+1 to Carlos and Ana. I had the same trouble to selling the OPW and to renew the partnership. So far I am without partnership and the only change has been that I have USD $ 3,000 more in my pocket. But need renew soon because i need sell some OPW for some customers who want migration service to V8.
So I think that the OPW has high value for migration, but has little impact on other services offered . Maybe OpenERP SA may rethink this product to get more revenue. About PULL strategy , I think it's good for OpenERP SA , considering that currently sells services directly to end customers . Last December a client who was trading with me, received an email with a quote from OpenERP SA with a lower price, of course the client is upset with me because he thought I was cheating. So I think PULL strategy is good for OpenERP SA. Finally, I think this is a good first step to listening to customers from OpenERP SA (partners , end customers and community). Regards P. D. All issues raised here were discussed with OpenERP SA before the end of my partnership and unfortunately they did not listen. 2014-02-16 19:26 GMT-05:00 Ana Juaristi <ajuaris...@gmail.com>: > Carlos.... +1 to everything you are explaining in a so clear way. > About: > > *The services you offer to partners are somewhat rigid in some cases. I > would love to sell an Enterprise contract with every OpenERP > implementation. But this is not possible. The OPW is not made for > end-users, us partners we have to take part in the process.* > Just an example: > As partner wanting to pivote or at less make compatible my actual > bussiness model with this new app aproach, asked to OpenERP sales people > about possibility of taking 10 users on Saas in advance for reselling but, > using them on several customers (lets say 5 different customers single user > and 1 single customer with 5 users for example) that would be 6 different > DBs... They say in that case, I would not benefit any discount of final > price but if I sell 10 users to a single customer I benefit 50% of final > price. It has nosense I think. One 10 users customer is not going to take a > SAAS aproach or at less it would be very difficult to sell. > On the other side, I say... ok so I give you the single user customer and > you invoice yourself to him... Answer: could be, but in that case that > customer is not count as part of your partnership level, better if you > invoice to him. So, you are asking to me to take care of a customer that > I'm not taking any benefit or trying to sell more users that they need > (complex both cases... ) so yourself are cutting our wings to fly and yours > to grow up. > > That's only an example (I could give you 3-4 more) where you are NOT > considering your partners channel as your customers. If people wants to > make bussiness with you, you can not close the door. Whatever they are > offering you should at less consider it for opening new win-win ways. Even > if at the end you decide not to go that direction because is not strategic, > valuable for you, at less you should consider all proposals. You always say > that we must benefit of bussiness you are offering to partners but it's not > like that. Partners should give you benefit without having to force them to > sale or something, simply because you are offering so good services that > they are wanting to buy them to you. By now, services offered to partners > is only discounts on services offered to final customers. That aproach is > wrong, because final customers are much more close to partner than to you > (unless he is your own final customer). It's much more easy for partners > selling their own services to final customers thant trying to sell yours > only for discounts and small amounts of not visible valuable services (even > if they are valuable, don't misunderstand please). > > I have discused this point with Nhomar several times. He can not > understand that we and most of partners I know can not sell OPW to > customers. I'm trying from begining. I never succed. Why? Maybe because I > don't know selling it (could be so training needed) or because customer > consider your company far-far away... He only wants system working and for > him we are first point of solution. They understand nothing about launchpad > or reporting bugs or creating patches and for sure they don't mind if bug > is from core or localization or custom module. He needs global support and > it can not be offered (by the moment) directly from you. For them, it > doesn't matter where is or who is OpenERP, S.A they only want a phone > number (my number) to call and solve the problem (inmediatly) > So... IMHO it's needed reviewing the way OpenERP is offering his services > to partner thinking on partner. Not in final customers and discounts for > their services. > > Things that I'm ready to pay for without thinking very much on it: > > - Technical training renewal from version to version > - Good technical doc for each new version. > - Good reference site > - Videos and good training material. > - Specific industries cases of use / success > - Modelizing different industries sectors using OpenERP standar > modules without using custom modules. > - Shared nice real solutions. > - Good qualified leads. I said qualified... :) > > I say again. It's not wanting to fight. It's just telling you several > things that we are missing from begining. > > Thank you very much: > Ana > > > 2014-02-17 Carlos Vásquez <carlos.vasq...@clearcorp.co.cr>: > >> Hi Fabien, >> >> I do like your thoughts about the marketing strategy in general. I agree >> with the communication techniques you propose. >> >> >> *ERP vs. Apps* >> >> As our fellow partners stated, the main discussion point is which image >> we do want to market to our customers. Speaking about the ERP vs. Apps >> approach, I kind of agree with both you and the other partners. We do not >> spend one cent in marketing, we only follow-up sales of people that contact >> us. For now it has been enough to keep us busy and running. Those people >> who contact us are almost always looking for an ERP. We usually have to >> sell an implementation project where other ERP solutions are also >> participating, sometimes there are big ERP solutions (SAP, Dynamics, >> Oracle, etc), and usually there are local ERP solutions. I think dropping >> the ERP solution as a marketing point, would affect us in this market. >> >> But, we have more and more calls from people looking for a cheaper and >> faster solution for their problems. An ERP implementation is not affordable >> nor suitable for their business. We are getting ready to offer OpenERP in a >> way very similar to your SaaS offer. This offer will be ready very soon and >> we already have several customers waiting to test it. Also, we started >> doing fast, out-of-the-box implementations about 3 months ago to gain >> experience for our new "SaaS" offer. It has proven to be very successful. >> These customers are more prone to identify themselves with a solution >> marketed as business apps running together. Here I do understand your point >> and it will help to bring more customers for this line of service. >> >> >> *Open Source* >> >> Also, the first kind of customers are usually more interested in an Open >> Source solution and they often understand its benefits and it can be an >> important sale point for them. The later kind of customers, usually do not >> know about Open Source, and they do not care. They need a good, affordable >> and reliable solution for their needs. Open or closed is the same for them. >> So again, we do have here 2 ways of marketing this because there is in fact >> (as Ana said) 2 targets. >> >> The one thing that help us in the sale process is that our customers can >> easily find us in the partners directory. The new partners page with >> automatic country filter is doing a great job with this. Also the way you >> redirect all kind of leads to us. >> >> >> Maybe it is a good idea to separate the ERP/OpenSource and the >> Apps/Product approach. Is it really necessary to choose only one way? I >> always like simplicity, but in this case, focusing only one target may be >> wrong, it is worth the discussion. >> >> >> *Pull strategy* >> >> There is one more thing I think I can give some valuable feedback. The >> services you offer to partners are somewhat rigid in some cases. I would >> love to sell an Enterprise contract with every OpenERP implementation. But >> this is not possible. The OPW is not made for end-users, us partners we >> have to take part in the process. We have worked out several bugs with the >> support team. Our experience has been varied. Sometimes the person assigned >> to the bug can solve the problem in a reasonable time frame, other times we >> have ended up fixing it ourselves. In all cases we have to spend at least a >> couple of hours in total of our time. If our customer reports a bug, we >> have to test to know where is the problem. If there is something wrong with >> some official code and there is an OPW contract we can send it to your >> team. In most cases, your team needs several replies from us. They usually >> do not do a very good job finding the problem, we have to do some heavy >> testing for them as they keep rejecting the issue of proposing some >> simplistic workaround. For important bugs, we end up spending more than 2 >> hours answering mails and doing remote desktop demo sessions. At the end we >> have to integrate and deploy the solution. I explain all of this because we >> have to charge several hours to our customers on top of an Enterprise >> contract. And we also need to support the localization and customizations. >> The total cost of support gets expensive. Of course your contract also >> includes migration. But if we want to use this service, we also need to >> charge some extra fee to migrate the localization and customizations. This >> is the main reason we do not sell Enterprise contracts very often, and the >> ones we have sold, are not renewing. >> >> For partners which do develop and do heavy customization, I find the >> Enterprise service and its pricing method very rigid. I am worried because >> we could work much better with your team and get you to earn more money, >> which is good for all of us. And for our new "SaaS" offer, I contacted you >> guys to work out something to include support from your team in our cost >> structure, but the only thing you have to offer is the regular Enterprise >> support with the usual "per user" pricing method. This will at least >> duplicate our cost for each user. This is not acceptable, nor is reflecting >> the reality. You know that in this kind of service, the amount of support >> is deluded because everyone is using the same exact code base. So we >> decided to go on our own, without your support. We ran some numbers, and we >> think it will be cheaper to support the platform ourselves, even with the >> migration process. >> >> So as of now, I do not think you have good service offer for us. The >> pricing structure do not work outside Europe of North America. I know and >> appreciate you are making efforts to adapt your prices. It has been a very >> good first step. But it is not enough. You have to differentiate >> configuration only partners, from development ones. We are more than open >> and willing to work with you. So, even if you make a great marketing >> strategy, the pull strategy you propose will not work very well in our >> particular case. I think it is the best way to go, we need to improve who >> does generating partners revenue will create revenue for OpenERP S.A. >> >> >> *Recap* >> >> All of this said. I do appreciate your efforts to involve the community, >> and do think that there are great things we (the partners) can do with you >> (OpenERP S.A.). A marketing investment in marketing will benefit us. And I >> do trust your judgment to integrate internal ideas with community >> suggestions into an excellent marketing strategy. >> >> Regards, >> -- >> Carlos Vásquez >> CTO · Director de Ingeniería >> CLEARCORP S.A. >> >> carlos.vasq...@clearcorp.co.cr >> Cel: +(506) 8351 4484 >> CR: +(506) 4000 CORP (4000 2677) >> US: +1 (786) 472-4267 >> skype: crvasquez >> twitter: cvclearcorp >> >> 300 m. 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