play the game. They'll just accept the Quickplay defaults and join a Valve server, even if they would have a better experience in a community server. Your umbrella analogy is terrible. The differences between Valve servers and community servers go beyond an aesthetic change like color. The performance on Valve servers regularly suffers. Cheaters and griefers swarm to Valve servers for their lack of moderation and sub-par votekick system. To improve on your umbrella analogy, Valve servers are like umbrellas that melt after being exposed to water for 10 minutes. The umbrellas that I'm selling don't melt. We're selling our umbrellas for the same price, but the owner of the shop that's selling the umbrellas has decided to stock Valve umbrellas on the shelves exclusively. There's a small sign on the wall that says that more umbrellas are available in the back room, but most people don't see it. They just grab a Valve umbrella and buy it, despite the fact that they could get a better-quality umbrella for the same price. We want the shop owner to stock all umbrellas on the shelves, not just their sub-par umbrellas. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 5:51 AM, dan <needa...@ntlworld.com> wrote: > On 27/08/2014 16:21, Ilya Larin wrote: > >> dan, you don`t get the point of this discussion. While old bad servers are >> full of players, new good servers can`t get players not because they are >> bad, but because players don`t want to open server browser and look for a >> good server. >> > > This wasn't Frank's argument. Frank is upset because he thinks Valve owe > him something. > > It wasn't really about quickplay - it was about him wanting valve to get > rid of their servers. > > He believes he's responsible for some kind of success or existence of TF2. > It's a level > of narcissism and egomania often witnessed in beta testers and, it seems, > some server owners. > > He believes that others servers, Valve's in particular, should be removed > so that people > join his server. Which, he very humbly and modestly suggests is better > than theirs. > > At best I think Valve should recognise the social responsibility they have > for creating Frank's > issues and offer the resources to help him recover. Either that or they > should pay for a 10' statue > of him with the Latin inscription "Frank TF2um Rex" and place it in > Valve's foyer so the > TF2 team can all gaze in awe and wonder and kiss its feet on the way into > work each morning :D > > The argument presented is that people cannot join a server. These > arguments have been typed in before. This time may well not have > explicitly said "We think players are too dumb to join a server or change > a default" - but, from the past, less guarded arguments, it's what a few > seem to believe to be true. > > Certainly there is no valid alternative reason given. > > Besides, all other arguments like "people aren't changing the defaults" > "People > don't use the server browser" etc, are just tough. If people > are playing on official servers and not yours and you recognise that they > are intelligent enough to make a choice, then it's tough isn't it? > > Conversely if your argument requires people to be too ignorant to join > a server then it's equally fallacious. > > Either way, there's no valid argument. If anyone > wants to join your server they can. > > The next argument used is usually that the game is dying - and > in quickplay terms it goes something like, "players will eventually > hate TF2 because Valve's servers don't have adverts on them or > some other plugin, but they are too ignorant, dumb or lazy to find an > alternative, > so they just stop playing the game never finding or realising how great > the game is if you > play on a different server" > > This argument is nonsense of course. Proven simply by the fact that > this announcement of the imminent death of TF2 at Valve's hands, has come > and gone > multiple times. > > But really this discussion was about someone saying "Valve, get rid of > your servers" > not about quickplay. We've seen all the quickplay arguments, indeed > valve added a bunch of options to let them connect to their servers > and now they are upset about what the defaults are. They really have such > a low opinion of people that they don't even think > gamers have the nous to make a decision about a checkbox. > > The odd thing is, when a niche group of self-serving and self-interested > people get > together they often delude themselves that their collective self-serving > and self-interested opinions form some kind of consensus. They often > wonder, on this very group, > since they all agree on stuff why doesn't Valve change it? > > But, you know, the main thing that makes a server good or bad is the > people that play on it. Beyond a few, small, technical issues that are > largely either right or not, and which you cannot really use > to differentiate yourself from any other server. > > You have to work to get people on a server. It's been said before but a > server that gets its players via > quickplay is not a "community" - if you want a "community" - as ridiculous > as that notion is, > you have to build and create it. The conflict here in the past has been > where server > owners have decided that quickplay players owe them something because it's > their server. Whether that's donations, watching adverts, obeying silly > rules etc. > > Valve, quite rightly realise that someone clicking "quickplay" isn't > interested in your > server or anyone's server. They aren't interested in anyone's community or > anyone's bank balance. > Hence they had to add or remove a bunch of stuff to stop server owners > ruining players experience by exploiting > them. Then they cry "Whaa whaa, we can't make money, it's not fair" - and > a few get upset > because features are disappearing. Usually features that don't really > matter. That's a disease > Valve staffers suffer from just as much as plugin writers. Whoever thinks > adding browsers or music players > into game clients matters really needs to be given a difficult programming > problem to challenge them a bit. > > If you want a community. Build a community. Put the work in. And then > exploit that community that > you built yourself if you must. But, if Valve was sending hundreds of > people to your server for a while > via quickplay that wasn't you "building a community" > > If you got quickplay players then you'd built nothing. If your players > left > when vanilla servers starting appearing, perhaps they had a point. Reality > trumps self delusion. You can argue on this board all you like but won't > argue > or debate people into playing on your server. No more than > a game developer can argue with the people that they are wrong that > his game sucks. If people aren't buying it then he needs to learn. > > If your server is empty then you're doing something wrong. No matter how > much > your friends, your ego or other server owners tell you that you are right. > > No matter if you think your server is better or that this configuration > you have or map it's running is great etc etc. > No matter how dumb or disinterested you think the player base is. They are > giving you the most obvious feedback > that you need to listen to. > > If you were selling red umbrellas how long would you stand and argue in > the street > with people carrying black ones that they are wrong? Eventually you'd > accept that > people are buying black umbrellas I'm sure. Or maybe you'd try blue ones. > Or try selling something else. Saying "Stop selling black umbrellas so > that people have to buy my red ones" is not going to happen. > > Lastly, the truth is, much of time there are more servers than players. > The TF2 world probably didn't need a new server. > > > -- > Dan. > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
