Re: [political-research] Jewish/Gentile Problem: RE: Response To Sean
Testament prophets constantly complained that the Jews would not obey God. Here is an interesting statement of Hoffman on p. 85: The chief trait shared by Gnosticism and Kabbalism is a provenance of conceit and pride, and a sub-rosa tradition of a superman... Hoffman says on p. 87 that The Kabbalah and its votaries exhibit at least the same degree of fanatical hostility toweard non-Jews as does the Talmud...A much revered Kabbalist of the 1500s was Isaac Luria, whose Etz Chaim (tree of life) discusses the olam ha-tohu (realm of confusion - the sub-human non-Jewish world) and olam ha-tikkun (realm of restoration - the paradisaical Zionist empire to come). Zionism comes out of the Talmud and Kabbalah. It looks like the followers of the Talmud and the Kabbalah have taken the promise of God, the real God of the Bible, in a text like Deuteronomy 7: 6, For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. and applied it to themselves. But Deuteronomy 7: 6 and similar texts were meant only for the faithful Israelites, not for the apostates who went off into worship of pagan gods and the Babylonian Talmud. Why did the representatives of apostate Israel, the Pharisees of Christ's time, become so angry with Stephen in Acts 7: 43 that they started to bite him with their teeth? Stephen reminded them of their pagan idols. He said Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them... The star of your god Remphan (Amos 5: 26) is probably either the five pointed or six pointed star. If its the six pointed star, its the national flag of Israel. Bernard Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And a bit more: you are arguing that there is a healing universalist message at the heart of the Old Testament, not just Christianity, which is trans-ethnocentric, correct? -- that the solution lies in the best vision and values of the entire Abrahamic tradition from its origins. I just want to make sure that I am understanding you. I wish I could believe that, but I find some difficulties with this belief. Another point of view: the Old Testament, including God, is a psychological projection of the undermind of its authors -- it's who they are in their fundamental nature, an entangled mixture of the sublime and the monstrous. bernard pyron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On September 14th Sean wrote: Understand Exodus, and you will get the core algorithm driving the process century after century, millennium after millennium. The truth is, the innermost core of the Old Testament cult which has its roots in the Pentateuch requires antisemitism to maintain its cohesion and sense of purpose. Antisemitism would disappear in the world overnight if all parties to this bizarre dialectic simply moved on and gave up ethnocentrism as an organizing principle in human societies. No, Sean, you can't bring light to this complex, difficult and vital issue by blaming Jewish Supremacy on the Old Testament, or any book, chapter or verse in it. This is because you are not starting from points that can be defended or that people who are other than non-Jewish and non-Christian might agree with. A Christian will not agree that Jewish Supremacy necessarily starts from anywhere in the Bible. The Jews have been for many years interpreting the Bible to say they are still God's chosen people, when in fact this can be disputed. I read JUDAISM'S STRANGE GODS, BY MICHAEL A. HOFFMAN a few years ago. There may be quotes from the Jewish Talmud or Kabballah in that book which make more explicit contemporary Jewish interpretations that Jews are still the Chosen People. I suspect that. like the Christian Dispensationalists, the Jewish Rabbis simply ignore all Old and New Testament verses which say something opposed to Jews being the Chosen People. Bernard Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've seen the angry accusation of antisemitism used quite frequently in his posts, but as long he keeps making an effort to address these subjects with at least a few facts and ideas, I am willing to pursue a dialogue. I think I've finally got the antisemitism thing figured out, after pondering a few hundred books by minds which have approached the subject from every conceivable angle. Understand Exodus, and you will get the core algorithm driving the process century after century, millennium after millennium. The truth is, the innermost core of the Old Testament cult which has its roots in the Pentateuch requires antisemitism to maintain its cohesion and sense of purpose. Antisemitism would disappear in the world overnight if all parties to this bizarre dialectic simply moved on and gave up ethnocentrism
Re: [political-research] Jewish/Gentile Problem: Response To Sean
On September 14th Sean wrote: Understand Exodus, and you will get the core algorithm driving the process century after century, millennium after millennium. The truth is, the innermost core of the Old Testament cult which has its roots in the Pentateuch requires antisemitism to maintain its cohesion and sense of purpose. Antisemitism would disappear in the world overnight if all parties to this bizarre dialectic simply moved on and gave up ethnocentrism as an organizing principle in human societies. No, Sean, you can't bring light to this complex, difficult and vital issue by blaming Jewish Supremacy on the Old Testament, or any book, chapter or verse in it. This is because you are not starting from points that can be defended or that people who are other than non-Jewish and non-Christian might agree with. A Christian will not agree that Jewish Supremacy necessarily starts from anywhere in the Bible. The Jews have been for many years interpreting the Bible to say they are still God's chosen people, when in fact this can be disputed. I read JUDAISM'S STRANGE GODS, BY MICHAEL A. HOFFMAN a few years ago. There may be quotes from the Jewish Talmud or Kabballah in that book which make more explicit contemporary Jewish interpretations that Jews are still the Chosen People. I suspect that. like the Christian Dispensationalists, the Jewish Rabbis simply ignore all Old and New Testament verses which say something opposed to Jews being the Chosen People. Bernard Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've seen the angry accusation of antisemitism used quite frequently in his posts, but as long he keeps making an effort to address these subjects with at least a few facts and ideas, I am willing to pursue a dialogue. I think I've finally got the antisemitism thing figured out, after pondering a few hundred books by minds which have approached the subject from every conceivable angle. Understand Exodus, and you will get the core algorithm driving the process century after century, millennium after millennium. The truth is, the innermost core of the Old Testament cult which has its roots in the Pentateuch requires antisemitism to maintain its cohesion and sense of purpose. Antisemitism would disappear in the world overnight if all parties to this bizarre dialectic simply moved on and gave up ethnocentrism as an organizing principle in human societies. But a critical mass of true believers will not let go. As we speak, the world yet again is on track for a huge explosion of antisemitism that will damage everyone. For some folks, Armageddonism is the ultimate drug. They are impervious to reason or even appeals to their own self-interest. LeaNder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: SMcB: Tigerbengalis has expended much more energy in complaining about his ethnic enemies than in taking on and destructing the Israel lobby. I haven't noticed he is complaining about his ethnic enemies. Maybe I read his mails differently. Ethnocentric? Was that your complain? Is my impression wrong that all the disputes basically were triggered by Tim's recent fields of interest? SMcB: I don't see him as being in the same camp as Phil Weiss. Not such a big surprise, is it? Phil is pretty close to you. SMcB: Some of his remarks are even reminiscent of those coming from Jewish extremist groups. He clearly does not belong to the attack poodle crowd. But I have to admit, your argument is much stronger. SMcB: I do think, however, that in his own way he is trying to work his way intellectually through this mess. Yes, that's why he deserves respect. And a mess it definitively is. No man in the wrong can stand up against a fellow that's in the right and keeps a-comin.' Texas Ranger Captain Bill McDonald James 5:1-6 Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud (INCOME TAX), crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth. - Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search.
[political-research] On the Jewish/Gentile Problem ; Jewish Religious Supremacy?
Sean and Others: Jewish supremacy is based upon a religious concept. Without the Jewish claim that they are God's chosen people, their claim to racial superiority over other groups does not hold up. First of all, several texts of the Old Testament say that Israel is God's chosen people. For example, Deuteronomy 7: 6 says to the people of Israel, who were later also called Jews: For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. But that is no the whole story. Exodus 19: 5 says Now therefore if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be a special treasure to Me above all people. That if is very important. The Old Covenant which made Israel a peculiar treasure to God was a conditional covenant and the people of Israel broke it. Isaiah 50: 1 says Thus saith the LORD, Where is the bill of your mother's divorcement, whom I have put away? or which of my creditors is it to whom I have sold you? Behold, for your iniquities have ye sold yourselves, and for your transgressions is your mother put away.: Then, Jeremiah 18: 2-6 says Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words. 3Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he wrought a work on the wheels.4And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.5Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying,6O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as this potter? saith the LORD. Behold, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are ye in mine hand, O house of Israel.7At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it;8If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them.9And at what instant The message here is that there is one lump of clay. God the potter first made physical Israel out of that lump, found it was marred, then as a potter can do, he took the marred vessel off his potter's wheel, re-worked it and put it back on the wheel to create a different vessel which is Israel under the New Covenant. Romans 11: 7-21 explains what happened. But Paul is not easy to follow. He says in verse 7 Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for: but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded. Israel here is physical Israel, what we would call Jews. He goes on in verses 15-22 to say For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead? 16For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.17And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;18Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in. 20Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:21For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.22Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again. Paul is saying that because of unbelief many in physical Israel, the Jews, were cut off of the olive tree and Gentiles were grafted in to replace them. The olive tree is Israel. The lesson of Jeremiah 18 and Romans 11 is that there is only one Israel; it is not physical Israel, the unsaved Jews. Because the dispensationalists took over evangelical Christianity this truth has been largely lost. It is lost politically. The message that Christians are Israel and not those unsaved Jews in the Middle East could become a dangerous message to proclaim though. Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Be specific: what is illogical in the questions I have raised about ethnic nationalism? Is ethnic nationalism good for some groups and bad for others? That point of view appears to be implicit in your posts on this subject. Am I wrong? Ethnic nationalism is good for Israelis, but bad for Europeans and Americans -- isn't this your belief? My argument is easy to understand: either ethnic nationalism is good for everyone or it is good for no one. If one ethnic group tries to gain a competitive
Re: [political-research] On Psychedelic Drugs
Just now I came across Sean McBride's discussion of friends who became schizophrenic after taking LSD or some other psychedelic drug. A couple of minutes before seeing Sean's post I sent an E Mail to a guy suggesting he do a broadcast on the infiltration of the Christian Churches and some Christian Yahoo Groups by the New Age Occultists. I was saying that sometimes taking LSD opens a person up to the dark side of the spirit world. A non-Christian might just call it mental illness, or some kind of delusion. In fact, claiming to talk to spirit guides would be seen as schizophrenic by the shrinks. Now there are many New Age Occultists who are channelers of such spirits. I lived through the counterculture of the sixties in Madison, Wisconsin, and had friends who took LSD and a few took other psychedelics. One was diagnosed later as having paranoid schizophrenia, and another did not get into the mental health system but he might have been considered borderline schizophrenic and MDA or LSD made it worse. An example of this is that once in 1984 I wrote him about the taking of a Frank Lloyd Wright chair of mine in storage in 1978 in an apartment building in Madison. He consulted a medium on the Near East Side and claimed she conjured up the chair and thought she knew who had it. She was wrong. I got it back, but not though witchcraft. A former New Age Occultist who says he was a channeler for spirit guides acknowledges that taking LSD helped lead him into becoming a channeler. He says on a broadcast on the Internet that taking LSD changes the way you view the world, perhaps permanently. In the drug movement of the early and middle sixties, before the New Age Occult movement arrived, there was talk in the movement of creating one's own reality. There was in the drug movement a rejection of objective reality which was, I think, a result of too many LSD trips. I am not sure that having borderline schizophrenic is a necessary mental condition for having a bad trip on LSD, though the guy who later went to a spirit medium in Madison to find out who had my chair might have been borderline before taking psychedelics. Psychologists may not even be able to predict with any accuracy who might have a bad LSD trip and become schizophrenic as a result. LSD and any other drug is something to stay away from. Some say that marijuana can also open you up to the occult world. Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know of two particular cases in which friends of mine (one a high school classmate, another a college classmate) did in fact suffer permanent mental breakdowns from the use of psychedelic drugs -- one from a bad LSD trip, another from a bad mescaline trip. Apparently these extreme reactions happen among a certain percentage of users. After the bad trips the friends exhibited all the classical symptoms of schizophrenia (disrupted, confused thought processes), and never recovered. The two incidents made a great impression on my mind because both of them were quite brilliant and had bright futures before them before the bad trips. Many other friends didn't suffer these effects from their experimentation, but two people was far too many to see ruined. After the changes in their minds and personalities, it was impossible to communicate with them rationally -- they were not the same people. The transformation was disturbing and frightening. Since then I've always advised people to be very careful in experimenting with strong psychedelic drugs. Probably you'll have an interesting experience; perhaps you'll have an experience that is more interesting than you can handle. Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In political-research@yahoogroups.com, Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two theories regarding Millegan: 1. He is literally brain-damaged and demented from the overuse of psychedelic drugs and has lapsed into paranoid schizophrenia. I don't know who this Millegan fellow is, and for all I know he IS brain-damaged and demented (from whatever cause(s)), but for the record: psychedelic drugs (LSD, peyote, etc.) do not cause brain damage or dementia. No man in the wrong can stand up against a fellow that's in the right and keeps a-comin.' Texas Ranger Captain Bill McDonald James 5:1-6 Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud (INCOME TAX), crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth.
Re: [political-research] Barbara Marx Hubbard and the Population Elimination Movement
Sean: Barbara Marx Hubbard and other New Age Occult leaders, as far as I know, do not say exactly how one third or so of humanity now on earth is to be killed. The main point I was making in my article on depleted uranium is that the New Age Occultists and Environmentalists are supporting the Kissinger and ruling elite plan to get rid of a huge number of people. Depleted uranium may be one way the elite is slowly going about killing off people in Third World nations. And there is the possibility the elite will allow Mad Scientists to create more deadly germs to kill not only Third World people, but Americans also. See: http://www.freewebs.com/mommadoggie1/recreating1918flu.htm Endless war also kills off many people, and World War III that goes nuclear will kill off a lot more. The argument on overpopulation and its impact on limitied resources is filled with pitfalls, such as being extremely immoral, racist, supporting abortion, etc. Bernard On 11/3/06, Sean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm curious: do you have any concerns about population growth? Some analysts predict a world population of 9 or 10 billion by 2050, a mass of humanity that will be clamoring for an ever higher standard of living, devouring ever more resources, and dumping ever more waste and pollution into the air, oceans and ground. Is this a sustainable scenario for the human race? The background on Barbara Marx Hubbard is interesting, but I don't know enough about her to judge or evaluate her writings or vision. No doubt there are some extremists who would gladly eliminate 3 or 4 billion people by whatever means would work, all in the name of saving the world. Some of them are working on biological and genetic weapons to do the job. bernard_pyron bernardpyron@gmail.com wrote: [political-research] The Untold History of Humanity As Seen Through Evolutionary Eyes InboxSean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] to political-rese. More options 12:35 am (7 hours ago) The Untold History of Humanity As Seen Through Evolutionary EyesThrough Evolutionary Eyes KurzweilAI.net, Nov. 3, 2006 Futurist Barbara Marx Hubbard has produced a documentary movie that spans the history of the evolutionary journey of our species from the big bang to current times, and beyond, to our emergence as a universal species, utilizing our spiritual, social and scientific potential. Barbara Marx Hubbard has been a major leader of the New Age Occultmovement for many years. Among other New Age Occult leaders, she has called for getting rid of many people now living on earth. She belongs to the other side in more than one way, that is, spiritually as well as politically.The excerpt below is from an article on depleted uranium: http://www.bernardpyron.4t.com/custom4.htmlThe New Age Occult Movement and Population Reduction Several leaders in the New Age Occult Movement have called for the elimination of numbers sof people now living. The New Age Occult people arrived on the scene of the counterculture toward the end of the sixties and early seventies. Of course, earlier than that, many who into the drug and hippie affairs had been into astrology, and some were interested in the ancient Chinese I Ching.The New Age Occultists go back to earlier occult movements, especially back to Helen P. Blavatsky and Alice B. Bailey. In 1875 Blatavsky published Isis Unveiled and The Secret Doctrine. Some say she influenced Hitler. Alice Bailey published a number of works from 1919 to 1945. In the period of the counterculture and its aftermath, Marilyn Ferguson's The Aquarian Conspiracy: Personal and Social Transformation In the 1980's is one of the more influential books on the New Age. John Randolph Price's The Planetary Commission is another such book. Price also wrote Practical Spirituality. In this book Price has some things to say that parallel the Nazi concept of Der Ubermensch, the superior people, or the master race, and Der Untermensch, the sub-human, or under races. In Practical Spirituality, Price says These individuals with their lower vibratory rates will be removed during the next two decades. How are these useless people going to be removed?Barbara Marx Hubbard, another New Ager, in her book, Revelation: The Book of Co-Creation, tells us Only the useless is destroyed... She goes on to say that We, the elders have been patiently waiting until the very last moment before the quantum transformation, to cut out the corrupted and corrupting element in the body of humanity...We are in charge of God's selection process for Planet Earth. He selects, we destroy. We are the riders of the pale horse, Death. You might think that Price and Hubbard are just crazies and not really dangerous. But Hubbard has been involved in leftist politics. Marilyn Ferguson is or was associated with Humanistic Psychology and with a journal by that name. The Satanists Also Want To get Rid of Many People on www.dpjs.co.uk/elitism.html it is said that Satanism if a...brutal religion of
Re: [political-research] On the Israel Lobby and Christian Armageddonists
Sean:I agree that Tim LaHaye, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, John Hagee and Hal Lindsey think that the Jews at this point in time are still God's chosen people. I am not familiar with Mike Evans. Since the Jews are God's chosen people for these celebrities, the U.S. should do everything to help the nation of Israel. And - since these Big Shots believe in the Rapture of Christians off earth before things get very bad as predicted in end time prophecy, or they promote the Rapture to gain popularity, anything that speeds up the end of the age and Armageddon brings closer the day of their Rapture off planet earth.But there are some Scriptures thatmight be interpretred to say that God in the end time may deal harshly with Christians who have fallen into false doctrines, and especially for the celebrities who led the sheep into such doctrines. I won't go into these verses in detailhere, but Luke 17: 34-37 is one of them. The people you are calling "Christian Armageddonists" andI call dispensationalist celebrities think those "taken" in Luke 17: 34-36 are "Raptrured" but look at verse 37 of Luke 17. The disciples asked Christ where they were to be taken. He answered "Wheresoever the body is, thither will be eagles be gathered together." The same statement is in Matthew 24: 28, "For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together." There is a good possibility that he meant voltures rather than eagles, because the Greek word could mean either. So maybe the body is not the body of Christ, meaning the Christians, but he is talking about a dead carcase.As far asI know, the one Protestant theological system that would support the state of Israel more than other theologies is dispensationalism. Here is what Wikipedia says of dispensationalism:"Christian Dispensationalists sometimes embrace what some critics have pejoratively called Judeophilia -- ranging from support of the state of Israel or undertaking the study of Hebrew as an aid to Bible study, to observing traditional Jewish holidays and practicing traditionally Jewish religious rituals. (See also Jewish Christians and Judaizers.)"Dispensationalism says Godhas one dispensation for the Old Testament people, the Hebrews orJews, and a different one for the Christians. For thedispensationalists, who may be influential among seminary trainedclergy and their church members, Christians are notIsrael. But the dispensationalists are refusing to accept ourposition in Christ, that Christians are Israel. You do not want toreject your position in Christ as Israel.Although Judaism uses the Old Testament, it is not the religion of the Old Testament, but another man-made religion. To find out what Judaism is, go to the internet search engines and type in "Talmud" and "Kabbalah." Don't extend a negative attitude toward Judaism, which probably is the origin of Zionism, to all individuals who are Jews. They may be victims of this stuff.In Romans 11: 26 Paul writes that "And so all Israel shall besaved..." Thedispensationalists would have to claim that all Jews will be savedbecause they are Jews, and yet in John 3: 3 Christ told Nicodemus, aJewish Pharisee, that "Except a man be born again, he cannot see thekingdom of God." No, all Israel will be saved because all, Gentilesand Jews, who are in Christ and born again are saved, and all areIsrael.Paul says in Romans 9: 6 that "For they are not all Israel, which areof Israel." He makes this clearer in I Corinthians 10: 18 inreferring to "Israel after the flesh." So there is an Israel afterthe flesh which are the physical descendants of Abraham but are notfaithful to the Lord, and thenthere is spiritual Israel that is made up of all saved people inChrist. Paul talks about the "Israel of God," all saved people, inGalatians 6: 16.In the parable of the husbandmen of the vineyard, the husbandmen beatand killed the servants of the owner of the vineyard and then theowner sent his son and they killed him. In Matthew 21: 40-41 it says"When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do untothose husbandmen?They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, andwill let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall renderhim the fruits in their seasons." His vineyard is the kingdom of Godand the other husbandmen are Christians.In Isaiah 50: 1 God asks "Where is the bill of your mother'sdivorcement whom I have put away?...Behold, for your iniquities haveyou sold yourselves, and for your transgressions is your mother putaway." "Your Mother" is national Israel. Paul tells us clearly in Galatians 3: 29, "If ye be Christ's, thenare ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." Again, inRomans 2: 28 Paul says "For he is not a Jew, which is oneoutwardly..." Jeff Cross, in his July 14, 2006 broadcast On the Threshing Floor, covers this same teaching in the New Testament. His new series is called The Spirit of Promise and his first installment on June 30, 2006 can
Re: [political-research] On the Israel Lobby and Christian Armageddonists
Sean:By "Christian Armageddonists" do you mean dispensationalists? If so, you could have said so. "Christian Armageddonists" as a vague term could refer to anyone who believes in some kind of a literal battle - physical or spiritual or both - as mentioned in Revelation 16: 16.Dispensationalists tend to believe in a literal battle at the end of the world or end of the age as described in Revelation 16: 13-16 and Revelation 19: 11-21 that is to occur at a place called Armageddon. But the dispensationalists generally think that the Hebrews or Jews are still God's chosen people, thoughmost Jewsrejected Christ with only a few accepting him. The dispensationalists reject the New Testament teachings that those who are in Christ are true Israel. The pre-Tribulation Rapture apostasy is dispensationalist, and maybe what you are calling "Christian Armageddonists" are those who believe in that pre-trib Rapture. But you have not said that and have left it open to include others who are not Rapture people.There are many Christiangroups and individuals who believe in the Millennium, think Christians will go through the Great Tribulation without being Raptured off the earth, and who do not allegorize almost all end time prophecyand who are not dispensationalists. Francis Schaeffer, the Christian writer who died in 1985, was one who believed in the Millennium and in many literal fulfillments of end time Bible prophecy, and yet hewas not a dispensationalist. You could be more explicit rather than talking about "Christian Armageddonists."Even if you are not a Chrtistian you could find out more about end time Christian or Protestant theology. BernardSean McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:On the Israel Lobby and Christian ArmageddonistsThe Israel lobby isn't simply manipulating Christian Armageddonists (and vice-versa). Major factions within the Israel lobby and the Zionist world, especially religious Zionists in the school of Rabbi Abraham Kook, are themselves Armageddonists, Jewish Armageddonists, to be exact.Christian Armageddonists view Armageddon as an instrument to produce a permanent global Christian dictatorship with its capital in Jerusalem. Jewish Armageddonists view Armageddon as a means to create a permanent global Jewish dictatorship with its capital in Jerusalem. Both parties are of course completely deranged and will no doubt at some point begin warring against one another.Many of the supposed secular neoconservatives are crypto-Armageddonists. The rhetoric of the PNAC and other neocon organizations is loaded up with themes straight from Armageddonist psychology -- world revolution, world domination, utopianism, global holy war, World War III, World War IV, clash of civilizations, etc. William Kristol, Richard Perle, Michael Ledeen and their comrades are essentially Jewish Armageddonists, who are attempting to ignite a global conflagration as the necessary prelude to ushering in the messianic era -- an era in which they comprise the world-dominating Messiah.Jewish Armageddonists + Christian Armageddonists = Judeo-Christian Armageddonism, the most dangerous political movement in the history of the United States and of the world. These crackpots control the largest arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in existence.The great majority of Christians and Jews oppose both Christian and Jewish Armageddonists, but for some reason their voices are not being heard in the contemporary American mainstream media. The most influential owners and controllers of the mainstream media, like Rupert Murdoch, appear to be Armageddonists themselves, who are promoting an Armageddonist agenda while censoring all dissenting voices. "No man in the wrong can stand up against a fellow that's in the right and keeps a-comin.' " Texas Ranger Captain Bill McDonaldJames 5:1-6"Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days. Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud (INCOME TAX), crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth." How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. __._,_.___ Search the archives for political-research at http://www.terazen.com/ Subscribe to the RSS feed for political-research at http://rss.groups.yahoo.com/group/political-research/rss SPONSORED LINKS Business intelligence Competitive intelligence Market intelligence
