RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
You mean, everyone else doesn't ? Norman. - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - -Original Message- From: Dilwyn Jones [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 8:46 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Norman Dunbar wrote: Sorry Malcolm, I don't quite understand the term 'a spare lunchtime'. What's one of those then ? I've never had one :o) No, of course you haven't, you keep insisting on QLing when you should be taking a break! -- Dilwyn Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.soft.net.uk/dj/index.html This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Sorry Malcolm, I don't quite understand the term 'a spare lunchtime'. What's one of those then ? I've never had one :o) Cheers, Norman. - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - -Original Message- From: Malcolm Cadman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 9:51 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Thanks ... but don't hold your breath for the implementation ... it all takes time and effort. I am also relying on Norman to have plenty of spare 'lunchtimes' :-) This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Claus, it sucks if certain people don't stop to waste / steal my time with permanently off topic talking I don't permanaently talk about M$, viruses etc. I contribute quite a lot of QL stuff too. I'd say about 95% roughly ofmy posts are QL related. If I wanted to talk M$ permananetly, trust me, I'd go somewhere else. Off topic discussions (not related to QL/SMS) are not appreciated. Being a member of this list is a privilege and you may lose that privilege if you abuse your subscription. OK, 'not appreciated' doesn't actually mean 'totally banned', but I get the point. Bruce is the moderator, and he has the final say. Cheers, Norman. - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Agreed ! - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - -Original Message- From: Bill Waugh [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 12:40 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Now boys I think it is time this one was put to bed. All three lists that I subscribe to go OT at times, one in particular has a very active moderator, reads every mail, lets things go just far enough then pronounces This thread stops right now and it always does. I reckon we've reached that point. All the best - Bill This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
May I point out that the number of 'is/isn't OT' and 'who reacted in what way' posts is now approaching a good 30% share in the 80% of OT messages and is just making things worse. In the past when the list would wander, going back to QL topics without further bickering has been proven a great way to put things back on track. I'm sure it will work this time too (HINT!). Nasta
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Well, perhaps the person using it actually thought that there is such a thing as M$ crap - and I presume that a certain number of people on this list will agree (me, for instance).. May be, but when you use language like that you demean yourself more than you demean M$. Pity because most people who do use it on the group are highly respected within the QL Community and have proved through their QL work that we don't need to use cheap, emotional language in the M$ v QDOS/SMSQ battle. I write that out of respect for you and all the others, whom I shall not name, who have used the term in the last year. Geoff Wicks
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list: THE END
At 06:45 ìì 8/2/2002 +, you wrote: - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Well, perhaps the person using it actually thought that there is such a thing as M$ crap - and I presume that a certain number of people on this list will agree (me, for instance).. May be, but when you use language like that you demean yourself more than you demean M$. Pity because most people who do use it on the group are highly respected within the QL Community and have proved through their QL work that we don't need to use cheap, emotional language in the M$ v QDOS/SMSQ battle. Hello Geoff, there's one thing that may be involved here... and that's English not being the native language for many ql-users contributors (incl. myself). We know as much English as we are taught (and many of us are self taught) and we do not posess the advantage of being born in the US, or the UK etc.. In that aspect (linguistically... sorry about that term :-) many words to many of us do not appear bad or emotionally charged. For example for me although I know the etymology of the C word I have the understanding that at least in the place I am it's a good substitute for trash - which at times sounds a lot harsher-. Nevertheless since I use the word... succesfully :-) for many years with no complaints whatsoever I have to apologize if I offended anyone with it... I always thought it (and other words) to be good substitute for s words :-) However there is now a paradox... some people in this list (names don't matter I am just trying to make a point) do consider that this list is the equivalent of a pub meet after a QL show... well I don't know about anybody else but in a pub environment not only we use C words but also plenty of S, F and so on... The thing is that we need be a little more on the tolerant side but also self-restrained... and that's exactly why I proposed the ql-chat list which Dave promptly created... (thanks Dave). That way everyone's happy and noone is offended. And that's my final contribution to the subject publicly and please as many others suggested let's put the subject to rest now... (I do welcome personal emails on the subject though) Best Regards, Phoebus
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Geoff Wicks [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes - Original Message - From: Malcolm Cadman [EMAIL PROTECTED] There is clearly a need for a document on virus handling ... when I get time I will liase with you and we can put out an advice notice. Maybe on your website. Then whenever there is a problem with a virus we can refer to the advice to help out those in need. This is a good idea and I hope it can be implemented. Thanks ... but don't hold your breath for the implementation ... it all takes time and effort. I am also relying on Norman to have plenty of spare 'lunchtimes' :-) -- Malcolm Cadman
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Roy Wood Wrote:- I don't know about the rest of you but I have always seen this list as the cybernetic equivalent of the chat in the pub after a QL show. Very much so, I agree totally. Except cybernetic pints don't quite taste the same ;-)) There are some groups of people earnestly discussing some aspects of code or esoteric uses of hardware and others (like Dave Walker and I suddenly finding we have a shared liking for the music of Judie Tzukie) exploring other co-incidences of interest. Wasn't it Judy Tzuke? Stay with me 'til dawn? (whoops, off topic again..) SNIP Wear blinkers - get run down. Very true. Darren Branagh, Consumer Lending Business, Bank Of Ireland Card Services, Nassau House, 33/35 Nassau Street, Dublin 2. Ireland. Tel: 01-6176368 (Direct Line)Fax: 01-6798717 [EMAIL PROTECTED] This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately at [EMAIL PROTECTED] and delete this E-mail from your system. Thank you. It is possible for data transmitted by email to be deliberately or accidentally corrupted or intercepted. For this reason, where the communication is by email, the Bank of Ireland Group does not accept any responsibility for any breach of confidence which may arise through the use of this medium. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of known computer viruses.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list (OT)
Tony Firshman wrote:- I don't get cross at a choral concert if someone talks about the weather. I cannot understand people getting hot under the collar about all this and stamping feet. There is more to life. Agreed. Lets all lighten up a bit.. Darren - where have you stashed your 500m (8-)# I transferred it to the TF Services account as arranged, you can give me my cut once you've laundered it ;-)) I expect you're referring to the bloke in Baltimore who managed to Nick Leeson The Allied Irish Bank out of 860 Million Euro. A friend of mine here once met him at a conference in the US. I work for Bank Of Ireland, so it wasn't me - Rusnak is this blokes name!! AIB won't miss it - even when they write off this amount, big though it is, their pre-tax profit for the year will still be over 400 Million. It will hurt, but it won't break them the way Leeson did with Barings. 2 Billion was wiped off their share value yesterday afternoon. Still, you'd have thought they'd have learnt their lesson in options trading by now.. Darren Branagh, Consumer Lending Business, Bank Of Ireland Card Services, Nassau House, 33/35 Nassau Street, Dublin 2. Ireland. Tel: 01-6176368 (Direct Line)Fax: 01-6798717 [EMAIL PROTECTED] This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately at [EMAIL PROTECTED] and delete this E-mail from your system. Thank you. It is possible for data transmitted by email to be deliberately or accidentally corrupted or intercepted. For this reason, where the communication is by email, the Bank of Ireland Group does not accept any responsibility for any breach of confidence which may arise through the use of this medium. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of known computer viruses.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Wed, Feb 06, 2002 at 09:14:38AM -, Norman Dunbar wrote: Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE Bye bye then Peter. I think your attitude sucks (to be quite brutally honest) but you have made your choice to go, then so be it. I think your hardware posts are pretty tedious - but they are on-topic. There are at least 5000 newgroups and maybe same amount of mailinglists which deal MS and its virii and whatever else you may find interesting. There is just this one ql-users mailing list. I for one am glad to see discussions on virusses - especially if it means that other people on this list using inferior hardware (ie PCs) can avoid sending them to me, and the rest of us - the majority I suspect - who access this list from a PC. The PC is a fact of life and no matter how much we like the QL, it is not, and never has been, mainstream - much as I would like to have seen it. It was ahead of its time, and shafted too. A short mention of a new virus would be ok, but that was definitely too much and it keeps comming again and again. Give up, despite all warnings about new virii the situation will not get better and you can not do anything to salvage the poor MS Outlook abducted users. It is their choice to use this program so I am sure they can deal with it. Bye Richard
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
-Original Message- From: Richard Zidlicky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 8:54 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list [ND] I think your hardware posts are pretty tedious - [RZ] but they are on-topic Yes, I agree, and didn't say that they weren't. However, there is a ql-developers list for hardware ? So, effectively, all the hardware stuff in ql-users *is* OT in that respect - no-one has complained about that. There is just this one ql-users mailing list. And ql-developers for hardware :o) A short mention of a new virus would be ok, but that was definitely too much and it keeps comming again and again. Maybe. I *have* to subscribe to a 'new virus alert' list at work, and there are new MS virii almost every hour or so. If we had a short warning on all of these then we'd have no room for any QL stuff. As far as I remember, the conversation was to do with someone on the list sending virusses out to the rest of us. Very on topic to me - and a few others. I agree that general discussion that 'goes on and on' is OT. Give up, despite all warnings about new virii the situation will not get better and you can not do anything to salvage the poor MS Outlook abducted users. Indeed, and when we all get over to Linux the world will be a better place. But then the script kiddies will just change over as well, and we will have the Linux equivalent to the current MS situation. Mind you, security holes should be filled in quicker It is their choice to use this program so I am sure they can deal with it. Not always. I have no choice at work and that is where I am when I'm using this list. It *has* to be Outlook, warts and all. Regards, Norman. - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Norman Dunbar wrote: [ND] I think your hardware posts are pretty tedious - [RZ] but they are on-topic Yes, I agree, and didn't say that they weren't. However, there is a ql-developers list for hardware ? So, effectively, all the hardware stuff in ql-users *is* OT in that respect - no-one has complained about that. Well, hardware *development* has an appropriate group, but general hardware discussion belongs here as much as anywhere... Can a listmom please write a charter for the list, which automatically gets mailed out to all new signups, and defines what's on or off topic, how large .sigs can be, etc? :o) Also, if anyone feels any specialist lists should be set up (ql-advocacy, ql-pubchat, ql-fetist anyone? ;) I run a listserver. Dave ql.spodmail.com
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
-Original Message- From: Dave [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2002 2:22 PM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Norman Dunbar wrote: Well, hardware *development* has an appropriate group, but general hardware discussion belongs here as much as anywhere... I agree. Also, if anyone feels any specialist lists should be set up (ql-advocacy, ql-pubchat, ql-fetist anyone? ;) I run a listserver. ql_fetist - interesting. What's one of them ? :o) - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Norman Dunbar wrote: Also, if anyone feels any specialist lists should be set up (ql-advocacy, ql-pubchat, ql-fetist anyone? ;) I run a listserver. ql_fetist - interesting. What's one of them ? :o) Argh, typo! ql-fetish... The way some people go on about the QL it's *definitely* sexual... They say things like it's long, hard, black, and about 6 deep or insert OS here is the best... ;) Dave ql.spodmail.com Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board...
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
At 02:25 ìì 7/2/2002 +, you wrote: ql_fetist - interesting. What's one of them ? :o) Probably me (sleep with my Aurora every night - Much to my wife's chagrin...) Phoebus
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board... But then I wouldn't be able to read the messages as they arrive throughout the day like I can with email. Our web access is monitored. Ian. -Original Message- From: dexter Sent: 07 February 2002 14:31 To: ql-users Cc: dexter Subject: RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Norman Dunbar wrote: Also, if anyone feels any specialist lists should be set up (ql-advocacy, ql-pubchat, ql-fetist anyone? ;) I run a listserver. ql_fetist - interesting. What's one of them ? :o) Argh, typo! ql-fetish... The way some people go on about the QL it's *definitely* sexual... They say things like it's long, hard, black, and about 6 deep or insert OS here is the best... ;) Dave ql.spodmail.com Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board... Visit our website at http://www.ubswarburg.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board... But then I wouldn't be able to read the messages as they arrive throughout the day like I can with email. Our web access is monitored. That would be: better than the board currently at ql.spodmail.com, not better than this list. Can you telnet or SSH? Dave ql.spodmail.com
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Can't telnet. SSH? Please excuse my ignorance of that particular TLA :O) -Original Message- From: dexter Sent: 07 February 2002 14:59 To: ql-users Cc: dexter Subject: RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board... But then I wouldn't be able to read the messages as they arrive throughout the day like I can with email. Our web access is monitored. That would be: better than the board currently at ql.spodmail.com, not better than this list. Can you telnet or SSH? Dave ql.spodmail.com Visit our website at http://www.ubswarburg.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can't telnet. SSH? Please excuse my ignorance of that particular TLA :O) SSH is the Secure SHell. It's essentially telnet by SSL... All traffic is encrypted both ways. Whenever you're telnetting to a Linux machine, SSH does the same job securely. Dave ql.spodmail.com
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
At 02:59 ìì 7/2/2002 +, you wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Web-based chat coming soon - much better than the current board... But then I wouldn't be able to read the messages as they arrive throughout the day like I can with email. Our web access is monitored. That would be: better than the board currently at ql.spodmail.com, not better than this list. Can you telnet or SSH? It won't help him much, since I suspect that as companies that size usually do, the keyboard clicks are also monitored (to avoid circumventions like that). Spyware as an art... He's right.. the best way even though not the most secure possible to get his QL news chit-chat etc. would be via email Phoebus
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
SSH is the Secure SHell. It's essentially telnet by SSL... Ah, now SSL I have heard of. Can't do anything like that without prior approval, and that requires a business case. We're sewn (or should that be 'stitched'?) up tighter than a really tight thing in a jar with the lid screwed on tightly. I can't even stop those stupid disclaimers being appended to all my mails. At home, in the evenings I barely manage to find ten minutes to spare on 'the-machine-that-must-not-be-named' to read and respond to emails. Ian. -Original Message- From: dexter Sent: 07 February 2002 15:13 To: ql-users Cc: dexter Subject: RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can't telnet. SSH? Please excuse my ignorance of that particular TLA :O) SSH is the Secure SHell. It's essentially telnet by SSL... All traffic is encrypted both ways. Whenever you're telnetting to a Linux machine, SSH does the same job securely. Dave ql.spodmail.com Visit our website at http://www.ubswarburg.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 at 14:31:08, Dave wrote: (ref: [EMAIL PROTECTED]) On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Norman Dunbar wrote: Also, if anyone feels any specialist lists should be set up (ql-advocacy, ql-pubchat, ql-fetist anyone? ;) I run a listserver. ql_fetist - interesting. What's one of them ? :o) Argh, typo! ql-fetish... The way some people go on about the QL it's *definitely* sexual... They say things like it's long, hard, black, and about 6 deep or insert OS here is the best... ;) ... and gets hot (8-)# -- QBBS (QL fido BBS 2:257/67) +44(0)1442-828255 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.firshman.demon.co.uk Voice: +44(0)1442-828254 Fax: +44(0)1442-828255 TF Services, 29 Longfield Road, TRING, Herts, HP23 4DG
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Thu, Feb 07, 2002 at 02:10:22PM -, Norman Dunbar wrote: -Original Message- From: Richard Zidlicky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 8:54 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list [ND] I think your hardware posts are pretty tedious - [RZ] but they are on-topic Yes, I agree, and didn't say that they weren't. However, there is a ql-developers list for hardware ? So, effectively, all the hardware stuff in ql-users *is* OT in that respect - no-one has complained about that. no. ql-developers has been hijacked by Linux geeks and is now mostly devoted to linux-q40. A short mention of a new virus would be ok, but that was definitely too much and it keeps comming again and again. Maybe. I *have* to subscribe to a 'new virus alert' list at work, and there are new MS virii almost every hour or so. If we had a short warning on all of these then we'd have no room for any QL stuff. As far as I remember, the conversation was to do with someone on the list sending virusses out to the rest of us. Very on topic to me - and a few others. I agree that general discussion that 'goes on and on' is OT. Give up, despite all warnings about new virii the situation will not get better and you can not do anything to salvage the poor MS Outlook abducted users. Indeed, and when we all get over to Linux the world will be a better place. But then the script kiddies will just change over as well, and we will have the Linux equivalent to the current MS situation. Mind you, security holes should be filled in quicker there will still be *BSD and when script kiddiez hack even that there will be still more choices. Besides, the Unix clones have a long history of hacking so they won't be so easy targets. It is their choice to use this program so I am sure they can deal with it. Not always. I have no choice at work and that is where I am when I'm using this list. It *has* to be Outlook, warts and all. Oh well, if your employer forces you to use Outlook he probably won't mind if the company network gets infected from time to time? I hope it is only rarely so extreme, most people can use at least some of the web based mailers. For those who use it voluntarily there is no excuse, either learn to cope with it or stop whining. Bye Richard
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
- Original Message - From: Malcolm Cadman [EMAIL PROTECTED] There is clearly a need for a document on virus handling ... when I get time I will liase with you and we can put out an advice notice. Maybe on your website. Then whenever there is a problem with a virus we can refer to the advice to help out those in need. This is a good idea and I hope it can be implemented. I can appreciate the anger that some people feel about the discussion on viruses, but on this case there were special factors: 1: The virus came in on a pseudo ql-users message. 2: There is evidence that someone in the group was infected (and may still be). 3: The virus could not be detected by some scanning software (Norton 2002!) 4: It came in on a pseudo .txt file. My rant now: I know some on this group are M$ haters, but can we be polite and constructive M$ haters? It is some time since I have seen it, but in the past I have seen the term M$ crap used in this group. I associate that sort of language with immature schoolboys, and I find it difficult to take anyone who uses it seriously although, in fact, they may have some good points to make. Having said that my apologies if I was one of the protagonists in the virus discussion. There were parts of it that I found OT, but politeness meant replying. I tried to keep my OT replies as short as possible. Geoff Wicks.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:14:38 - Norman Dunbar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE I think your attitude sucks (to be quite brutally honest) but you have made your choice to go, then so be it. it sucks if certain people don't stop to waste / steal my time with permanently off topic talking don't you understand, it's nice for _you_ to write what you want, but off topic mails are running ql users into problems who don't have 3 hours a day trying to find some ql related material in [ql-users] snip Maybe you think that everything on the list has to be QL/QDOS/SMQ/Q40/Q60/QPC (!) related you should read the welcome email, this list is about ql/sms! snip Because of the recent discussions on 'flo flo', I was able to see that I had a suspicious email this morning, and true to form, there was a virus attached, so someone on the list is still infected and sending it out. Maybe you are using Q40/Q60 and can avoid these things, but most of us have to take extreme care - especially those of us who read this list at work. (The virus was intercepted and deleted by our software, but others on the list might not be so lucky.) Maybe you even want those of us not using your hardware to catch the virusses on the go just now - so you can tell us all how wonderful Q40/Q60 is. Take your ball and go home then. please read the welcome email ( I cite): Off topic discussions (not related to QL/SMS) are not appreciated. Being a member of this list is a privilege and you may lose that privilege if you abuse your subscription. Seems the latter is needed, there are some people who don't want to listen... kindergarten, eh? END RANT MODE Now, having said all that, regardless of whether you re-join or not, and I'll be glad to see you return, I sincerely wish you every success with sales and development of Q40/Q60. One day, I hope to be able to have one - wife permitting of course. Good Luck. Sorry about that rant above everyone, but this tedious attitude from some people that 'only their way is right' gets on my t*ts ! you must be talking of yourself. The fact is: Off topic emails are breaking the rules of this list, see above. Peter (and a lot of others) are the victims, please don't forget that. Converting the victims into gulty ones is perversion. Regards, Norman. (Having a somewhat bad day already - sorry!) Claus __ powered by Q60 * Motorola 68060 / 80 MHz * 80 MB RAM * 30 GB Hard Disk
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 21:24:38 + Malcolm Cadman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] uk, Norman Dunbar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE Snipped :-) END RANT MODE A lot of your 'rant' needed to said. Yet we have to be tolerant of each other, and, thankfully we are. is it tolerant to raise a stink about someone leaving the list because others break the rules of this list? BTW: The list owner asks us to be _on topic_, not to be tolerant (similar to off topic in the way you use it here ) Malcolm Cadman Claus -- __ powered by Q60 * Motorola 68060 / 80 MHz * 80 MB RAM * 30 GB Hard Disk
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 10:40:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The I'm not playing anymore attitude is great when you're seven years old, kinda wears out after that. Guess what? Some people have grown up, need to go to work and don't have the full day to filter a grain of ql info out of [ql-users] Darren Branagh, Claus -- __ powered by Q60 * Motorola 68060 / 80 MHz * 80 MB RAM * 30 GB Hard Disk
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:14:38 - Norman Dunbar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE I think your attitude sucks (to be quite brutally honest) but you have made your choice to go, then so be it. it sucks if certain people don't stop to waste / steal my time with permanently off topic talking . and much more of the same snipped Now boys I think it is time this one was put to bed. All three lists that I subscribe to go OT at times, one in particular has a very active moderator, reads every mail, lets things go just far enough then pronounces This thread stops right now and it always does. I reckon we've reached that point. All the best - Bill
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE Bye bye then Peter. I think your attitude sucks (to be quite brutally honest) but you have made your choice to go, then so be it. I think your hardware posts are pretty tedious - but I'm not into hardware, but I still get them and all the replies, 99% of which are of no interest to me. I'm still here because I can contribute something in other respects. Maybe you think that everything on the list has to be QL/QDOS/SMQ/Q40/Q60/QPC (!) related but for the benefit of those of us on the list who do not have access to the Internet through a QL type device and/or software, then how exactly off topic is advice on avoiding the plagues and pitfalls of *having* to use such horrible things as PCs ? I for one am glad to see discussions on virusses - especially if it means that other people on this list using inferior hardware (ie PCs) can avoid sending them to me, and the rest of us - the majority I suspect - who access this list from a PC. The PC is a fact of life and no matter how much we like the QL, it is not, and never has been, mainstream - much as I would like to have seen it. It was ahead of its time, and shafted too. I for one, found the arguments re QPC or Q40/Q60 and which one was a real QL system pretty tedious, small minded and un-necessary. It still took up a lot of bandwidth on this list, in QL Toady etc - but I didn't cancel my subscription to QL Today. Because of the recent discussions on 'flo flo', I was able to see that I had a suspicious email this morning, and true to form, there was a virus attached, so someone on the list is still infected and sending it out. Maybe you are using Q40/Q60 and can avoid these things, but most of us have to take extreme care - especially those of us who read this list at work. (The virus was intercepted and deleted by our software, but others on the list might not be so lucky.) Maybe you even want those of us not using your hardware to catch the virusses on the go just now - so you can tell us all how wonderful Q40/Q60 is. Take your ball and go home then. END RANT MODE Now, having said all that, regardless of whether you re-join or not, and I'll be glad to see you return, I sincerely wish you every success with sales and development of Q40/Q60. One day, I hope to be able to have one - wife permitting of course. Good Luck. Sorry about that rant above everyone, but this tedious attitude from some people that 'only their way is right' gets on my t*ts ! Regards, Norman. (Having a somewhat bad day already - sorry!) - Norman Dunbar Database/Unix administrator Lynx Financial Systems Ltd. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: 0113 289 6265 Fax: 0113 289 3146 URL: http://www.Lynx-FS.com - -Original Message- From: Peter Graf [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 9:42 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. All the best Peter This email is intended only for the use of the addressees named above and may be confidential or legally privileged. If you are not an addressee you must not read it and must not use any information contained in it, nor copy it, nor inform any person other than Lynx Financial Systems or the addressees of its existence or contents. If you have received this email and are not a named addressee, please delete it and notify the Lynx Financial Systems IT Department on 0113 2892990.
RE: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
Norman, I have to be honest and say I'm in total agreement with you. Occasionally we go off topic, and I admit there have been a few more off topic emails lately than usual, but these are just as enjoyable as the on topic ones IMHO. Theres so much more to it all than just the QL, thats just the start of our common interests. I've often had brief interchanges on this list about Music with Phoebus, Roy, and Tony, about the celtic ties with Dilwyn and Norman, and also about the QL!! So What? Its through the occasional OT email that you get to learn a bit about all those people that make this list so interesting, and what makes 'em tick - and I value that. I may be a long younger than most of you, but I like to nostalgitise (is that a word?) too!!! The I'm not playing anymore attitude is great when you're seven years old, kinda wears out after that. Darren Branagh, Consumer Lending Business, Bank Of Ireland Card Services, Nassau House, 33/35 Nassau Street, Dublin 2. Ireland. Tel: 01-6176368 (Direct Line)Fax: 01-6798717 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Norman Dunbar Norman.Dunbar@lTo: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' fs.co.uk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by:cc: owner-ql-users@nSubject: RE: [ql-users] vg.ntnu.no ms-users-and-smalltalk-list 06/02/2002 09:14 Please respond to ql-users Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE Bye bye then Peter. I think your attitude sucks (to be quite brutally honest) but you have made your choice to go, then so be it. (snip!!) Regards, Norman. (Having a somewhat bad day already - sorry!) This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately at [EMAIL PROTECTED] and delete this E-mail from your system. Thank you. It is possible for data transmitted by email to be deliberately or accidentally corrupted or intercepted. For this reason, where the communication is by email, the Bank of Ireland Group does not accept any responsibility for any breach of confidence which may arise through the use of this medium. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of known computer viruses.
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] uk, Norman Dunbar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Please don flame proof clothing before reading this !! BEGIN RANT MODE Snipped :-) END RANT MODE A lot of your 'rant' needed to said. Yet we have to be tolerant of each other, and, thankfully we are. This is a very pleasant list to be on. There is clearly a need for a document on virus handling ... when I get time I will liase with you and we can put out an advice notice. Maybe on your website. Then whenever there is a problem with a virus we can refer to the advice to help out those in need. Now, having said all that, regardless of whether you re-join or not, and I'll be glad to see you return, I sincerely wish you every success with sales and development of Q40/Q60. One day, I hope to be able to have one - wife permitting of course. Good Luck. Sorry about that rant above everyone, but this tedious attitude from some people that 'only their way is right' gets on my t*ts ! -Original Message- From: Peter Graf [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 9:42 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. -- Malcolm Cadman
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Tony Firshman wrote: If the virus has come via the list, then I think it _is_ on topic, and the information is interesting. Not only that, it serves as a reminder of why QLs are so great. No viruses! BTW: I'm still QL-less... Scary huh? Well, if you ever visit England that can be cured :-) -- Malcolm Cadman
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Peter Graf [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. I don't know about the rest of you but I have always seen this list as the cybernetic equivalent of the chat in the pub after a QL show. There are some groups of people earnestly discussing some aspects of code or esoteric uses of hardware and others (like Dave Walker and I suddenly finding we have a shared liking for the music of Judie Tzukie) exploring other co-incidences of interest. Quite apart from that most people on this list access it via M$ systems and are, as such, prone to the juvenile antics of those who have the mistaken idea that it is big to write and disseminate virus code. We all need to understand and protect ourselves against this because one slip could pass infections to the rest of us. No-one should ever be smug about their level of virus protection or ability to deal with it so, since this is an Internet and email based discussion all, of the mails on this are on topic. Wear blinkers - get run down. -- Roy Wood Q Branch, 20 Locks Hill Portslade. Sussex. BN41 2LB. UK Tel : +44 (0)1273 386030 Fax : +44 (0)1273 430501 (New number!) Mobile +44(0)7836 745501 Web : www.qbranch.demon.co.uk
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
At 10:41 ìì 5/2/2002 +0100, you wrote: Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. All the best Peter Well as a contributor of sorts in this (nicely put) flood, I for one agree totally to quit talking about M$. I certainly wouldn't like to lose Peter from the list :-) Phoebus
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Peter Graf [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. You will be missed ! I hope that you change your mind. This list has to be tolerant of high level technical discussion of hardware and software through to trivia and personal concerns. Which is what makes it a very good list to enjoy. This is what makes it open to anyone to join in with a 'thread'. It would have the potential to be boring otherwise. -- Malcolm Cadman
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Tue, 5 Feb 2002 at 22:41:31, Peter Graf wrote: (ref: [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Hi folks, I find it absolutely OK to have some off-topic mails on this list now and then. But in the last weeks there has been a neverending *huge* flood of absolutely non QL-related traffic. PC's, Microsoft, the related software and the related viruses and the related problems will never end, and there are enough forums where they can be discussed. There is no reason why these forums are not used, and the ql-users list is constantly abused instead. Why don't you open a ms-users-and-smalltalk-list? Please see that I'm not talking about just a few mails now and then - that's fine by me! I'm talking about floods of mails. The consequence is, that I will now leave the list, because I don't have the time to handle this anymore. I'll unsubscribe after this mail. That is a mite drastic. Can't you filter your email or just ignore OT emails. If the virus has come via the list, then I think it _is_ on topic, and the information is interesting. -- QBBS (QL fido BBS 2:257/67) +44(0)1442-828255 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.firshman.demon.co.uk Voice: +44(0)1442-828254 Fax: +44(0)1442-828255 TF Services, 29 Longfield Road, TRING, Herts, HP23 4DG
Re: [ql-users] ms-users-and-smalltalk-list
On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Tony Firshman wrote: If the virus has come via the list, then I think it _is_ on topic, and the information is interesting. Not only that, it serves as a reminder of why QLs are so great. No viruses! BTW: I'm still QL-less... Scary huh? Dave ql.spodmail.com
