Linux-Advocacy Digest #241, Volume #30 Tue, 14 Nov 00 22:13:03 EST
Contents:
Re: Uptime -- where is NT? (Giuliano Colla)
Re: The Sixth Sense ("Bruce Schuck")
Re: OS stability (sfcybear)
Re: NT/2000 true multiuser? ("Evan DiBiase")
Re: Uptime -- where is NT? (.)
Re: Linux Is Lame. Sorry but it is true (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: The Sixth Sense (Giuliano Colla)
Re: Mandrake, thoughts? Opinions? (The Ghost In The Machine)
Norton Linux (Bradley J. Milton)
Re: Same old Linux..Nothing new here... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: NT/2000 true multiuser? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Of course, there is a down side... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Of course, there is a down side... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Postscript page layout: Quicken import ("[EMAIL PROTECTED]")
Re: OT: Could someone explain C++ phobia in Linux? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Debian Sells Stale Beef ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: OT: Could someone explain C++ phobia in Linux? (Russ Lyttle)
Re: NT/2000 true multiuser? (The Ghost In The Machine)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Giuliano Colla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Uptime -- where is NT?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 00:37:05 GMT
Marty wrote:
>
> Jacques Guy wrote:
> >
> > Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >
> > > http://uptime.netcraft.com/hammer/accuracy.html#whichos
> >
> > > "Additionally, NT4 uptimes cycle back to zero after 49.7 days, and give
> > > timestamps exactly as if the machine had been rebooted at this precise
> > > point"
> >
> > Not to worry, only a clerical mistake. Should be 29.52 days, a lunar
> > month, but they got pi wrong: 4.1316 instead of 3.1416 (approx), hence
> > the 49.7 days. Hey, everyone can make mistakes! (How did they get a
> > 49.7-day lunar month from pi = 4.1316? Search me. Probably another
> > clerical mistake. Or two. Or three. Don't worry. A service pack will fix
> > it in the more or less distant future, if you live that long)
>
> Here's where 49.7 comes from:
>
> Largest unsigned 32-bit integer = 4294967296
>
> The uptime counter is an unsigned long integer measuring the
> milliseconds of uptime.
>
> So 4294967296 milliseconds is 4294967.296 seconds.
>
> 4294967.296 / (60 seconds/minute * 60 minutes/hour * 24 hours/day)
> = 49.7 days
Doesn't tell something the idea of counting uptime in milliseconds?
For win 9x I'd suggest microseconds as a suitable unit.
------------------------------
From: "Bruce Schuck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Sixth Sense
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 16:41:21 -0800
"Giuliano Colla" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Bruce Schuck wrote:
> > >
> > > Well, MS underwent a big effort to undermine this joke,
> > > blackmailing OEM's and playing other nasty tricks.
> > > Can you tell why?
> >
> > Microsft gave away IE because Netscape gave their product away for free
you
> > twit.
>
> Sorry, it's the other way around. Period.
Nope. Netscape was always free to use.
http://home.netscape.com/newsref/pr/newsrelease8.html
"Netscape Navigator 1.0 is available for free downloading on the Internet
for academic and non-profit use, as well as for free evaluation purposes."
------------------------------
From: sfcybear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: OS stability
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 00:28:12 GMT
Yeah, people who do not like to look at the truth. Hey if you get thank
yous from the likes of chad. drestin, and fun... And and get some sort
of satisfaction from it, you must have a sorry life!
But the fact remains. Now 2 sources show PRODUCTION W2K servers to be
less stable than Unix! Yeah, say I'm behaving badly for lininking to
data you do not like! That is YOUR problem! The data is there, if you
don't like it don't blaim me, complain to MS they are the ones that
wrote the unstable stuff!
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi) wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 00:09:38 -0600, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >"sfcybear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:8uqcdh$448$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> >Kind of makes all that effort worthwhile when you get thanks like
this, Eh
> >Donnovan?
>
> Actually, I get a lot of thank-you letters in my email box. Certainly
more
> than I ever expected.
>
> As for "Mr. Bear", well, some people (and especially some people on
usenet)
> just enjoy shouting at others, so I'm not taking it personally ;-)
>
> --
> Donovan
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: "Evan DiBiase" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: NT/2000 true multiuser?
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:42:02 +0500
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "The Great Suprendo"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> My point is - is it a cripple if the functionality is rarely, if ever
> going to be used in the first place ?
Yes.
If I blow your legs off, you're still crippled, even if you were rarely,
if ever, going to use those legs again.
-Evan
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: . <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Uptime -- where is NT?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:48:23 +1300
> If that's what he meant then he is wrong on all 4 counts. I think he meant
> that these OS's weren't listed at the URL cited by Bob in the first article in
> this thread.
If that was what he meant, then I admit I misunderstood his post.
In the context, it did sound as if he was claiming all four OS's didn't
report an uptime...
Anyway, my apologies Erik for misunderstanding you... but it amused me
all the same ;).
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Linux Is Lame. Sorry but it is true
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 00:51:02 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sun, 12 Nov 2000 02:55:46 -0500
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Les Mikesell wrote:
>>
>> "chrisv" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> >
>> > >Is this crap being machine generated now? The plot never changes, its
>> > >like a travelling roadshow of a horrendous off-Broadway flop.
>> >
>> > That's because this same kind of thing has happened to so many of us.
>> > Get it?
>>
>> Us? Do you have multiple personalities too? How many of you are
>> there?
>
>Inquiring psychologists want to know!
Do they charge by the body, or the personality? :-)
[.sigsnip]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,alt.linux.sucks
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:26:04 +0200
"The Ghost In The Machine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote
> on Mon, 6 Nov 2000 11:11:35 +1300
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >> No waiting for the WSIWYG to catch up, no bugs because you're using the
> >> newest version of Word.
> >
> >News flash! Microsoft today released a new version of word. All
> >4876835582 bugs from previous versions are now considered fixed.
>
> Wait, Word has bugs? I thought Microsoft never had bugs.... :-)
MS doesn't have any bugs!
It has spiders.
------------------------------
From: Giuliano Colla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Sixth Sense
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:07:58 GMT
Bruce Schuck wrote:
>
> "Giuliano Colla" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Bruce Schuck wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Well, MS underwent a big effort to undermine this joke,
> > > > blackmailing OEM's and playing other nasty tricks.
> > > > Can you tell why?
> > >
> > > Microsft gave away IE because Netscape gave their product away for free
> you
> > > twit.
> >
> > Sorry, it's the other way around. Period.
>
> Nope. Netscape was always free to use.
>
> http://home.netscape.com/newsref/pr/newsrelease8.html
>
> "Netscape Navigator 1.0 is available for free downloading on the Internet
> for academic and non-profit use, as well as for free evaluation purposes."
You quote the very first release of december 5 1994.
But if you look at:
http://home.netscape.com/newsref/pr/newsrelease64.html
You'll read:
MOUNTAIN VIEW, Calif. (November 21, 1995) --
[...]
Netscape has partnered with Ventana Communications Group to deliver
Netscape Navigator Personal Edition into the retail channel. Netscape
Navigator Personal Edition is available through all major computer
retail outlets, including Best Buy, CompUSA, Computer City, Egghead
Software, Media Play, Software Etc., Staples and others. Netscape
Navigator Personal Edition has an estimated street price of $39.95,
which includes a 90-day warranty and customer support.
[...]
You can see that Netscape has not been ALWAYS free.
A browser had a market price, when MS decided to give away IE.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Mandrake, thoughts? Opinions?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:09:03 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Tue, 14 Nov 2000 03:17:21 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Running Linux is a riot for me. It's really one of the funniest things
>on the planet. Much cheaper then going to a comedy club and listening
>to stale jokes all night.
>
>Linux is one of the biggest farces ever fostered on the public. It is
>quite funny.
>
>Combine it with reading this group and my sides are aching from
>laughing so much.
>
>Sure as hell beats the comedy channel.
Personally, I happen to like "Who's Line Is It Anyway?"
with Clive Anderson. I could even see a doctor
recommending it for respiratory therapy (laughing tends to
get the gunk out of one's lungs). But to each his own. :-)
As for Linux being funny -- I think NT is funny, too.
Not funny as in hilarious, but funny as in absolutely strange.
But it does work, so I can't criticize it too roundly.
Linux just works better for me. For you, maybe not.
As for being "foisted" ... Linux wasn't foisted by anyone,
except maybe Linus -- and it probably would have died a quiet death
had it not shown such potential back in 1991. After all,
it's not like one had to buy it from SLS...
[rest snipped]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: Bradley J. Milton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Norton Linux
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:05:01 GMT
I tried out Midnight Commander (type: mc ) and like it. It reminds me
of DOS days before Windoze, and I was wondering if there was a package
like Norton available for Linux. I have been trying e2fsck too, and
would like to have something that checks my drives, analyzes my
hardware and partitions, and makes sure my system is running o.k. It
would be nice to have both CLI and screens like mc with ASCII (ANSI?)
graphics. A dancing "wizard" might help setup immensely.
Come to think of it, there is no technological reason to my knowledge
why it couldn't analyze your files in the same way. Wouldn't it be nice
to have a program that checks your w.p. docs, to make sure your thoughts
were healthy and mentally o.k.?
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Same old Linux..Nothing new here...
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:38:11 GMT
So how about addressing the original topic was "same old Linux". How
come the same problems keep coming up over and over again despite
Linux versions changing faster than Windows?
If you look back a year or more ago you will see the exact same
questions being asked in the Linux groups and they are not fundamental
questions that may or may not just be difficult concepts, like fdisk
(Windows or Linux) or CDROM mounting or permissions. They are basic
install and operating problems like :
1. Why doesn't my modem (scanner, printer, wheelmouse, video, audio
etc) work with Linux?
2. How come PPP is always timing out?
3. Why can't I connect to my isp?
And so forth.
Why does that guy whose plight I posted have to go through all of that
crap to get his mouse to work? And for those of you who made it work
why not give him some help. Why doesn't a Token Ring card work in my
IBM Laptop?
Why is everything seem like such a pita running Linux?
It's the same old Linux from an end users point of view.
claire
On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:23:39 -0500, Gary Hallock
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>> Spoken like a true geek.
>>
>
>???? If your going to call me a geek at least refer to something geeky.
>Calling you a child is not geeky.
>
>Gary
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: NT/2000 true multiuser?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:39:29 GMT
They still are, punched cards that is, take a look at Palm Beach
Florida for details.
Looks like a great opportunity for Linux.
claire
On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:28:38 +0000, The Great Suprendo
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>A certain Pete Goodwin, of comp.os.linux.advocacy "fame", writes :
>>Running a word processor remotely was routine back in Digital several years
>>ago.
>
>Punch cards were probably routine there at one point as well. What sort
>of routine are you talking of ?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Of course, there is a down side...
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:40:47 GMT
On 14 Nov 2000 12:49:22 -0600, "Hoot Owl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>AND, even if a divine miracle occured (or you soldered the cmos battery to
>something else for some unknown reason) ... um, change the $1.19 battery? I
>really can't believe how broke linux users are... sad...
The Linonuts are not broke, they are just cheap.
claire
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Of course, there is a down side...
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:42:04 GMT
First you have to figure out how to make wine work.
claire
On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 19:18:27 -0500, Gary Hallock
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Ayende Rahien wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> If I want a quick & dirty text editor, notepad is my choice.
>
>Not on Linux. So why bother with running notepad under wine?
>
>>
>> And in case you didn't notice, notepad is a windows tool.
>> It's apperantly very complex one, WINE hasn't been able to make it word
>> correctly.
>
>Wrong. I just tried notepad under wine and it works fine. Have you?
>
>Gary
------------------------------
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Postscript page layout: Quicken import
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 20:53:16 -0600
Can anyone tell me if there is a portfolio management program that will
import Quicken/Windows98 files? The application must allow quote
downloads. This is all that I really require in order to get Windows off
my machine. (I will refrain from a diatribe against this "operating
system"). I am currently running Mandrake 7.1. I am new to Linux. I am
also desperately looking for page layout software. I used Quark on a Mac
for several years and would like Postscript type 1 fonts for
imagesetting and the ability to place fonts in and out of ram on the
fly, as on the Mac. I would like to place TrueType 'fonts' (word used
loosely) aside and not have them mixed with Type 1 s. Is this possible
in Linux, or should I be thinking about the purchase of another Mac?
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Dennis Smith
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: OT: Could someone explain C++ phobia in Linux?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:47:20 GMT
Not every programmer is an applications programmer. I took the classes,
I bought the books, but I just haven't had a project yet where C++ seems
to offer any advantages over ANSI C for the type of work I do.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Debian Sells Stale Beef
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 01:52:02 GMT
Got stale beef? Then go get "potato" and you can have stew!
(somebody had to do it)
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: Russ Lyttle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: OT: Could someone explain C++ phobia in Linux?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 02:05:28 GMT
mlw wrote:
>
> I use Linux all the time, I think it is a great system. I maintain a
> Windows box, but it is never used except as a TV or for Lego Mindstorms
> for my son. At work, I am fortunate in that I can use Linux.
>
> The one problem I have with many of Open Source people is this sort of
> emotional dislike for C++.
>
> I use C++ all the time, I can't even understand why someone would start
> a non-trivial project using C. C++ is a superset of C. Most C code will
> compile fine with C++, the exceptions being borderline constructs which
> are probably bad form anyway.
>
> This is not a troll! I am being serious and sincere. I am a software
> engineer / architect professionally, and I have had to argue this point
> many times with some of guys we hire. It is my role to make sure the
> right decisions are made.
>
> Under what circumstances is "C" a better choice than "C++?"
> (excluding backward compatibility in an existing product)
>
> --
> http://www.mohawksoft.com
Easy. It isn't an emotional dislike. C++ just isn't suitable for the
job. C++ is slower than C by an order of magnitude (almost as slow as
Java). It is difficult to manage any sizable project in C++. Multiple
inheritance and friend functions are just two reasons. C++ is almost
impossible to maintain. C++ has all the weakness of C and none of its
advantages. I can think of any number of alternatives to both C and C++.
But C does have the history behind it.
--
Russ Lyttle, PE
<http://www.flash.net/~lyttlec>
Not Powered by ActiveX
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: NT/2000 true multiuser?
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 02:13:35 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sun, 12 Nov 2000 03:00:00 -0500
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>>
>> "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Is Windows NT/2000 a true multiuser environment?
>> >
>> > No.
>> >
>> > > My impression is that it is not. Comments?
>> >
>> > Claims that any Microsoft product is multi-user are pure fictions
>> > invented by M$'s marketing department.
>>
>> That would be like your statement here. It should be quite easy to prove
>> your statement. What multiuser features are missing?
>
>Two or more simultaneous users,, each with their own PRIVATE data space,
>both in memory, and on disk, each user having their own UNIQUE user
>id, which is persistent from login to login.
C:\WinNT\Profiles\user_name\Desktop
Unless Win2k moved it, it's probably in the same
place as it was on Win NT 4. And it is persistent, as well.
There are also other profiles -- "Default User", for example.
Presumably, this is under Administrative control.
As for private memory areas -- AFAIK, Win32 has always had this on NT.
[.sigsnip]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
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