Re: [Biofuel] RE: jelly and jellybiofuel
Wauw !! Somebody - and not JUST somebody - on this forum writing in real Dutch. Very good Keith. You're not kidding? You're very kind, but I don't think it's real Dutch. It's been a long time, it's a horrible mixture of bad Dutch and even worse Afrikaans. I can remember just enough to see the mistakes without knowing how to correct them. If I can't remember a Dutch word then the Cantonese word comes to mind instead! Can you imagine. But I'm glad you liked it. :-) Beste Keith Met vriendelijke groet, Pieter Koole - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 9:38 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] RE: jelly and jellybiofuel Dag Pieter Hello, Sorry if I start talking about something you are not talking about, because I did not follow this discussion, but I think I can make up that you try to solidify ethanol. You can do that very easy with wallpaperglue ( Carboxyl methyl cellulose ). Just use ethanol in stead of water and make strong glue. Velen bedankt, maar in een 3rde Wereld dorpje is wallpaperglue nie so maklik te vind, en jy kan dit ook nie maklik self maak van locally available renewable resources. Wanneer het jy al ooit erger Nederlands dan die gelesen?!! LOL! Maar miskien kan u dit verstaan... Beste wense Keith Met vriendelijke groet, Pieter Koole - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 5:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] RE: jelly and jellybiofuel snip ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Re: A beginners titration question
Hi Fred Keith, Great Information, You got ribbons too? :-) No ribbons. My daughter might want one!! Ah, well, Fred, for her, of course, special arrangements can always be made. I hope she won't mind if it's wrapped round a bunch of roses though. All best Keith fred On 8/11/05, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Jan for the explanation. And Keith I am sorry that I irritated you with a dumb question, I will avoid that in the future. For heaven's sake, that's the second time! I wasn't irritated, but now I am! You got good information, do you want a red ribbon round it too? :-( Keith Addison Doug snip ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
Greetings the skapegoat I did notice that a lot of the chemistry in the book was wrong. His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out. He does recommend not using BD with certain types of tubes, as the methanol will destroy it. Because of the free methanol content unwashed biodiesel will attack a lot of things that washed biodiesel won't attack, or not nearly as much. Plastics aside, this is what the Fuel Injection Equipment (FIE) Manufacturers say, among other things: Free methanol in biodiesel Effect: Corrodes aluminium zinc, Low flash point Failure Mode: Corrosion of fuel injection equipment http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_FIEM.html FIEM report I am certainly planning on washing my BD, I just wonder if he's had any problems in the ten or more years he's been making his without washing it. I could be wrong, but I wonder when Joshua last made biodiesel. Have a look at this: http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg35652.html Re: [biofuel] Best Processer I know about the chemical equilibrium, and not to try to remove methanol until the layers are seperated. I wonder if Joshua knows that. I'm just wondering if Tickell is so worried about wasting the methanol by washing it out if there is a better way of retrieving it without worrying about leaving all that other garbage in your BD. I think he's just sloppy. Sorry if I sound a bit sceptical of Joshua, it's because I am. Sorry about that too, really. After separating the layers, the excess methanol should be reclaimed from both the biodiesel before washing and from the by-product, if you can find an efficient and economical way of doing it. Best Keith Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greetings the skapegoat The JTF website strongly recommends washing and the Josh Tickell book seems to suggest it isn't necessary and possibly even detrimental. Bad book! See: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/31729/ You might also note that the JtF website says why it strongly recommends washing, with a couple of references provided (there could have been plenty more): http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#why Washing: Why bother? IIRC Joshua Tickell provides one obscure and outdated reference. Rudi Weidegger of FuelMeister fame (or infamy), who Joshua's since teamed up with, also recommends no washing and says it's bad for your motor, with no references, but then he doesn't provide a washtank in his exorbitant set-up. Ho-hum. Anyway, to believe that you'd h! ave to believe that all the national standards are based on nothing. Some people do seem to believe that. That's their business, as long as they keep their crappy fuel to themselves. I'm interested in some insight on this difference of opinion. I'm sure most experienced biodieselers here wash their biodiesel. Would it be worthwhile to distill the methanol from the biodiesel instead of just washing it away? The most convenient stage to reclaim the excess methanol would be immediately after the processing, when the mix is still hot. Unfortunately that means you reverse the very reaction you've just completed (hopefully completed). You have to settle and separate the glycerine by-product first. Most of the excess methanol is in the by-product; the small proportion in the biodiesel can be recovered, if you can find an economical way of doing it. I know this still leaves excess hydroxides And soaps. that still need to be washed out, but it might reduce the number of washes necessary Doubtful. and you might be able to save some of your methanol. Indeed. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Experience with DSE/dieselsecret.com
Hey paul, I read the site, it almost sounds too good to be true. It also sounds as though they are selling you some common chemicals that they want to make a secret in order to ensure profitability. If it works as well as they say though, more power to them. I do not have a diesel right now, but I will try this first when I get one. Ryan Caveat emptor. Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Re: Re: A beginners titration question
Hello again Doug. The forming of FFA in the presence of water is an auto-catalyst process, meaning that the more FFA:s there are, the more rapidly the further production of FFA:s. This is due to the fact that this is an acid-catalyst reaction which will continue for as long as there is water present in adequate amounts. The FFA and water values are in general higher at the bottom of the vessel, the other way around at the top. WVO often contains detergents because the cleansing of the frying oil vessels at the restaurants or factories is done with detergents and water. Some people pour this stuff into the used oil. The best way of avoiding this, is of course to let the WVO supplier know that the detergent - containing WVO is of scientifically less value, since the detergents are contaminations and cause a great deal of troubles. The other way of dealing with this is to vacuum -evaporate the WVO at 90oC, where the emulsions should break up. The third way is to reduce the water content and react the WVO in the normal way, adding further washing sequences and expecting a lower yield of biodiesel than usual.Any soap formation can be scattered with acid treatment. IPA is a good solvent for titration, unlike methanol or ethanol, which are hardly soluble in oil. I think you have a good base recipe. Do not change it, before you have examined the quality of your raw material. The solution to your problems is most likely to be found there. With best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Doug Memering [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 3:50 AM Subject: [Biofuel] Re: Re: A beginners titration question Jan, Thanks for the help. Hello Doug. Keith has made an excellent input to you questions but I felt it necessary to add some aspects of your problem: The rule no1 when taking samples is to make sure - as possible- that the sample is representative for the batch. This sounds simple, but if you are I am still working with fairly small batches so I have been drawing the complete batch out of my holding tank and then taking the test sample from that. I have been titrating that batch multiple times and getting the variation even from that. dealing with high water content together with high FFA levels you will have Does water content itself cause variation or is it changes in the amount of water content that would cause the variation in the titration? different titration values if sampled from the top or from the bottom. If there are detergents in the oil, this actually may help. It is a Detergents? What's the likelihood of picking up detergents in the WVO from a restaurant? Is this something I should watch for or is it simply a matter of more washing? disadvantage when washing the biodiesel though. By using IPA for titration, the general idea is to have one clear phase consisting from IPA, water, KOH (or NaOH) and oil. The EN standard for determination of acid number which is likewise determined by titration strongly recommends that the amount of IPA should be increased if the solution becomes cloudy or turbid. The solution was definitely turbid, but Keith's recommendation (unlike James Bond) was to do the test in a beaker or jar rather than a test tube so that it could be stirred and not shaken By using methanol for titration, you are out of standard procedure. When I started out I got a titration procedure from another site, before I found JTF. The procedures were nearly identical except in the list of what you needed it said to use either Isopropyl, Ethyl, or Methyl. Since I had already invested in a bunch of Methyl alcohol for this adventure and didn't have any isopropyl on hand I started using it. My limited college chemistry had me in the frame of mind that a solvent is a solvent. That's why I asked for an explanation. I can see where the my results could be shifted by what alcohol I am using but it didn't make sense to me that the type of alcohol would cause the huge variation in the test. And - possibly annoying Keith - the EN requirement for a good titration is that the solution stays magenta for at least 15 seconds. This was happening, there was a distinctive cross-over point where the solution would turn magenta for like 10 seconds and then fade to pink. It is just that event happened at substantially different amounts of NaOH. Heating was mentioned as well, and that could be a part of my problem too. I was heating the WVO then mixing it with the alcohol which was at about 95F. I didn't hear the reagent either. I gather they should all be near the process temperature. Thanks again Good luck to you further on ! With best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel
Hi Ian, Solidification is generally a bad thing to have happen to your BioD. Solid BioD doesn´t flow so your engine cannot start. Although it is possible that it might store for longer periods of time. That idea just popped into my head. I have no idea if it´s true but it would make sense as solids react (degrade) more slowly in general than liquids. Tom Irwin From: Ian Theresa Sims [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 18:09:17 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel Hi Tom Let me see if I 've got this right. BD made with Animal fat solidifies at a higher temp than WVO? This could be handy info as a lot of the chippies here use lard.FortunatleyI think I've got onto a source of WVO. Diesel prices in NZ are now a $1 pL for your interest Ian - Original Message - From: Tom Irwin To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 1:56 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel Hi Ian and Theresa, Definitely have to agree with Todd here. I´ve been doing a lot of work making BioD from animal fat. It resolidifies at relatively high temperatures. I left 2 liters in a hood in my lab over winter break. They turn off the heat here cause we rarely get freezing temperatures. We have a few days down to about 5 degrees C and some as high as 22. When I returned to the lab it was chilly again and the BioD was a yellowish white solid. With the heat on the last two weeks it´s liquified and looks just like it did originally but I haven´t engine tested it yet to see if it still really is BioD. Tom Irwin From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 19:44:42 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel tell me how long Biodiesel will keep after production.Keep it in an airtight vessel with only enough head space for thermal expansion and contraction and it will be sufficient beyond this time next year. More probably well beyond that. At least long enough for the fallout to settle, a season's worth of rains to soak it in and you to plant another crop so you can do whatever it is that you feel you must do that can't be done without an infernal combustion engine.Spec it to10 microns filtration and be happy. After that, it's not the sediment that will grab you by the short and curlies but the saturated esters (from animal fats and hydrogenated oils. Depending upon the parent stock, your filter could be throttled by "B-100" at temps as high as 40*F.Last time we rendered deer tallow and made biodiesel from it we were stonewalled after an overnight temp of 56*F.Todd SwearingenIan Theresa Sims wrote: Does anyone tell me how long Biodiesel will keep after production. Can someone clarify the final filter process after production. Some say 5 microns some say 10. Mike pelly's recipe dosn't seem to say anything about it? And how long should it stand or can you pour it straight in? Cheers Ian___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.5/67 - Release Date: 9/08/2005 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test
Jan, Thanks for the tip. We tried it and without stirring, there were clear yellow deposit on the bottom. The biodiesel did not disolve fully in the methanol like you said. So does this mean the next time I do another batch, I have to increase the methanol to the sodium? Any suggestion? Jeff From: Jan Warnqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 18:51:02 +0200 Hello Jeffery. The test method that you are using seems to me highly dubious, since there are a number of pre-assumptions that has to be met. For a further check I´d suggest this: Take exactly 25 ml of biodiesel and dissolve it in exactly 225 ml of methanol in a measuring glass. Now: The biodiesel should be fully soluble in the methanol forming a clear bright phase. If not, there is pollution in the biodiesel causing you trouble with the water test. Each ml of undissolved material is corresponding to 4% by volume. Are there any undissolved material at the bottom of the measuring glass ? If there is, your reaction is not complete and this is causing you trouble with the water test. This method does not cover every aspect of quality, but it gives a hint though Good luck to you Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:19 PM Subject: [Biofuel] Quality Test Hello all. Need some explanation and advise here on my experiments please. I have been using virgin cooking palm oil for the experiments. When following the steps for checking on quality, I put in 150ml of de ionised battery water and 150ml of the biodiesel obtained but the end result was clear yellowish liquid on top and white emulsion like on the bottom. I have done 3 different batches with the same result. My further reading and guess is either the NaOH is too much/little or the methanol is too much/little. My next step will probably to increase the methanol from 200ml to 400ml (my batches are in 1 liter of new oil). Any comments or suggestions from the gurus out there? Can I continue with the bubble washing process with the above 3 test batches? Jeff _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Diesel Price
Hi, for Belgium you can find prices on http://www.brandstofprijzen.be/ (in Dutch). On the main page you can find the current prices at the pump. These prices are the maximum prices as decided by the government. When you click on the left menu on officiele prijzen you'll have more details. stookolie means regular diesel, but with less taxes because this can only be used for heating your house. Unfortunatly those're not the retail prices, I also would like to see such a site :D Kind regards, Gregory - Oorspronkelijk bericht - Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag, augustus 12, 2005 04:51 AM Aan: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Onderwerp: [Biofuel] Diesel Price Dear All Is there a website that I can access that list the current price of diesel (at retail) in all the countries or most of the countries? Thanks Rgds Michael ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel
Hello Ian Hi Tom Let me see if I 've got this right. BD made with Animal fat solidifies at a higher temp than WVO? This could be handy info as a lot of the chippies here use lard.Fortunatley I think I've got onto a source of WVO. Diesel prices in NZ are now a $1 pL for your interest Have a read of this: Iodine Values -- High Iodine Values -- Talking about the weather http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield.html#iodine Best wishes Keith Ian - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Tom Irwin To: mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgBiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 1:56 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel Hi Ian and Theresa, Definitely have to agree with Todd here. I´ve been doing a lot of work making BioD from animal fat. It resolidifies at relatively high temperatures. I left 2 liters in a hood in my lab over winter break. They turn off the heat here cause we rarely get freezing temperatures. We have a few days down to about 5 degrees C and some as high as 22. When I returned to the lab it was chilly again and the BioD was a yellowish white solid. With the heat on the last two weeks it´s liquified and looks just like it did originally but I haven´t engine tested it yet to see if it still really is BioD. Tom Irwin From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 19:44:42 -0300 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel tell me how long Biodiesel will keep after production. Keep it in an airtight vessel with only enough head space for thermal expansion and contraction and it will be sufficient beyond this time next year. More probably well beyond that. At least long enough for the fallout to settle, a season's worth of rains to soak it in and you to plant another crop so you can do whatever it is that you feel you must do that can't be done without an infernal combustion engine. Spec it to10 microns filtration and be happy. After that, it's not the sediment that will grab you by the short and curlies but the saturated esters (from animal fats and hydrogenated oils. Depending upon the parent stock, your filter could be throttled by B-100 at temps as high as 40*F. Last time we rendered deer tallow and made biodiesel from it we were stonewalled after an overnight temp of 56*F. Todd Swearingen Ian Theresa Sims wrote: Does anyone tell me how long Biodiesel will keep after production. Can someone clarify the final filter process after production. Some say 5 microns some say 10. Mike pelly's recipe dosn't seem to say anything about it? And how long should it stand or can you pour it straight in? Cheers Ian ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Solar technique could lead to cleaner, cheaper hydrogen
News Published online: 4 August 2005; | doi:10.1038/news050801-11 Sunlight used to smelt zinc Mark Peplow Solar technique could lead to cleaner, cheaper hydrogen. The solar tower can produce temperatures up to 1,200 °C © Weizmann Inst. Scientists have found a way to harness the Sun's energy to extract zinc metal, which can then be used to produce hydrogen simply by pouring water over it. With improvements, the process may prove a cleaner, more efficient way of producing hydrogen for fuel-cell-powered vehicles, which would emit nothing more polluting than water. Current methods of producing hydrogen gas rely either on the fossil fuels they purport to replace, or water-splitting technology that has so far been too inefficient to deliver cheap hydrogen. It has long been known that metals such as zinc can release hydrogen from water. But purifying the metal is the hard part. The traditional method of obtaining zinc involves many chemical steps, baths of acid and masses of electricity. Researchers at the solar-powered plant at the Weizmann Institute of Science in Rehovot, Israel, have found a better way to deliver the metal. They use 64 seven-metre-wide mirrors to focus a beam of sunlight onto a tower containing the mineral zinc oxide and wood charcoal. The beam delivers 300 kilowatts of power, heating the chemical reactor up to 1,200 °C and delivering up to 50 kilograms of powdered zinc per hour. We have a lot of zinc powder available here for everyone. Michael Epstein Weizmann Institute We have a lot of zinc powder available here for everyone, laughs Michael Epstein, part of the Weizmann team. And this could be done on a very large scale, he adds. We can imagine solar plants around the Mediterranean producing zinc. As a bonus, he adds, the zinc should also be useful for making batteries. Epstein will present results from the SOLZINC project, which includes researchers from Switzerland, Sweden and France, on 8 August at the International Solar Energy Society conference in Orlando, Florida. Cleaning up The process isn't yet entirely clean. The zinc-forming reaction also releases carbon monoxide from the charcoal, which eventually converts to the greenhouse gas carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. In a full-scale industrial process, the carbon monoxide could be harnessed to help produce even more hydrogen from water. But this too would produce carbon dioxide. For now the process produces as much carbon dioxide as extracting the same amount of hydrogen from natural gas, Epstein says. But, he adds, the carbon in his reaction is a renewable resource rather than a fossil fuel. Eventually, the team hopes to replace charcoal with agricultural waste. AND, if they can get the solar mirrors to heat things up to 1,800 °C, they would be able to extract zinc without any carbon!!! Transport friendly It's an interesting option, says John Maddy, a hydrogen-power expert at the University of Glamorgan in Pontypridd, Wales. The work could be useful in sunny climes, he says. But, he adds, transporting either zinc or hydrogen over long distances is a major hurdle. I'm more of a advocate of local resources, says Maddy. The team is trying to produce other, lighter metals, such as magnesium, in the same way, although these require hotter temperatures to extract. If a clean way can be found to make these low-density metals, Epstein suggests, they could be used to produce hydrogen right in the tank of a car. That would remove the need to transport the gas altogether. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Bring land back from the dead
Greetings, I have some, but they are over 10 years old. The Literacy Volunteers of America will have them, or can get them. The directors use them for writing fund raising proposals and for raising awareness. Actually, anyone directly involved in literacy will have them. The Bedias literacy council is too small to afford to replace the ones we have, but I could find my old ones if they would help. Bright Blessings, Kim At 07:17 PM 8/11/2005, you wrote: Kim, where do I find such maps? I have tried Google, but, ended up with world maps, or nothing more than US demographic tables ( which were not very helpful ). Greg H. - Original Message - From: Garth Kim Travis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 7:00 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Bring land back from the dead Greetings, Get a map that shows illiteracy rates, anywhere that the rate is 40% or better you can find cheap land. Also, most of these areas have no or not enforced building codes. Bright Blessings, Kim ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test
Hello Jeffery, the clear phase at the bottom is likely unreacted oil. It seems likely that your oil has contaminations which inhibit the trans-esterification reaction. Do not change your recipe at first hand, get yourself a little oil that you know is OK, maybe from the supermarket and try your recipe on that one by following the instructions on YTF including the titration. When settled and washed go through the methanol extraction method again and compare the results. Get back to me and report. Add the recipe that you are working with too. Best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 11:52 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test Jan, Thanks for the tip. We tried it and without stirring, there were clear yellow deposit on the bottom. The biodiesel did not disolve fully in the methanol like you said. So does this mean the next time I do another batch, I have to increase the methanol to the sodium? Any suggestion? Jeff From: Jan Warnqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 18:51:02 +0200 Hello Jeffery. The test method that you are using seems to me highly dubious, since there are a number of pre-assumptions that has to be met. For a further check I´d suggest this: Take exactly 25 ml of biodiesel and dissolve it in exactly 225 ml of methanol in a measuring glass. Now: The biodiesel should be fully soluble in the methanol forming a clear bright phase. If not, there is pollution in the biodiesel causing you trouble with the water test. Each ml of undissolved material is corresponding to 4% by volume. Are there any undissolved material at the bottom of the measuring glass ? If there is, your reaction is not complete and this is causing you trouble with the water test. This method does not cover every aspect of quality, but it gives a hint though Good luck to you Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:19 PM Subject: [Biofuel] Quality Test Hello all. Need some explanation and advise here on my experiments please. I have been using virgin cooking palm oil for the experiments. When following the steps for checking on quality, I put in 150ml of de ionised battery water and 150ml of the biodiesel obtained but the end result was clear yellowish liquid on top and white emulsion like on the bottom. I have done 3 different batches with the same result. My further reading and guess is either the NaOH is too much/little or the methanol is too much/little. My next step will probably to increase the methanol from 200ml to 400ml (my batches are in 1 liter of new oil). Any comments or suggestions from the gurus out there? Can I continue with the bubble washing process with the above 3 test batches? Jeff _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] The Auto Industry's Last Hope
Oh, Ford and GM managed to sell most of what they have at cost - employee pricing unloading a flood of SUV's on the US just when gas is crusing towards 3,00 a gallon. Be interesting to see what happnes this year. They've staved of death for a bit, but their business model is not one that leads to success. Don't forget, they also chose the bet the farm on SUV's - that's one large factor. I agree about heath care - did anyone see the article on Finland in the Post? Michael Redler wrote: Since the Bush administration is proving itself to be one of the most destructive in American history, one might wonder what will happen if the citizens of this country begin to push the issue of renewable/sustainable energy through the influence of their own life choices (what they buy, what they eat, etc.). Will Bush's spin doctors begin to hijack a legacy that they made every effort to destroy? I'm not vindictive. I just want an accurate account of what happened so that history may teach future generations. ...OK, maybe I would like a little can of whoop-ass opened on dubya just to return the favor. Mike */Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Well, this is a bit of a half-baked response to Detroit deterioration: The Bush administration has a choice. It can preside over the dissolution of what remains of the U.S. auto industry or it can take the first steps toward a national solution for the health care cost crisis that is distorting labor markets, driving down disposable income, leaving millions of Americans without health care and creating the largest competitive disadvantage that U.S. companies now face Ford is sitting on an inventory of 900,000 vehicles. Fewer people are finding cash to buy. The cars being sold are gas hogs. And the author only points out that Bush has a choice, referring to reducing health care costs? Somebody swat Mr. Tarpinian and put him back in his playpen. Imports are taking over market share for one very simple reason - fuel economy. If Bush can't get off his ass and lend some assistance and enticement to get Detroit to change what it keeps cranking out, he's going to be presiding over a number of corporate funerals before his term is up. (Didn't I say just the other day that it would take less than three years? My how time flies) But I guess we should all be thankful, huh? Surely we're much better off now than we were five and one-half years ago, right? Todd Swearingen ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test
Try increasing the temp of the methanol. Some saturated fatty acids gel at reasonably high temperatures, even in the 50's and 60's. . Jeffrey Tan wrote: Jan, Thanks for the tip. We tried it and without stirring, there were clear yellow deposit on the bottom. The biodiesel did not disolve fully in the methanol like you said. So does this mean the next time I do another batch, I have to increase the methanol to the sodium? Any suggestion? Jeff From: Jan Warnqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Quality Test Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 18:51:02 +0200 Hello Jeffery. The test method that you are using seems to me highly dubious, since there are a number of pre-assumptions that has to be met. For a further check I´d suggest this: Take exactly 25 ml of biodiesel and dissolve it in exactly 225 ml of methanol in a measuring glass. Now: The biodiesel should be fully soluble in the methanol forming a clear bright phase. If not, there is pollution in the biodiesel causing you trouble with the water test. Each ml of undissolved material is corresponding to 4% by volume. Are there any undissolved material at the bottom of the measuring glass ? If there is, your reaction is not complete and this is causing you trouble with the water test. This method does not cover every aspect of quality, but it gives a hint though Good luck to you Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:19 PM Subject: [Biofuel] Quality Test Hello all. Need some explanation and advise here on my experiments please. I have been using virgin cooking palm oil for the experiments. When following the steps for checking on quality, I put in 150ml of de ionised battery water and 150ml of the biodiesel obtained but the end result was clear yellowish liquid on top and white emulsion like on the bottom. I have done 3 different batches with the same result. My further reading and guess is either the NaOH is too much/little or the methanol is too much/little. My next step will probably to increase the methanol from 200ml to 400ml (my batches are in 1 liter of new oil). Any comments or suggestions from the gurus out there? Can I continue with the bubble washing process with the above 3 test batches? Jeff _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Auto Industry's Last Hope
Michael, You omit the part of the bell curve where people first stop spending, doing away with their lavishness, avarice, excess and programmed purchases as a result of personal examination of what can be dispensed with. A $2.00 pot of pot of stew or beans that will feed six starts to look rather appealing in comparison to $15 dollar roasts. That type of activity will carry on for a considerable period before people even begin to think that they are healing well enough for energy efficient replacement windows and insulation for their house (no matter if they get rebates or the measures pay for themselves in a matter of months), much less start drooling over the glossy adds for a new VW TDI or whatever the gasoline equivalent is, solar panels and front loading washing machines. The only impetus that Bush lends to the plus side of the equation is that his ignorance, arrogance and poor fiscal management will force the nation and an entire globe to rethink. Hopefully they choose to permanently throttle the stupidity he perpetuates. Todd Swearingen Michael Redler wrote: Since the Bush administration is proving itself to be one of the most destructive in American history, one might wonder what will happen if the citizens of this country begin to push the issue of renewable/sustainable energy through the influence of their own life choices (what they buy, what they eat, etc.). Will Bush's spin doctors begin to hijack a legacy that they made every effort to destroy? I'm not vindictive. I just want an accurate account of what happened so that history may teach future generations. ...OK, maybe I would like a little can of whoop-ass opened on dubya just to return the favor. Mike */Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Well, this is a bit of a half-baked response to Detroit deterioration: The Bush administration has a choice. It can preside over the dissolution of what remains of the U.S. auto industry or it can take the first steps toward a national solution for the health care cost crisis that is distorting labor markets, driving down disposable income, leaving millions of Americans without health care and creating the largest competitive disadvantage that U.S. companies now face Ford is sitting on an inventory of 900,000 vehicles. Fewer people are finding cash to buy. The cars being sold are gas hogs. And the author only points out that Bush has a choice, referring to reducing health care costs? Somebody swat Mr. Tarpinian and put him back in his playpen. Imports are taking over market share for one very simple reason - fuel economy. If Bush can't get off his ass and lend some assistance and enticement to get Detroit to change what it keeps cranking out, he's going to be presiding over a number of corporate funerals before his term is up. (Didn't I say just the other day that it would take less than three years? My how time flies) But I guess we should all be thankful, huh? Surely we're much better off now than we were five and one-half years ago, right? Todd Swearingen ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable World Coming
Yes let's have a good revolt. Starting today. I'm in. Joe Ken Provost wrote: on 8/11/05 6:01 PM, Michael Redler at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: how can anyone not believe that a worldwide revolt is in the future of us or our children unless there is a spike in public education - soon? Maybe education will HELP the revolt/revolution. The more I understand what's happening, the more revolted I feel. Maybe that means something on a broader scale, vis-a-vis Revolution. -K ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] RE: jelly and jellybiofuel
Velen bedankt, maar in een 3rde Wereld dorpje is wallpaperglue nie so maklik te vind, en jy kan dit ook nie maklik self maak van locally available renewable resources. Veel dank, maar in een 3e wereld dorpje is behangplaksel niet zo makkelijk te vinden en je kan dit ook niet makkelijk zelf maken van plaatselijk herbruikbare materialen. Wanneer het jy al ooit erger Nederlands dan die gelesen?!! LOL! Maar miskien kan u dit verstaan... Wanneer heb je zulk slecht Nederlands gelezen ? Maar misschien kun je dit begrijpen. Nee Keith, ik maak geen grapje. Sommige mensen op deze wereld denken dat Nederland de hoofdstad van Denemarken is. Je moet al Nederlandstalig opgegroeid zijn, anders is het erg moeilijk om de taal te leren. Met vriendelijke groet, Pieter Koole ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
Why "wash" it out? Why not evaporate it and recover it, even as small a value as it is, rather than flush it with the wash water? Actually, that's what I was asking about when I mentioned distilling the BD. Do you have the apparatus you are talking about? It sounds like a rather complicated series of heat exchangers. I certainly don't have the space for that at the moment, but I am making a condenser to recover BD from the glycerine level. Is there info anywhere on how much of this I should expect to retrieve? Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
I could be wrong, but I wonder when Joshua last made biodiesel. Have a look at this:http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg35652.htmlRe: [biofuel] Best Processer Okay then, here's a question. Why don't you write a book? I mean you're a journalist,andjournalists write things. And right or wrong, most people give more credibility to books than the internet. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
Howdy Todd, just a tiny correction, lest anybody get confused: Epsom salt is hydrated magnesium _sulfate_ not sulfide. Regardless, your advice is sound as always. Appal Energy wrote: His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out Why wash it out? Why not evaporate it and recover it, even as small a value as it is, rather than flush it with the wash water? I'll leave the energy and bio-accumlation numbers to the slide rule folks, but in an efficient setup, the energy used to recover the methanol from the biodiesel fraction can be used to raise the temperature of the feedstock for the next batch to the reaction level. Presume you have a 160* evaporation temperature and the incoming feedstock is 70*. In a perfect world half of that difference can be transferred to the incoming oil, raising it to 115*. Go one step further when drying washed fuel, which may have a pre-dried temp of 70*F. The diff between 115* and 70* would raise the fuel back up to approximately 90*. The wash water is not waste, when all is said and done. It's irrigation. Recover the soaps by using aluminum or magnesium sulfide (epsom salt), which converts the water soluble soaps to non-soluble greases. These have an energy content that can be recovered in a solid fuels boiler. Or, you can grease the axles of your Sunday-go-to-meetin' buggy. The water can then be applied as gray water irrigation. The sulfur content would have to be monitored. But there are crops that tend to rather like sulfur to a small degree. At the same time the recovered catalyst (converted to fertilizer) can be diluted and dispersed with the gray water. That leaves only the glycerol, either to sell or disperse with the treated wash water, as the recovered FFAs are returned to the acid cycle or used as boiler fuel. Todd Swearingen skapegoat wrote: I did notice that a lot of the chemistry in the book was wrong. His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out. He does recommend not using BD with certain types of tubes, as the methanol will destroy it. I am certainly planning on washing my BD, I just wonder if he's had any problems in the ten or more years he's been making his without washing it. I know about the chemical equilibrium, and not to try to remove methanol until the layers are seperated. I'm just wondering if Tickell is so worried about wasting the methanol by washing it out if there is a better way of retrieving it without worrying about leaving all that other garbage in your BD. */Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Greetings the skapegoat The JTF website strongly recommends washing and the Josh Tickell book seems to suggest it isn't necessary and possibly even detrimental. Bad book! See: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/31729/ You might also note that the JtF website says why it strongly recommends washing, with a couple of references provided (there could have been plenty more): http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#why Washing: Why bother? IIRC Joshua Tickell provides one obscure and outdated reference. Rudi Weidegger of FuelMeister fame (or infamy), who Joshua's since teamed up with, also recommends no washing and says it's bad for your motor, with no references, but then he doesn't provide a washtank in his exorbitant set-up. Ho-hum. Anyway, to believe that you'd have to believe that all the national standards are based on nothing. Some people do seem to believe that. That's their business, as long as they keep their crappy fuel to themselves. I'm interested in some insight on this difference of opinion. I'm sure most experienced biodieselers here wash their biodiesel. Would it be worthwhile to distill the methanol from the biodiesel instead of just washing it away? The most convenient stage to reclaim the excess methanol would be immediately after the processing, when the mix is still hot. Unfortunately that means you reverse the very reaction you've just completed (hopefully completed). You have to settle and separate the glycerine by-product first. Most of the excess methanol is in the by-product; the small proportion in the biodiesel can be recovered, if you can find an economical way of doing it. I know this still leaves excess hydroxides And soaps. that still need to be washed out, but it might reduce the number of washes necessary Doubtful. and you might be able to save some of your methanol. Indeed. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel
Ian Theresa Sims a écrit : (...) Diesel prices in NZ are now a $1 pL for your interest over € 1,1 in Belgium and France (source : tvbe [belgium sat tv] yesterday night) fd ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Diesel Price
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Dear All Is there a website that I can access that list the current price of diesel (at retail) in all the countries or most of the countries? Dear alone, Many sites found by google Among them, for Europe, several in English and... concerning the English (but EU neighbours as well) This brittish one, (june 2005) http://www.aaroadwatch.ie/eupetrolprices/ another in pence per liter (updated feb 2005) http://www.see-search.com/business/fuelandpetrolpriceseurope.htm another from Britannia, updated June 2005 with prices in Euro http://www.day-tripper.net/pricespetrol.html anothers http://www.theaa.com/allaboutcars/fuel/ http://europe.tiscali.co.uk/index.jsp?section=moneylevel=previewcontent=230663 and comments from an american about prices and taxes http://wais.stanford.edu/ztopics/week040105/energy_050401_gasolinepricesusvseurope.htm ... frantz ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable World Coming
Hi all and Mike, In a way, this site is part of the revolution already. By sharing what we know with each other we defeat those who wish to monopolize information and knowlegde for greedy purposes. Sure there are those of us who have businesses and will profit by our work. We're talking companies and famly owned busnesses, real free enterprise. We search for and utilize sustainable methods for the long term. Most here if not all are not interested in making the fast dollar. Our bottom line is determined by calculating all costs including the human and the environmental. We may not have the great sums of money corpoartions have but we can move more quickly because we are not burdened by huge size. It's simple to turn a canoe around to the right path and requires little space. This is not so for aircraft carriers. We can outcompete the corpoartions by not selling out, having long term planning, a greater spirit of ownership and stewardship, better innovation and higher yield and growth by seeking out and helping individuals succeed, Finally when united we can beat them at the ballot box, if we continue to get our message of sustainable development out. Corporation like big chemical and big oil are dinosaurs and we all know what happened to them during the last big climate change. Tom Irwin From: Michael Redler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:01:00 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable World Coming "Tewolde warned against GM crops that represent a further decrease in diversity and an increase in the privatisation of nature." The thing I'm trying to wrap my mind around is the idea of nearly everything becoming someone else's intellectual property. That is to say, if a company has the "legal" authority to tell us what we can and can't do with food, how does a government (not of, by,or for the people) enforce it without a police-state? Furthermore, if revolutions can start with a bread revolt, what happenswhen the government not only controls the entire food supply, but literallytakes food away from you because you "broke the law"? With multinational corporations currently taking over governments and beginning to take control of the food supply, how can anyone not believe that a worldwide revolt is in the future of us or our children unless there is a spike in public education - soon? Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Hirsch report on peak oil
Half a year after its release, the Hirsch report on peak oil written for the US Dept of Energy has not been published. You can find it on the site below, as well as many other articles related to oil and energy. http://globalpublicmedia.com/ Scroll down and click on: Where Is the Hirsch Report? Marilyn ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable World Coming
"Corporation like big chemical and big oil are dinosaurs and we all know what happened to them during the last big climate change." I like that analogy. MikeTom Irwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all and Mike, In a way, this site is part of the revolution already. By sharing what we know with each other we defeat those who wish to monopolize information and knowlegde for greedy purposes. Sure there are those of us who have businesses and will profit by our work. We're talking companies and famly owned busnesses, real free enterprise. We search for and utilize sustainable methods for the long term. Most here if not all are not interested in making the fast dollar. Our bottom line is determined by calculating all costs including the human and the environmental. We may not have the great sums of money corpoartions have but we can move more quickly because we are not burdened by huge size. It's simple to turn a canoe around to the right path and requires little space. This is not so for aircraft carriers. We can outcompete the corpoartions by not selling out, having long term planning, a greater spirit of ownership and stewardship, better innovation and higher yield and growth by seeking out and helping individuals succeed, Finally when united we can beat them at the ballot box, if we continue to get our message of sustainable development out. Corporation like big chemical and big oil are dinosaurs and we all know what happened to them during the last big climate change. Tom Irwin From: Michael Redler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:01:00 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable World Coming "Tewolde warned against GM crops that represent a further decrease in diversity and an increase in the privatisation of nature." The thing I'm trying to wrap my mind around is the idea of nearly everything becoming someone else's intellectual property. That is to say, if a company has the "legal" authority to tell us what we can and can't do with food, how does a government (not of, by,or for the people) enforce it without a police-state? Furthermore, if revolutions can start with a bread revolt, what happenswhen the government not only controls the entire food supply, but literallytakes food away from you because you "broke the law"? With multinational corporations currently taking over governments and beginning to take control of the food supply, how can anyone not believe that a worldwide revolt is in the future of us or our children unless there is a spike in public education - soon? Mike ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Feeling of humiliation and lack of power
Sorry for your loos Hakan I now something about, at home I loose a drill and some others and tools just five weeks ago. But remember: time is a good medicine Well done Foxy! Regards: Sven ___ Mecánica Agrícola Fac. Cs. Agrarias - UNCuyo e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
Thank you Bob. I'm mentally frayed this week. Lucky the wine cask is empty or I'd be plopped down right next to it. Todd Swearingen bob allen wrote: Howdy Todd, just a tiny correction, lest anybody get confused: Epsom salt is hydrated magnesium _sulfate_ not sulfide. Regardless, your advice is sound as always. Appal Energy wrote: His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out Why wash it out? Why not evaporate it and recover it, even as small a value as it is, rather than flush it with the wash water? I'll leave the energy and bio-accumlation numbers to the slide rule folks, but in an efficient setup, the energy used to recover the methanol from the biodiesel fraction can be used to raise the temperature of the feedstock for the next batch to the reaction level. Presume you have a 160* evaporation temperature and the incoming feedstock is 70*. In a perfect world half of that difference can be transferred to the incoming oil, raising it to 115*. Go one step further when drying washed fuel, which may have a pre-dried temp of 70*F. The diff between 115* and 70* would raise the fuel back up to approximately 90*. The wash water is not waste, when all is said and done. It's irrigation. Recover the soaps by using aluminum or magnesium sulfide (epsom salt), which converts the water soluble soaps to non-soluble greases. These have an energy content that can be recovered in a solid fuels boiler. Or, you can grease the axles of your Sunday-go-to-meetin' buggy. The water can then be applied as gray water irrigation. The sulfur content would have to be monitored. But there are crops that tend to rather like sulfur to a small degree. At the same time the recovered catalyst (converted to fertilizer) can be diluted and dispersed with the gray water. That leaves only the glycerol, either to sell or disperse with the treated wash water, as the recovered FFAs are returned to the acid cycle or used as boiler fuel. Todd Swearingen skapegoat wrote: I did notice that a lot of the chemistry in the book was wrong. His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out. He does recommend not using BD with certain types of tubes, as the methanol will destroy it. I am certainly planning on washing my BD, I just wonder if he's had any problems in the ten or more years he's been making his without washing it. I know about the chemical equilibrium, and not to try to remove methanol until the layers are seperated. I'm just wondering if Tickell is so worried about wasting the methanol by washing it out if there is a better way of retrieving it without worrying about leaving all that other garbage in your BD. */Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Greetings the skapegoat The JTF website strongly recommends washing and the Josh Tickell book seems to suggest it isn't necessary and possibly even detrimental. Bad book! See: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/31729/ You might also note that the JtF website says why it strongly recommends washing, with a couple of references provided (there could have been plenty more): http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#why Washing: Why bother? IIRC Joshua Tickell provides one obscure and outdated reference. Rudi Weidegger of FuelMeister fame (or infamy), who Joshua's since teamed up with, also recommends no washing and says it's bad for your motor, with no references, but then he doesn't provide a washtank in his exorbitant set-up. Ho-hum. Anyway, to believe that you'd have to believe that all the national standards are based on nothing. Some people do seem to believe that. That's their business, as long as they keep their crappy fuel to themselves. I'm interested in some insight on this difference of opinion. I'm sure most experienced biodieselers here wash their biodiesel. Would it be worthwhile to distill the methanol from the biodiesel instead of just washing it away? The most convenient stage to reclaim the excess methanol would be immediately after the processing, when the mix is still hot. Unfortunately that means you reverse the very reaction you've just completed (hopefully completed). You have to settle and separate the glycerine by-product first. Most of the excess methanol is in the by-product; the small proportion in the biodiesel can be recovered, if you can find an economical way of doing it. I know this still leaves excess hydroxides And soaps. that still need to be washed out, but it might reduce the number of washes necessary Doubtful. and you might be able to save some of your methanol. Indeed. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list
Re: [Biofuel] The Auto Industry's Last Hope
Hi all, Does this mean that the most Republicans were wrong about market driven health care and Hilary Clinton was right? Maybe not but it sure seems that way, doesn't it. Tom Irwin From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 16:28:15 -0300Subject: [Biofuel] The Auto Industry's Last Hopehttp://www.tompaine.com/articles/20050811/the_auto_industrys_last_hope.phpThe Auto Industry's Last HopeGreg TarpinianAugust 11, 2005Greg Tarpinian is the president and executive director, Labor Research Association, a New York City-based non-profit research and advocacy organization that provides research and educational services for trade unions.After pushing one of the largest companies in the world to the brink of disaster, General Motors executives began their annual meeting with UAW leaders on April 14 with plans to intensify their push for health care benefit cuts.GM announced on March 16 that it would report an $850 million loss for the first quarter of 2005 and earn $1 to $2 per share for the year, down from its earlier forecast of $4 to $5 per share. The company's cash flow is a negative $2 billion. GM's bonds now are rated just above junk, and it still owes billions to its underfunded pension and retiree health plans.Ford cut its profit forecast for the year by 14 percent on April 8 and announced that it will not meet its 2006 goal of $7 billion in pretax profit. Ratings agencies are now poised to downgrade Ford's credit too.Both companies will cut production and accelerate layoffs for their white-collar workers. GM's salaried workforce has already been hit with substantial job cuts, wage freezes and higher benefit contributions.There is no ready solution for the financial problems that may easily overwhelm these companies. Ford is sitting on an inventory of almost 900,000 vehicles; GM faces substantial overcapacity. Although GM executives continue to claim that they can regain market share, industry analysts uniformly agree that GM and Ford have permanently lost their positions as the leading car companies in the United States U.S. market share for the American automakers fell from 65 percent in 1994 to 42 percent last year. Toyota displaced Ford as the second-largest car seller in the country for reasons that have nothing to do with Ford's higher benefit costs. The U.S. automakers have been digging their own graves for years, but GM faces the highest costs because of its misguided expansion two decades ago. The U.S. automakers have squandered market share and mismanaged resources, but would like to blame benefit costs for the financial crisis they have been courting for two decades.The financial crisis born of mismanagement leaves the companies facing costs they cannot cover, including health care costs.GM paid out $5.2 billion for health care benefits in 2004 and expects to pay out $5.8 billion this year. These benefit costs are part of the total compensation negotiated in union contracts that traded what would have been higher wage increases for better benefit provisions.Health benefits, including retiree benefits, are simply wages delivered in a different form or, in the case of retirees, deferred for payment later. The U.S. automakers are now pressing for the equivalent of a wage cut for its union workers and take-backs from its retirees.The costs have been exacerbated by the unwillingness of the Bush administration and Congress to address the catastrophic rise of health care costs in the United States. GM's $73 billion liability for retiree health benefits could be covered three times over by the amount the United States squanders every year on administrative costs for its private health care system.China and India will begin exporting cars to the United States within the next few years. Carmakers in both countries benefit from national health care systems that pay for employee benefits with public funds.The U.S. automakers are moving more production to Canada where a national health care program provides coverage for workers and their families for less than one-fifth of the cost of health benefits on the U.S. side of the border.Benefit costs account for 28.8 percent of compensation costs for private sector production workers in the United States, compared with 17.0 percent in Japan, 16.6 percent in Canada and 17.6 percent in the United Kingdom. Three-fourths of the difference in benefit costs stems from the private health insurance system in the United StatesThe Bush administration has a choice. It can preside over the dissolution of what remains of the U.S. auto industry or it can take the first steps toward a national solution for the health care cost crisis that is distorting labor markets, driving down disposable income, leaving millions of Americans without health care and creating the largest competitive disadvantage that U.S. companies now face.___Biofuel mailing
[Biofuel] Medical system was The Auto Industry's Last Hope
Greetings, Actually they are both wrong. As long as the biggest contributors to the cost of medical education are the drug companies, health care will be a problem. They do not teach health in the medical schools, they teach curing disease which is not the same thing. Knowledge of good nutrition is extremely rare, healthy eating habits are rarer. The problem is not the health system, but the food. JTF has lots of real good information on this in the smalls farms library. The information is not new, but few people are interested in being healthy, they would rather follow trends. Bright Blessings, Kim At 12:53 PM 8/12/2005, you wrote: Hi all, Does this mean that the most Republicans were wrong about market driven health care and Hilary Clinton was right? Maybe not but it sure seems that way, doesn't it. Tom Irwin From: Keith Addison [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 16:28:15 -0300 Subject: [Biofuel] The Auto Industry's Last Hope http://www.tompaine.com/articles/20050811/the_auto_industrys_last_hope.php The Auto Industry's Last Hope Greg Tarpinian August 11, 2005 Greg Tarpinian is the president and executive director, Labor Research Association, a New York City-based non-profit research and advocacy organization that provides research and educational services for trade unions. After pushing one of the largest companies in the world to the brink of disaster, General Motors executives began their annual meeting with UAW leaders on April 14 with plans to intensify their push for health care benefit cuts. GM announced on March 16 that it would report an $850 million loss for the first quarter of 2005 and earn $1 to $2 per share for the year, down from its earlier forecast of $4 to $5 per share. The company's cash flow is a negative $2 billion. GM's bonds now are rated just above junk, and it still owes billions to its underfunded pension and retiree health plans. Ford cut its profit forecast for the year by 14 percent on April 8 and announced that it will not meet its 2006 goal of $7 billion in pretax profit. Ratings agencies are now poised to downgrade Ford's credit too. Both companies will cut production and accelerate layoffs for their white-collar workers. GM's salaried workforce has already been hit with substantial job cuts, wage freezes and higher benefit contributions. There is no ready solution for the financial problems that may easily overwhelm these companies. Ford is sitting on an inventory of almost 900,000 vehicles; GM faces substantial overcapacity. Although GM executives continue to claim that they can regain market share, industry analysts uniformly agree that GM and Ford have permanently lost their positions as the leading car companies in the United States U.S. market share for the American automakers fell from 65 percent in 1994 to 42 percent last year. Toyota displaced Ford as the second-largest car seller in the country for reasons that have nothing to do with Ford's higher benefit costs. The U.S. automakers have been digging their own graves for years, but GM faces the highest costs because of its misguided expansion two decades ago. The U.S. automakers have squandered market share and mismanaged resources, but would like to blame benefit costs for the financial crisis they have been courting for two decades. The financial crisis born of mismanagement leaves the companies facing costs they cannot cover, including health care costs. GM paid out $5.2 billion for health care benefits in 2004 and expects to pay out $5.8 billion this year. These benefit costs are part of the total compensation negotiated in union contracts that traded what would have been higher wage increases for better benefit provisions. Health benefits, including retiree benefits, are simply wages delivered in a different form or, in the case of retirees, deferred for payment later. The U.S. automakers are now pressing for the equivalent of a wage cut for its union workers and take-backs from its retirees. The costs have been exacerbated by the unwillingness of the Bush administration and Congress to address the catastrophic rise of health care costs in the United States. GM's $73 billion liability for retiree health benefits could be covered three times over by the amount the United States squanders every year on administrative costs for its private health care system. China and India will begin exporting cars to the United States within the next few years. Carmakers in both countries benefit from national health care systems that pay for employee benefits with public funds. The U.S. automakers are moving more production to Canada where a national health care program provides coverage for workers and their families for less than one-fifth of the cost of health benefits on the U.S. side of the border. Benefit costs account for 28.8 percent of
[Biofuel] Too Much of Nothing
http://www.fpif.org/fpiftxt/176 Foreign Policy In Focus | Commentary | Too Much of Nothing By Tom Athanasiou | August 01, 2005 Editor: John Gershman, IRC Foreign Policy In Focus www.fpif.org Oh, when there's too much of nothing, No one has control. Bob Dylan It's getting harder to hide the climate crisis. February, for example, saw a landmark conference1 in which leading scientists, one after the other, stepped forward to draw a clear, unambiguous line. No more uncertainty for these guys. As John Schellnhuber, director of Cambridge's Tyndall Centre for Climate Change, put it: We now know that if we go beyond two degrees we will raise hell. Note to Americans: he means 2 degrees Centigrade. Which, since the warming already clocks in at 0.7C, gives us about 1.3C to go, with an additional half degree, or more, already locked in. And beyond 2C degrees, which is, alas, exactly where we're headed, the projections pass from grim to terrifying. Which means that not only do global carbon emissions have to drop, soon and substantially, but so does the atmospheric carbon concentration itself, which has already passed the highest point that can be plausibly called safe. And it has to do so while the developing world, well develops. If, of course, we want to avoid hell. To help you decide, imagine the current global drought deepening, and settling in to stay; imagine 3 billion people, packed into Southern mega-cities, under severe water stress; imagine a loss of 1/3 or more of terrestrial species, including, of course, polar bears; and imagine the die-off of a drying Amazon. Imagine the melting of the Greenland and West Antarctic ice, and the rising of the oceans. Imagine, too, that development itself goes Up in Smoke.2 Do so because global warming threatens to make the international targets on halving global poverty by 2015, the Millennium Development Goals, entirely unattainable. No wonder, as all this seeps gradually into our resistant minds, we're getting a wee bit alarmed. We have, in effect, run out over the edge of the cliff, and just now, like Wiley Coyote tempting the laws of physics, we're looking down. The G8 (plus 5) Obviously, this situation requires a global response. What seems less obvious, at least among the elites, is that this can't be a business-as-usual response in which the climate crisis becomes just another excuse for strengthening the winds of neoliberalism. The stakes would be clearer if it weren't for the Bush regime. Because, frankly, even neoliberalism-especially the European sort-can look pretty good when compared to the kind of fundamentalism now being exported from Washington. Case in point: Tony Blair, and his attempt to focus the recent G8 summit on two areas, climate change and Africa, that rarely rise to the top of the elite agenda. Was this an attempt to cover over the stench of his Iraq policies? Absolutely. But the question here is if, whatever his motivation, he accomplished anything useful. Did he, in particular, manage to accomplish anything at the G8 summit? Plenty of voices say he did, particularly on the debt relief side, though he clearly failed in his (currently pointless) effort to bring the United States back into the international climate regime. Even on the climate front, however, the optimists cite Mr. Bush's acknowledgement that climate change is real, and that human activities lay beneath a significant fraction of the recent warming. In fact, however, it wasn't Blair who won the point here; it was the scientists, who with the help of some recently extreme weather have begun to drive the denialists back toward their holes. And it was the climate movement itself, which is weaving initiatives at every level-local, regional, national, and international-into a net that even GOP realists know they can't avoid much longer.3 The real action, though-and this gets us back to neo-liberalism, and geo-politics as usual-is the one where the rich world and the poor world circle each other on the global playing field, each working towards a climate regime that, somehow, satisfies their national interests. Here, the big news at the G8 summit was the attendance of high-level representatives from Brazil, China, India, Mexico, and South Africa, and the summit's concluding plans for a dialogue with these same countries that will continue, quietly, before the next session of the formal climate negotiations this November in Montreal. This was interesting. Because if we're going to avoid global climate catastrophe, we're going to do it by way of a new future in which the South takes a low-carbon path. Everyone (serious) knows this, though when it comes to the shape of this new future, and the best strategy for pursuing it, the consensus immediately breaks down. The Europeans want real engagement with the South, at meetings that begin with clear-eyed, cold-coffee presentations from the scientists,
[Biofuel] Warming Hits 'Tipping Point'
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0811-03.htm Published on Thursday, August 11, 2005 by the Guardian/UK Warming Hits 'Tipping Point' Siberia feels the heat: A frozen peat bog the size of France and Germany combined contains billions of tonnes of greenhouse gas, and for the first time since the ice age, it is melting. By Ian Sample A vast expanse of western Siberia is undergoing an unprecedented thaw that could dramatically increase the rate of global warming, climate scientists warn today. If we don't take action very soon, we could unleash runaway global warming that will be beyond our control and it will lead to social, economic and environmental devastation worldwide. Tony Juniper, director of Friends of the Earth Researchers who have recently returned from the region found that an area of permafrost spanning a million square kilometers - the size of France and Germany combined - has started to melt for the first time since it formed 11,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age. The area, which covers the entire sub-Arctic region of western Siberia, is the world's largest frozen peat bog and scientists fear that as it thaws, it will release billions of tonnes of methane, a greenhouse gas 20 times more potent than carbon dioxide, into the atmosphere. It is a scenario climate scientists have feared since first identifying tipping points - delicate thresholds where a slight rise in the Earth's temperature can cause a dramatic change in the environment that itself triggers a far greater increase in global temperatures. The discovery was made by Sergei Kirpotin at Tomsk State University in western Siberia and Judith Marquand at Oxford University and is reported in New Scientist today. The researchers found that what was until recently a barren expanse of frozen peat is turning into a broken landscape of mud and lakes, some more than a kilometer across. Dr Kirpotin told the magazine the situation was an ecological landslide that is probably irreversible and is undoubtedly connected to climatic warming. He added that the thaw had probably begun in the past three or four years. Climate scientists yesterday reacted with alarm to the finding, and warned that predictions of future global temperatures would have to be revised upwards. When you start messing around with these natural systems, you can end up in situations where it's unstoppable. There are no brakes you can apply, said David Viner, a senior scientist at the Climatic Research Unit at the University of East Anglia. This is a big deal because you can't put the permafrost back once it's gone. The causal effect is human activity and it will ramp up temperatures even more than our emissions are doing. In its last major report in 2001, the intergovernmental panel on climate change predicted a rise in global temperatures of 1.4C-5.8C between 1990 and 2100, but the estimate only takes account of global warming driven by known greenhouse gas emissions. These positive feedbacks with landmasses weren't known about then. They had no idea how much they would add to global warming, said Dr Viner. Western Siberia is heating up faster than anywhere else in the world, having experienced a rise of some 3C in the past 40 years. Scientists are particularly concerned about the permafrost, because as it thaws, it reveals bare ground which warms up more quickly than ice and snow, and so accelerates the rate at which the permafrost thaws. Siberia's peat bogs have been producing methane since they formed at the end of the last ice age, but most of the gas had been trapped in the permafrost. According to Larry Smith, a hydrologist at the University of California, Los Angeles, the west Siberian peat bog could hold some 70bn tons of methane, a quarter of all of the methane stored in the ground around the world. The permafrost is likely to take many decades at least to thaw, so the methane locked within it will not be released into the atmosphere in one burst, said Stephen Sitch, a climate scientist at the Met Office's Hadley Center in Exeter. But calculations by Dr Sitch and his colleagues show that even if methane seeped from the permafrost over the next 100 years, it would add around 700m tons of carbon into the atmosphere each year, roughly the same amount that is released annually from the world's wetlands and agriculture. It would effectively double atmospheric levels of the gas, leading to a 10% to 25% increase in global warming, he said. Tony Juniper, director of Friends of the Earth, said the finding was a stark message to politicians to take concerted action on climate change. We knew at some point we'd get these feedbacks happening that exacerbate global warming, but this could lead to a massive injection of greenhouse gases. If we don't take action very soon, we could unleash runaway global warming that will be beyond our control and it will lead to social,
[Biofuel] EPA Holds Back Report on Car Fuel Efficiency
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/072805Q.shtml t r u t h o u t - EPA Holds Back Report on Car Fuel Efficiency By Danny Hakim The New York Times Thursday 28 July 2005 Detroit - With Congress poised for a final vote on the energy bill, the Environmental Protection Agency made an 11th-hour decision Tuesday to delay the planned release of an annual report on fuel economy. But a copy of the report, embargoed for publication Wednesday, was sent to The New York Times by a member of the E.P.A. communications staff just minutes before the decision was made to delay it until next week. The contents of the report show that loopholes in American fuel economy regulations have allowed automakers to produce cars and trucks that are significantly less fuel-efficient, on average, than they were in the late 1980's. Releasing the report this week would have been inopportune for the Bush administration, its critics said, because it would have come on the eve of a final vote in Congress on energy legislation six years in the making. The bill, as it stands, largely ignores auto mileage regulations. The executive summary of the copy of the report obtained by The Times acknowledges that fuel economy is directly related to energy security, because consumer cars and trucks account for about 40 percent of the nation's oil consumption. But trends highlighted in the report show that carmakers are not making progress in improving fuel economy, and environmentalists say the energy bill will do little to prod them. Something's fishy when the Bush administration delays a report showing no improvement in fuel economy until after passage of their energy bill, which fails to improve fuel economy, said Daniel Becker, the Sierra Club's top global warming strategist. It's disturbing that despite high gas prices, an oil war and growing concern about global warming pollution, most automakers are failing to improve fuel economy. Eryn Witcher, a spokeswoman for the E.P.A., said the timing of the release of the report had nothing to do with the energy bill deliberations. We are committed to sharing our scientific studies with the public in the most comprehensive and understandable format possible, she said. Issue experts are reviewing the fuel economy data and we look forward to providing a summary of the information next week. Some of what the report says reaffirms what has long been known. Leaps in engine technology over the last couple of decades have been mostly used to make cars faster, not more fuel-efficient, and the rise of sport utility vehicles and S.U.V.-like pickup trucks has actually sapped efficiency. The average 2004 model car or truck got 20.8 miles per gallon, about 6 percent less than the 22.1 m.p.g. of the average new vehicle sold in the late 1980's, according to the report. At the same time, while General Motors and the Ford Motor Company are the most common targets of environmental groups, the E.P.A. report shows that several foreign automakers have had the sharpest declines in recent fuel economy performance as they move aggressively into the truck market. The average 2004 model sold by Nissan, Hyundai and Volkswagen was at least a half-mile a gallon less fuel-efficient than in the previous model year, a sharp drop. It's appalling that Nissan, V.W. and Hyundai are accelerating in reverse, Mr. Becker said. Kyle Bazemore, a Nissan spokesman, said the company's new large pickup truck, the Titan, and new large S.U.V.'s, like the Armada, clearly affected its overall results. In '03, we didn't have the Titan and Armada, he said. We've entered into new markets, but we feel we are doing it responsibly. John Krafcik, vice president of product development and corporate strategy at Hyundai, pointed out that his company sells relatively few S.U.V.'s but has recently increased its offerings. Car by car, we're improving fuel economy on every model in our range, he said. That's a more appropriate way to look at it. David Friedman, a research director at the Union of Concerned Scientists, an environmental group, disagreed. The 8.5 million barrels a day that American cars and trucks use have to do with the vehicles on the road, not the model-by-model comparisons, he said. What matters to our oil consumption is the fuel economy of the fleet on the road. Of the eight major automakers examined in the report, only G.M., Toyota and Honda showed increases in fuel efficiency in the 2004 model year, the most recent year for which hard sales data is available. Ford had the lowest mileage of the group. Honda, which does not sell the heaviest kinds of trucks, had the best overall mileage. Some foreign companies do not even trouble themselves to follow fuel economy regulations. BMW, in fact, has paid more than $70 million in fines since the 2000 model year for noncompliance. The company has
[Biofuel] Energy Bill Extends Oil-Wasting Fuel Economy Loophole
http://www.commondreams.org/news2005/0811-03.htm Public Citizen FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE AUGUST 11, 2005 11.43 AM CONTACT: Public Citizen (202) 588-1000 Energy Bill Extends Oil-Wasting Fuel Economy Loophole Legislation Shields Automakers From Legal Challenge, Will Increase Oil Consumption WASHINGTON - August 11 - A little-noticed provision in the energy bill signed Monday allots automakers bogus fuel economy credits for building cars capable of running on alternative fuel such as ethanol even if the cars almost always use gasoline. The provision nullifies a lawsuit filed by public interest groups against the Department of Transportation. The dual fuel loophole allows automakers to claim credit for producing dual fuel vehicles, boosting their fuel economy numbers on paper by as much as 1.2 miles per gallon. The loophole would increase U.S. gas consumption by 15 billion gallons over the life of its 10-year extension. The loophole was originally extended by the Department of Transportation and was challenged in 2004 in a lawsuit by Public Citizen, the Natural Resources Defense Council and the Center for Auto Safety. That lawsuit was dropped Wednesday after the dual fuel provision was signed into law. Originally intended to reduce oil consumption, the loophole was created to promote production of vehicles that can operate on 85 percent ethanol (E85) in addition to gasoline. But with few gas stations supplying E85 - only 221 of 176,000 in the United States - and with most dual fuel vehicle owners unaware that their vehicles take alternative fuel, nearly all drivers fill their dual fuel cars with gasoline only. A March 2002 Department of Transportation report found that dual fuel vehicles run on gasoline more than 99 percent of the time. Daimler/Chrysler has taken the greatest advantage of these phony mileage credits, boosting the fortunes of the oil-producing countries Dubai and Kuwait, which became the company's first and third largest private investors earlier this year. Ford and GM also have increasingly used these credits to avoid having to increase the fuel efficiency of pickup trucks and SUVs. Despite the rhetoric, the energy bill just moves the nation toward more oil use, not less, said Dan Lashof, science director for NRDC's Climate Center. Instead of helping Detroit catch up in the technology race, the bill gives automakers an accounting gimmick. Knowing that they couldn't defend the 'dual fuel' loophole in court, the Big Three ran to Congress, said Joan Claybrook, president of Public Citizen. Once again, Detroit is substituting lobbying clout for innovative engineering. Unable to continue their court challenge, Public Citizen, NRDC and the Center for Auto Safety will ask Congress to reform the dual fuel program so that any fuel economy credits reflect actual use of alternative fuel. The 'dual fuel' loophole can't withstand public scrutiny, said Clarence Ditlow, director of the Center for Auto Safety. The auto industry's friends in Congress hid the extension of this counterproductive program in a 1,700-page energy bill. This cries out for a correction. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Bush's Energy Disaster
http://www.alternet.org/envirohealth/23999/ Bush's Energy Disaster By Joshuah Bearman, LA Weekly. Posted August 11, 2005. The long-delayed energy bill signed into law last week will wreak havoc on the planet while padding the pockets of the oil industry. As the Senate cast its votes on the energy bill last Friday, giving Republicans a little legislative victory before everyone skipped town for the summer, Bush issued a congratulatory statement. I applaud Congress, he said, for a bill that will help secure our energy future and reduce our dependence on foreign sources of energy. A nice sentiment -- except that securing our energy future is the one thing the bill won't do. Then again, that was never the intention. This was Bush's baby from the start, the fruition of Cheney's infamous task force, to which he invited every industry honcho he could find to write their own tickets right into the country's energy policy. After that, of course, it was larded with extra tax breaks and subsidies, like $500 million in deep-water drilling that will likely wind up in Tom DeLay's hometown, Sugar Land, and billions more that will drain straight into industry coffers. This at a time when high oil prices are sending industry margins soaring: Exxon-Mobil's third quarter last year was the most profitable corporate earnings in history. Boone Pickens, head of BP Capital Management, a billion-dollar hedge fund that makes people wealthy trading energy futures and related investments, sums up the high times like so: I've never had so much fun in my life. But the giveaways are the least of the bill's problems. When both sides claim victory, it's a sure sign of mediocre legislation. Republicans got to line some pockets and call it economic progress. Democrats were able to shelve (for now) a few hot-button issues like the MTBE indemnity and drilling in ANWR. (And when barely derailing a raid on ANWR is considered a Democratic victory, it only shows how much the Republicans have been able to set the agenda.) Likewise, Republicans were able to take out the fuel-efficiency standards and global-warming language that so offended them. In the end, the energy bill was a hodgepodge, a collection of provisions with no vision. The problem is we need vision with energy most of all. Because there will come a day, sometime fairly soon, when a barrel of light, sweet crude will emerge from some oil field and the world will have officially burned more oil than what's left in the ground. That moment -- peak oil, it's called -- is not a question of if but when: Some say the tap-out starts out in 30 years; Exxon-Mobil's own recently published estimate says five; one Princeton geologist says maybe next year. When it does happen, it may not be celebrated, or even noticed right away, but it will mark the beginning of the long slide to an inevitable reconfiguration of, well, civilization as we know it. If that sounds alarmist, recall that our vast economy of just-in-time, transnationally shipped inventory is fueled entirely by petroleum. As is our food supply, whose end products like poultry and beef are elaborate (and remarkably inefficient) conversions of petroleum energy into food calories. The widespread use of petrochemical fertilizers to grow feed for livestock has turned agriculture into one of the biggest sources of oil demand after transportation. It's a demand that's skyrocketing worldwide: With current measures, experts predict global oil consumption will rise 57 percent by 2025 -- just in time for that coming peak. If small supply shocks like OPEC's embargoes in the '70s can create recessions, what would happen in the face of significant, persistent, growing shortages? A Greater Depression, or even chaos, is the answer, as was discovered in late June at a war game called Oil Shockwave. The participants, including many former Republican administration members, spent several days running through various scenarios of disrupted oil supply. Even with small-scale trouble, the exercises quickly spun out of control. The American people, concluded former CIA Director Robert M. Gates, are going to pay a terrible price for not having an energy strategy. James Woolsey, another former CIA director present at Oil Shockwave, was equally troubled. Woolsey, friend to Paul Wolfowitz, Donald Rumsfeld and Douglas Feith, and member of the bona fide neocon Defense Policy Board, has become an alternative-energy buff in the interest of national security. A few weeks later, Woolsey presented a paper along with George Schultz, Reagan's secretary of state, to the Committee on Present Danger about how our oil dependency makes the country extremely vulnerable. They argued that national security requires a radical change in energy policy, starting with fuel-efficiency standards. Woolsey and Schultz also dared to draw the less-talked-about blood/oil connection: that the spread of the
Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism
... and then there's all this: http://www.corporatecrimereporter.com/top100.html Top 100 Corporate Criminals of the Decade by Russell Mokhiber Introduction Top 100 Corporate Criminals -- Brief List Top 100 Corporate Criminals -- Annotated Version Check this out: For Richer, by Paul Krugman (8,100-word NYT article, good read) http://www.pkarchive.org/economy/ForRicher.html Best wishes Keith Great. Not only do I have get rid of a gallon of RoundUp but now I have to REBALANCE my stock portfolio. Nuts. Anyone know about socially responsible investing funds? -Mike Keith Addison wrote: rich wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't do this! While the comment below may be technically correct, there aren't 'enough' of us to do this and buying shares only encourages Monsanto to keep it up. IMHO our energies and monies are better spent trying to expose the lies, hidden agendas, and environmentally unsound practices these guys are about, and making sure as many people as possible become aware of the things that might make them wake up and begin to make informed choices themselves. Monsanto and all thier shareholders can do nothing but change to survive if they eventually cannot find thier markets for what they currently sell. Joe Mike, you can start by buying Monsanto stock. With enough stockholders submitting proxy proposals (and enough stockholders accepting them), that may obligate the board to put them in practice. Richard I'm talking about getting just enough shares to be able to vote on the proxies. How about these? http://www.umass.edu/peri/resources/Toxics100table.htm Toxics 100 table Best Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism
... and then there's all this: http://www.corporatecrimereporter.com/top100.html Top 100 Corporate Criminals of the Decade by Russell Mokhiber Introduction Top 100 Corporate Criminals -- Brief List Top 100 Corporate Criminals -- Annotated Version http://www.corporatecrimereporter.com/07_02_03_pressrelease.html Democrats, Republicans Awash In Funds From Corporate Criminals, Report Finds Check this out: Check this out: For Richer, by Paul Krugman (8,100-word NYT article, good read) http://www.pkarchive.org/economy/ForRicher.html Best wishes Keith rich wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't do this! While the comment below may be technically correct, there aren't 'enough' of us to do this and buying shares only encourages Monsanto to keep it up. IMHO our energies and monies are better spent trying to expose the lies, hidden agendas, and environmentally unsound practices these guys are about, and making sure as many people as possible become aware of the things that might make them wake up and begin to make informed choices themselves. Monsanto and all thier shareholders can do nothing but change to survive if they eventually cannot find thier markets for what they currently sell. Joe Mike, you can start by buying Monsanto stock. With enough stockholders submitting proxy proposals (and enough stockholders accepting them), that may obligate the board to put them in practice. Richard I'm talking about getting just enough shares to be able to vote on the proxies. How about these? http://www.umass.edu/peri/resources/Toxics100table.htm Toxics 100 table Best Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] ain't no chemist
Hi Brian, I think your right about favorites being regional. I live in Uruguay that has only wood as an easily obtained carbonaceous fuel. I've heard rumors that yesterday President Chavez of Venezuela agreed to help out the current government here by selling us crude at below current market rates. I'll try to confirm that rumor tonight by actually watching the televised news. It's even supposed to be part barter with Uruguay sending Venzuela food. This actually could put a crimp in any BioD production facility coming on line any time soon. I have to check the economics of it and the current cost of ethanol from Brazil. There are large amounts of animal fat and used cooking oil available here. Diesel fuel is subsudised by the government to keep the trucks, busses and taxi cabs moving. Right at this moment it is about $0.80 per liter. I still plan to continue homebrewing for my vehicle and I'm going ahead with a diesel elcetric generator for the house I'm designing. But I cannot tell if BioD will be competative or continue to be legal here. The government gets a lot of its money from about a 110% tax on fuel. I'm looking into ethanol home production from sugar beets that I can grow on a hectare of land my family owns now. I'm looking to expand that holding to about 15 hectaresfor organic farming for local markets. Tom Irwin From: Brian Rodgers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 09:41:29 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] ain't no chemistOh boy I bet you all couldn't wait to hear what my next stupid question will be. I also ain't no chemist, very few of us are chemists, but we can learn, and do.When I read this from Keith I just had to speak out again. Thank goodness. I was beginning to feel like everything you all talk about is over my head, at the very least at the peripheral of my understanding. So far, with this group I feel like my mind has been stretched every day with every email. It has been very humbling to say the least. So here is my question. What is your (anybody) favorite biofuel? I realize that a favorite might be totally regional. What works best in one place may not be feasible in another. I came to this group because I was interested in converting small diameter Ponderosa Pines into a fermentable feedstock because that is what we have an abundance of here in New Mexico. Not so much farming going on here as we are at 7500 feet above sea level and the growing season is short. We have our hearts set on fermentation and distillation and the last couple of links like this one: http://lorien.ncl.ac.uk/ming/distil/distil0.htm give us hope. I promised my Dad last night as I returned to the ranch from my weekly think-tank beer swilling meeting that I would send him that link again because he is a scientist, a chemist to be precise. !--[if !supportEmptyParas]--!--[endif]-- I am interested in what you do, what is easiest and what works the best. !--[if !supportEmptyParas]--!--[endif]-- My parents live 500 hundred feet from our house here on the ranch. I know that distance because we dug the waterline by hand. Anyway I have been forwarding information from you to Dad daily just to bounce ideas off of him. Coincidentally, day before yesterday he lent us Lifting the fog: the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, a documentary. My Dad is pretty cool, I know. Anyway I got into a heated discussion with Dad who is 87 and I fairly drunk. Still I recall telling Dad that one of the threads you all discussed to my satisfaction was just this topic. Mom was losing patience with the conversation and tells me my wife is waiting out in the car. I said I know I better go. When I got outside she was gone. Hey but like I said it is only 500 feet. !--[if !supportEmptyParas]--!--[endif]-- Brian Rodgers ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism
Genetically Modified Maize Not Found In Southern Mexico (August 12, 2005) Contrary to what many scientists thought, genetically modified (GM) corn has not yet spread to native maize crops in southern Mexico. After analyzing tens of thousands of seeds from maize crops grown in 2003 and 2004, researchers from Mexico and the United States found no evidence of transgenes in these indigenous varieties. full story Some hope! Brian ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The myths of Hiroshima
August 12, 2005 Good morning. I have been forwarding information from the Biofuels email list to Dad to bounce ideas off of him. He is a retired chemist. He lent us Lifting theFog: the Bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, a documentary. My wife and I didn't get a lot out of this documentary because of the way the directors used actors without explanation to represent historic figures. It put us off when we saw contrived historical footage with no validation of text documentation. Were these accurate quotes or was spin being put on history just to give the story more bite? I like a down and dirty war story entirely made up by Hollywood as well as the Saving Private Ryan genre, which is loosely based on history, but I dont know about this mixed up story. Dad disagreed, he said it showed the US government has been lying to American people for so long that they we take it for granted nowadays. That may be so, but it is not just the American government that has been lying. My wife and I had an hour to spend after work yesterday and while I ran software scans on a laptop, she found a PBS Frontline story titled Belsen: Remembering the Camps. Now this is actual footage, not Hollywood pap, showing the concentration camps in Germany as the liberating Allied (mainly British) troops found them. Documented footage of the starvation, dehumanization, and anhilation of prisoners by the SS Guards was horrendous. These unidentified people were taken from all over Europe, placed in the camps to die in the gas chambers, or left to die miserable protracted deaths by starvation and disease. As Allied troops advanced to liberate the camps, thousands of men, women, and children prisoners were rounded up into buildings and burned by the Nazi guards. Those that tried to escape the fire were shot. The footage graphically documented the brutallity. That was gruesome. Want to talk about Biofuels again? Brian Rodgers Was this documentary called Lifting of the fog: the Bombings of Hiroshima And Nagasaki? No. The documentary dealt specifically with Nagasaki. Two of the men onboard the "Bocks Car" B 29 were interviewed, as well as a number of Japanese who survived the ordeal and the usual "expert panel" that consisted of three or four people with opposing views. I don't remember the name of the film, but there was nothing more than a cursory mention of Hiroshima. robert luis rabello ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism
Ump... Twice? Sorry! :-/ Keith ... and then there's all this: http://www.corporatecrimereporter.com/top100.html Top 100 Corporate Criminals of the Decade by Russell Mokhiber Introduction snip ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The myths of Hiroshima
Brian Rodgers wrote: That was gruesome. Want to talk about Biofuels again? Sure! Let's do that. robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] magnasol
hello all, first i would like to catch you up on what happening here at the recycling company i work for. we are now running b100 in a truck made by yours truely which is making my boss exstatic. thank you to all on this list for all the help and info. with out it i would have blown myself up months ago. lol but oi have a question, a little bird told me that i am able to use a product called magnasol in the wash and it shortens the wash to an immediate clean product?? any body here of it or have any info.?? vince z vancouver bc__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Diesel fuel retail price in the Philippines
Hi, In the Philippines (where they deregulated the fuel industry a while back) diesel fuel costs US$0.51 per liter more or less. And it's been going up US$0.01/liter almost every two weeks! Before anyone says it's cheap, the government-mandated minimum daily wage is around US$0.56 per hour. One hour's work at minimum wage will get you a little more than a liter of diesel here at today's rates. And it's been some time since the minimum wage was adjusted upwards... :-( Regards. Vin Lava Manila, Philippines Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Diesel Price
Hi All, This should make an interesting list. I´m in Uruguay and we pay 20.9 pesos per liter or about U.S. $0.836 a liter or for the non-metric (shame on you) about U.S. $3.24 a gallon. Tom Irwin From: F. Desprez [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 10:48:18 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Diesel Price[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Dear All Is there a website that I can access that list the current price of diesel (at retail) in all the countries or most of the countries? Dear alone,Many sites found by googleAmong them, for Europe, several in English and... concerning the English (but EU neighbours as well)This brittish one, (june 2005)http://www.aaroadwatch.ie/eupetrolprices/another in pence per liter (updated feb 2005)http://www.see-search.com/business/fuelandpetrolpriceseurope.htmanother from Britannia, updated June 2005 with prices in Eurohttp://www.day-tripper.net/pricespetrol.htmlanothershttp://www.theaa.com/allaboutcars/fuel/http://europe.tiscali.co.uk/index.jsp?section=moneylevel=previewcontent=230663and comments from an american about prices and taxeshttp://wais.stanford.edu/ztopics/week040105/energy_050401_gasolinepricesusvseurope.htm...frantz___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] washing?
Hi all, For those of you that needs it, the glycerol can alsobe converted via anaerobic digestor to methane for stoves and boilers. Not such a good idea for city folk but on the farm it should be fine. Tom Irwin From: bob allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 10:10:31 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] washing?Howdy Todd, just a tiny correction, lest anybody get confused: Epsom salt is hydrated magnesium _sulfate_ not sulfide. Regardless, your advice is sound as always.Appal Energy wrote: His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out Why "wash" it out? Why not evaporate it and recover it, even as small a value as it is, rather than flush it with the wash water? I'll leave the energy and bio-accumlation numbers to the slide rule folks, but in an efficient setup, the energy used to recover the methanol from the biodiesel fraction can be used to raise the temperature of the feedstock for the next batch to the reaction level. Presume you have a 160* evaporation temperature and the incoming feedstock is 70*. In a perfect world half of that difference can be transferred to the incoming oil, raising it to 115*. Go one step further when drying washed fuel, which may have a pre-dried temp of 70*F. The diff between 115* and 70* would raise the fuel back up to approximately 90*. The wash water is not waste, when all is said and done. It's irrigation. Recover the soaps by using aluminum or magnesium sulfide (epsom salt), which converts the water soluble soaps to non-soluble greases. These have an energy content that can be recovered in a solid fuels boiler. Or, you can grease the axles of your Sunday-go-to-meetin' buggy. The water can then be applied as gray water irrigation. The sulfur content would have to be monitored. But there are crops that tend to rather like sulfur to a small degree. At the same time the recovered catalyst (converted to fertilizer) can be diluted and dispersed with the gray water. That leaves only the glycerol, either to sell or disperse with the treated wash water, as the recovered FFAs are returned to the acid cycle or used as boiler fuel. Todd Swearingenskapegoat wrote: I did notice that a lot of the chemistry in the book was wrong. His main argument seemed to be against losing the energy in the methanol that was washed out. He does recommend not using BD with certain types of tubes, as the methanol will destroy it. I am certainly planning on washing my BD, I just wonder if he's had any problems in the ten or more years he's been making his without washing it. I know about the chemical equilibrium, and not to try to remove methanol until the layers are seperated. I'm just wondering if Tickell is so worried about wasting the methanol by washing it out if there is a better way of retrieving it without worrying about leaving all that other garbage in your BD. */Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>/* wrote: Greetings the skapegoat The JTF website strongly recommends washing and the Josh Tickell book seems to suggest it isn't necessary and possibly even detrimental. Bad book! See: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/31729/ You might also note that the JtF website says why it strongly recommends washing, with a couple of references provided (there could have been plenty more): http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#why Washing: Why bother? IIRC Joshua Tickell provides one obscure and outdated reference. Rudi Weidegger of FuelMeister fame (or infamy), who Joshua's since teamed up with, also recommends no washing and says it's bad for your motor, with no references, but then he doesn't provide a washtank in his exorbitant set-up. Ho-hum. Anyway, to believe that you'd have to believe that all the national standards are based on nothing. Some people do seem to believe that. That's their business, as long as they keep their crappy fuel to themselves. I'm interested in some insight on this difference of opinion. I'm sure most experienced biodieselers here wash their biodiesel. Would it be worthwhile to distill the methanol from the biodiesel instead of just washing it away? The most convenient stage to reclaim the excess methanol would be immediately after the processing, when the mix is still hot. Unfortunately that means you reverse the very reaction you've just completed (hopefully completed). You have to settle and separate the glycerine by-product first. Most of the excess methanol is in the by-product; the small proportion in the biodiesel can be recovered, if you can find an economical way of doing it. I know this still leaves excess hydroxides And soaps. that still need to be washed out, but it might reduce the number of washes necessary Doubtful. and you might be able to save some of your methanol. Indeed. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] Diesel Price
Tom Irwin wrote: Hi All, This should make an interesting list. I´m in Uruguay and we pay 20.9 pesos per liter or about U.S. $0.836 a liter or for the non-metric (shame on you) about U.S. $3.24 a gallon. Up here in B.C., diesel at the pump this afternoon was running 97 cents per liter. Gasoline is the same price, and for the first time since leaving California, I saw a line at the filling station. People were tanking up and filling their jerry cans too. I asked one man if he expected the price to keep going up and he nearly swore at me! robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country
Earl, Impossible for the lone individual to protect their own basic rights. Recognition of that is way we attempt the rule of law. There is socialism and there are social programs, they aren't the same thing. The radical right is depending on a sufficient number of persons not understanding that, while they take more than their share, of this planet's resources. Likewise they depend on a negative connotation of beauracracy, beauracrats are everday people working for a living. Demonization and fear, two tools of the radical right. Doug, N0LKK - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 12:48 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country Dale, I don't mean to deflate your dream, but why do we need the government beauracracy (of which the UN most certainly is) to guarranty these basic human rights? Shouldn't that be the responsibility of every person on the planet to protect his or her basic rights? It seems to me that be requiring wealthy nations to donate any portion of their GDP is just another form of socialism, except on a global scale. Your other point about not getting involved with those poorer nations is right on the money. The biggest terrorism problems in the US today are a direct result of our meddling in other nations' affairs. If we spent less time and money on controlling other countries, we could spend less time and money on counter terrorism measures. Maybe then my taxes will go down and I would be able to donate my own money to those poorer nations. But that, my friend, is truly just a dream. Regards, Earl Kinsley [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- That government is best which governs least. -- Thomas Paine - Original Message - From: Dale Seto To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:10 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country This is a very wise and informed comment that Keith made, and I totally agree. I hope someday that the UN will ingrain and apply four basic rights for every human on this planet, and they are; 1) access to food 2) access to clean water 3) access to shelter 4) personal security I also beleive that all wealthy countries be required to donate just 2% of their GDP to a fund to help accomplish this. Just think of all the extra money we are spending on counter terrorism that could be put towards this goal. It would also thwart terrorism because terrorists would not be able to get a foothold or seek refige in the countries that our goodwill has touched. But our help must be unconditional. We must not get involved, or tell their country how to run it. All we would ask is that they be peaceful and abide international law. I know that this is just pie in the sky and whishfull thinking, but its just a dream of mine. Best wishes, Dale ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Check out Diesel Won't Solve Our Gasoline Woes
I would have to guess that was intended as sarcasm. However across the USA you could read similar editorial opinions and letters to the editor and they ARE serious. Scary really. Doug - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:32 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Check out Diesel Won't Solve Our Gasoline Woes er, sorry, but were you being sarcastic or serious? -chris ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism
I can see the future now. A Kansas National Guard Helo following a small creek with soldiers peering down with binoculars. They are no longer looking for wacky tobacky, but the subversive gardener or farmer using heritage seeds. Doug - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Original Message - From: rich mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgBiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:14 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Seed terrorism Potential solution: Maybe create a non-proprietary seed bank? Hi Rich- I believe grass roots seed banks and seed exchanges already exist. Perhaps the concerned non-gardener/producer can help the cause by purchasing and storing a portion of the surplus of seeds each year, every year? insuring a large viable stock in hand. Doug This page and the links there should tell you all you need to know about the seeds cris (crises), including heritage seeds, seed networks etc: http://journeytoforever.org/seeds.html Seeds of the world: Journey to Forever Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country
Mike, Where do I start? First, I have a real problem with any government (U.S., state, local) taking my hard earned money (in the form of taxes) and redistributing it to others. Now, there are legitimate things that each of these levels of government can spend taxpayer dollars on, namely, those outlined in their constitution or charter. In the case of the U.S. Government, these include national defense (not necessarily offense, though), minting currency, postal services, etc. When the U.S. Government (or perhaps the state governments) start spending my money outside the bounds of the Constitution, it is no longer legit. I would like to see Congress try and pass an Amendment to allow giving loans to foreign nations and never expecting repayment of those loans. How much support do you think they would get from the populace? Second, some people may consider giving funds or supplies to help poorer nationsor refugee groups as charity, which it is. But charity is you or I freely donating my money to others for the purpose of helping those in need. I have given money to help victims of 9-11, I have helped feed the homeless in soup kitchens, I have given my old clothing and furniture to Goodwill, Salvation Army, etc. Governments, such as our federal government, do not own the money they give to others - the money belongs to the taxpayers (and bond holders) who provide the money. How can the U.S. Government consider giving money to poor African countries as charity, when it isn't their money to give? As I mentioned previously, if the U.S. Government would stop taking my hard earned money and "donating" away, perhaps I would have more money that I could freely give to organizations like the Red Cross (this is only one example, there are others) as charity. Third, the idea of giving for the sake of giving is lost on most politicians. Inside the "Beltway," a politician's power is measured by his or her ability to fundraise - accepting money from some "generous" sole to support some "Cause of the day." Have you ever met a political donor that didn't expect something in return? The President and Congress are just as guilty of wanting something in return for helping other nations. How much money have they pumped intothe poorer nations of the Iraq War Coalition? Socialism and true communism may have its value to some and will thrive in some places of the world, but I prefer not to live under it. Or at least, if I have to, please call it as such - The Socialist Unoin of America. The same goes for the United Nations. Thanks for the opportunity to explain myself. Earl. - Original Message - From: Michael Redler To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 4:35 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country Earl, Earl wrote: "It seems to me that be requiring wealthy nations to "donate" any portion of their GDP is just another form of socialism, except on a global scale." Giving it a name (i.e. socialism or ...ism), doesn't explain why you disagree. Pleaseinclude something tosupport your position. There are people in this list who (despite McCarthy's legacy) understand the value ofsocialism and even communism (not to be confused withStalin's mislabeled brand of fascism) as a theoretical model for democracy. Mike From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:48:58 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/CountryDale,I don't mean to deflate your dream, but why do we need the government beauracracy (of which the UN most certainly is) to guarranty these basic human rights? Shouldn't that be the responsibility of every person on the planet to protect his or her basic rights?It seems to me that be requiring wealthy nations to "donate" any portion of their GDP is just another form of socialism, except on a global scale.Your other point about not getting involved with those poorer nations is right on the money. The biggest terrorism problems in the US today are a direct result of our meddling in other nations' affairs. If we spent less time and money on controlling other countries, we could spend less time and money on counter terrorism measures. Maybe then my taxes will go down and I would be able to donate my own money to those poorer nations. But that, my friend, is truly just a dream.Regards,Earl Kinsley[EMAIL PROTECTED]--"That government is best which governs least." -- Thomas Paine ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
Re: [Biofuel] titanium
Perhaps Jeremy was thinking of platinum as used in catalytic heaters? Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The New Blue States/Country
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Where do I start? Oh boy! First, I have a real problem with any government (U.S., state, local) taking my hard earned money (in the form of taxes) and redistributing it to others. You live in a country where you have the ABILITY to earn your money, and you question the legitimacy of the government in taxing your income? You live in a country with an elaborate infrastructure undreamed of by the Constitutional framers, and you have a problem with supporting that infrastructure? Now, there are legitimate things that each of these levels of government can spend taxpayer dollars on, namely, those outlined in their constitution or charter. We do not live in the same nation that existed in 1789 when the Constitution was ratified. In the case of the U.S. Government, these include national defense (not necessarily offense, though), minting currency, postal services, etc. When the U.S. Government (or perhaps the state governments) start spending my money outside the bounds of the Constitution, it is no longer legit. Not so, else that kind of activity would have been deemed unconstitutional long ago. Yours is a tired argument from the 1930s. I would like to see Congress try and pass an Amendment to allow giving loans to foreign nations and never expecting repayment of those loans. How much support do you think they would get from the populace? What on earth are you talking about? If you're so concerned with fiscal restraint, why not encourage the Federal Government to pass a balanced budget amendment? Deficit spending is a serious problem, of which foreign aid is a vanishingly small percentage. Governments, such as our federal government, do not own the money they give to others - the money belongs to the taxpayers (and bond holders) who provide the money. If you look on a dollar bill, you will find a statement that reads: Federal Reserve Note. Read Section 8 of Article 1 for further enlightenment on this issue. How can the U.S. Government consider giving money to poor African countries as charity, when it isn't their money to give? The percentage of spending that goes to aid nations in the Third World is tiny, compared to overall government spending, and while much of that spending goes right back into American corporations, the largest dollar amounts invested overseas occurs in the form of military assistance. Israel, by the way, is the biggest recipient of American foreign aid. We have discussed this issue to death previously. A search of the archives is in order. As I mentioned previously, if the U.S. Government would stop taking my hard earned money and donating away, perhaps I would have more money that I could freely give to organizations like the Red Cross (this is only one example, there are others) as charity. The amount of money that you and I could donate for foreign aid would do very little to help. Only governments have the financial wherewithal to make a difference. We Americans like to think we're generous, but an examination of the facts shows a very different picture. Third, the idea of giving for the sake of giving is lost on most politicians. Inside the Beltway, a politician's power is measured by his or her ability to fundraise - accepting money from some generous sole to support some Cause of the day. Have you ever met a political donor that didn't expect something in return? The President and Congress are just as guilty of wanting something in return for helping other nations. How much money have they pumped into the poorer nations of the Iraq War Coalition? Likely a lot less than we've spent in Iraq ourselves. Socialism and true communism may have its value to some and will thrive in some places of the world, but I prefer not to live under it. Then don't use the socialist electrical grid, power plants, highway system and telecommunications infrastructure that Americans have collectively paid for over the years. I suspect you will also not want to participate in any of the corporate welfare that has gone on either. Health care? Don't bother going to a county hospital, or the local library. Oh yes, and police and fire suppression should also be high on your list of socialist government services you can do without. Even if you didn't learn how to read and write in a (horrors!) PUBLIC school, many of the rest of us did. That literacy you've developed wouldn't do you a whole lot of good were it not for the ability of the rest of us to comprehend the grapheme / phoneme relationships that appear on our collective (gasp!) computer screens. By the way, the internet itself had some initial government funding, did it not? Rid yourself of all these socialist trappings before you come here and whine about the pathetic contribution our government makes to improving life for the poor people of this world. The same goes
