Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
On 2/27/06, Al Sparber wrote: I don't think you need to go back to 10th grade, but - for your own sake - you might want to read Genesis 4:9 :-) Al, Read, duly noted, and point taken. Also pertinent, is the quote I received with my Word a Day email today: It came to me that reform should begin at home, and since that day I have not had time to remake the world. -Will Durant, historian (1885-1981) Me 'n my big mouth :( Some people never learn, eh. Thanks to all the responses on and off list. (still not so sunny) sunup /me considers changing her name to sundown ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
Ben Buchanan wrote: Hi, I hereby publicly declare that my days of complaining to website authors that I cannot view their site at 800x600, and then opening my big mouth about other dubious issues I notice on their site, are now over. [snip] I'm astonished at the tone - although not especially surprised by the content - of their reply. Even if they thought you were being the biggest pain in history, they should remain polite when replying. I've seen and hear similar tones within the CMS meatspace (and usually been on the end of very offensive messages from the relevant powers that be when I raise standards and accessibility). It seems pervasive of corporate culture in this respect. Why is it the suits and marketroids think they understand how the web works when they're in marketing and business management ? ISPs remain no different than any other web enabled bells-and-whistles deployments. Quality matters, doesn't it? ;) Lawrence -- Lawrence Meckan Absalom Media Mob: (04) 1047 9633 ABN: 49 286 495 792 http://www.absalom.biz ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
Lea de Groot wrote: Maybe (s)he knew all those things were a problem I doubt it. If that were the case, I'm sure the response would have been more along the lines of: Thank you, we are aware of these problems and we are investigating ways to fix them, but at this stage there is nothing we can do. We apologise for the inconvenience. and couldn't bear them being brought up by (cough, splutter) a *customer* What kind of person would rather insult the customer instead of admitting they have a problem? -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
Lachlan Hunt wrote: What kind of person would rather insult the customer instead of admitting they have a problem? A bank ? I managed to get the standard filler text for a bank's customer service department in pointing out some issues on Firefox 1.5. The problem still isn't fixed either.. Lawrence -- Lawrence Meckan Absalom Media Mob: (04) 1047 9633 ABN: 49 286 495 792 http://www.absalom.biz ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
SunUp wrote: /me considers changing her name to sundown You'll need a satin dress and a very private room, and watch yourself around the back stairs ;-) mark ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
who was this whole msg about, sunny? or what, or he started it about some1 else ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
ADMIN: Thread Closing Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
On 27/02/2006, at 7:23 PM, adam LEAPER wrote: who was this whole msg about, sunny? or what, or he started it about some1 else Thats ok - I don't think we need to name names. mutters some legal mumbo jumbo Going once, going twice... If no one has anything good to add, I think we can close this one? Lea -- Lea de Groot Core Member ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
Time to name names. I would like to avoid the ISP you talk about. Wich company is it? :) Giles ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
On 2/27/06, Ben wrote: I'm astonished at the tone - although not especially surprised by the content - of their reply. Even if they thought you were being the biggest pain in history, they should remain polite when replying. I should confess that, by the time I got the comments that I shared with this list, I HAD become the biggest pain in history. I'd become more than a little annoyed at the attitude before the material I quoted appeared (from a different guy than I was originally speaking to). I was being told things such as web developers stopped designing for 800x600 screens around 2001/2002, and that I should upgrade my browser if I was having trouble rendering pages by a person who'd looked at the issue using Portable Firefox 1.0.4. I figured: they are so careful to use (and defend the use of) Dreamweaver's javascript resize fix for Netscape 4 that they should accommodate my browsing environment, and I WAS using the latest browser. I'll repeat, it's probably my own fault. I just thought I'd share their philosophy with the list. Their tone was astonishing possibly because mine was. I deserved that. It's the philosophy I mostly object to. sunup. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
I found this an interesting read. Click on the following link and scroll to the very bottom of the page and see what browser Acer recommends their site is best experienced with... http://www.acer.com.au/acer/akc/acerau.nsf/Page/Products_and_Technology Makes you wonder about their products, huh. But in all seriousness, if you were setting up a website for a client who has never been on the web before (no server logs to analyse) and is marketing their gates/fencing business, would you try and support 4.0 browsers? Has the time come to just have a disclaimer on the site stating support for 5.0 browsers or above? Cheers Nathan ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
On 2/27/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But in all seriousness, if you were setting up a website for a client who has never been on the web before (no server logs to analyse) and is marketing their gates/fencing business, would you try and support 4.0 browsers? For a given definition of 'support', yes. Has the time come to just have a disclaimer on the site stating support for 5.0 browsers or above? I think the time has long since come to stop having disclaimers about browser support; make sure the content of the site is accessible whether people are using new browsers, old browsers, non-visual browsers, or just shouting into tin cans with strings attached. Then build on top of that any fancy styling or effects you like, so long as they don't get in the way of non-supporting user-agents accessing the content. -- May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house. -- George Carlin ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But in all seriousness, if you were setting up a website for a client who has never been on the web before (no server logs to analyse) and is marketing their gates/fencing business, would you try and support 4.0 browsers? Has the time come to just have a disclaimer on the site stating support for 5.0 browsers or above? In my opinion, the word support is not a useful one to use here, because it means different things to different people. To a standard-based developer, it would probably mean can access content and functionality. To a graphic designer or marketing manager, it is more likely to be interpreted as show pixel-perfect design You have different layers to a web site: * content * functionality (meaning server side, usually) * design and layout * interaction enhancements (AJAX-driven UI and all that malarkey) I would personally interpret support as meaning can access content and functionality. Version 4.x browsers would not be expected to display any design/layout or interaction enhancements by most web developers, I suspect. Whether this view is shared by most marketing managers could be another matter :) Version 5.x browsers would be expected to display design/layout and as much interaction enhancements as they can, though the scripting should be unobtrusive so that if something isn't going to work, there should be no evidence that the user is missing out on something. IE 6 and better browsers should get the whole works, IMO. Having said all that, it is a relatively easy matter to supply some basic or even relatively sophisticated visual formatting to the version 4.0 browsers, though the main CSS should be hidden from them as the faults in these older browsers may make the site unusable if they can see the proper CSS or even crash the browser. These days, if the need arose, I would write a style sheet for Win IE 4, another for NN4, and deliver them using conditional comments for IE and using JavaScript for NN4 (test on document.layers). NN4 cannot display CSS if JS is off, so it all hangs together quite well. HTH Cheers Ian -- _ zStudio - Web development and accessibility http://zStudio.co.uk Snippetz.net - Online code library File, manage and re-use your code snippets links http://snippetz.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
James Bennett wrote: I think the time has long since come to stop having disclaimers about browser support; make sure the content of the site is accessible whether people are using new browsers, old browsers, non-visual browsers, or just shouting into tin cans with strings attached. Then build on top of that any fancy styling or effects you like, so long as they don't get in the way of non-supporting user-agents accessing the content. -- I feel that is the crux of the issue too. If you are a standards based developer, you shouldn't have locked anyone out with your design implementation, but your design may degrade gracefully on older browsers. The content should still be accessible. -- Geoff Deering ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
If you go to the Australian Taxation Office's site you will find that if you want to download and use E Tax, that you have to use a Version 5 browser and above. Does it get worse.my word it does... it has to be IE If you want to use their electronic business access you have to use IE as well. This is to the point that you can't even fill in numbers for your ABN (Australian Business Number) if you're using Firefox. Support Version 4.0 Browsers What about supporting standards and this is a government department in Australia that seems not to recognise the existence of anything else apart from Microshaft! Regards, Ric ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Safari stylesheet switcher wierdness!
http://www.megustalatelevision.com/uwish I'm trying to provide two versions: fixed and fluid. On FF everything is fine, IE not too sure about... but Safari..! On returning to fixed width after choosing the fluid version, all background images aren't there anymore, and, sometimes, the entire page is missing except the body background colour!! Refreshing the page brings things back to normal. I have used the same styleswitcher script on my personal site and everything's fine... any ideas? Adam ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Re: Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: But in all seriousness, if you were setting up a website for a client who has never been on the web before (no server logs to analyse) and is marketing their gates/fencing business, would you try and support 4.0 browsers? Has the time come to just have a disclaimer on the site stating support for 5.0 browsers or above? Interesting. You support what you need to support. I haven't thought in terms of supporting 4.0 or even 5.0 browsers for a long time. If you're looking at version 4.0 and 5.0 of IE, for instance, you're talking about quite old operating systems. The projects we've been working on lately have operating system dependencies (due to font rendering technologies) that would make it pointless aiming for an IE version less than IE6. The versions of windows that shipped with those older versions of IE can not support the writing systems we are using. If we have to think in terms of what we're supporting, it generally isn't in terms of browser versions, rather we tend to plan in terms of operating systems or font rendering technologies we need to target or support. But then thats the nature of the projects we work on. One project we're planing, a small digital library, we probably will not support any version of IE. Andrew ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But in all seriousness, if you were setting up a website for a client who has never been on the web before (no server logs to analyse) and is marketing their gates/fencing business, would you try and support 4.0 browsers? Has the time come to just have a disclaimer on the site stating support for 5.0 browsers or above? Serious support today should be more or less in line with... http://developer.yahoo.net/yui/articles/gbs/gbs_browser-chart.html ...or maybe slightly broader... http://www.gunlaug.no/contents/wd_1_02_02.html ...as long as the experience in the latest browsers don't suffer. That excludes version 4 browsers and cuts hard into version 5 browsers. I'll inform a client about such decisions, and try to aim for the future rather than risk getting stuck in the past. I wouldn't state actual browser-support on a site, as visitors are quite able to see/experience the result in their own browsers. I'm not able to test every detail in all the latest browsers, so I might miss a bug (or something) in one of them. I might respond to unhappy visitors' reports by looking into whatever problems they might have regarding support for their preferred browser(s) once a site is up - and may even make slight adjustments. This might be seen as slightly more helpful than a recent thread shows ;-) However, I won't try to bring the support for an old browser-version very high. Commercial sites should work at a minimum level in just about any browser, but that's it. I often add links to http://browsehappy.com/ since all IE versions up to and including IE7 are/will be less capable than the others, and leave the rest up to the visitor without further disclaimers of any sort - apart from those I include on my own site :-) Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
From: Gunlaug Sørtun [EMAIL PROTECTED] I often add links to http://browsehappy.com/ since all IE versions up to and including IE7 are/will be less capable than the others, and leave the rest up to the visitor without further disclaimers of any sort - apart from those I include on my own site :-) It's always good to ask the client if he or she wants a tangential statement associated with their business. It could make more traditional business people feel uneasy - with their web developer. -- Al Sparber PVII http://www.projectseven.com Designing with CSS is sometimes like barreling down a crumbling mountain road at 90 miles per hour secure in the knowledge that repairs are scheduled for next Tuesday. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Linking to top of page
What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. The name attribute of the A tag is deprecated/removed[1]. And while some people might say use the scrollbar or press Home I'm wondering if anyone has experimented with these: 1) Giving my BODY id=top and linking to that seems to work but might not be widely supported. 2) Linking to the undefined href=# seems to be easiest, but is semantically ambiguous and might have usability and browser support issues. 3) The obvious thing is using an empty DIV or SPAN with id=top but empty tags seem like an ugly solution. So what does conventional wisdom say is best? Alternately, which is most correct from a standards perspective? Thanks! --Curby [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/changes.html#a_changes ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Curby wrote: What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. The name attribute of the A tag is deprecated/removed[1]. ... [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/changes.html#a_changes It's only deprecated in XHTML 1.1, which you almost certainly shouldn't be using anyway since it's really not supposed to be served as text/html. If you really want to jump on the XHTML bandwagon, stick with XHTML 1.0. And while some people might say use the scrollbar or press Home That's always possible and why I never bother with back-to-top links. 1) Giving my BODY id=top and linking to that seems to work but might not be widely supported. I'm not aware of any browser that doesn't support it, though it's possible some older browsers may choke on it. If you use a container element around the whole content, you could use that instead: body div id=container ... content ... a href=#containertop/a /div /body -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
Ah, I remember working as an ASP/SQL developer for a local company that was the leader in site construction. At the time, I was just discovering CSS layout techniques, and felt obligated to try and change the whole company over to the newer better way of building sites. I worked with a designer, who like many, designed in photoshop, chopped and pasted into design view in Dreamweaver. Needless to say, I would spend my days rebuilding his code in CSS. As a newbie at the time, I ran across alot of bugs, and discovered that my CSS layouts would crash and burn in Mac, while his table layouts looked perfect. My manager got wind of what I was spending my time doing, preaching about Firefox, CSS, etc... and became fairly pissed off about it, claimed I was wasting my time, and as such, I quit not long after and started my own business. They thought they were right. I thought I was right. That was 2 years ago. Today, I've eaten up a good chunk of their business, and am growing nicely. Today, they use some crap template. http://jsedesign.com They also don't show anything in their portfolio, and most of their flagship sites have been rebuilt by other entities. I don't think I need to tell you what the lesson is. Joseph R. B. Taylor Sites by Joe, LLC http://sitesbyjoe.com (609)335-3076 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Absalom Media wrote: Lachlan Hunt wrote: What kind of person would rather insult the customer instead of admitting they have a problem? A bank ? I managed to get the standard filler text for a bank's customer service department in pointing out some issues on Firefox 1.5. The problem still isn't fixed either.. Lawrence ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
At 05:35 AM 2/27/2006, Curby wrote: What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. Whoa. Stop right there. How can CSS stop you from linking to an h1 that's got an id? Paul ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Curby wrote: What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. The name attribute of the A tag is deprecated/removed[1]. And while some people might say use the scrollbar or press Home I'm wondering if anyone has experimented with these: Why not use h1 id=foo? (You say because of your CSS, but what does this mean?) Then link to mypage.htm#foo - all legit and above board Seems to work for most people :) Cheers Ian -- _ zStudio - Web development and accessibility http://zStudio.co.uk Snippetz.net - Online code library File, manage and re-use your code snippets links http://snippetz.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Paul Novitski wrote: At 05:35 AM 2/27/2006, Curby wrote: What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. Whoa. Stop right there. How can CSS stop you from linking to an h1 that's got an id? It depends where the H1 is positioned. If it's not at the top, the page won't be scrolled to the top. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
a href=#Back to Top/a On 27/02/06, Lachlan Hunt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul Novitski wrote: At 05:35 AM 2/27/2006, Curby wrote: What is the recommended way for linking back to the top of the page? I can't link to the id of my H1 because of my CSS. Whoa. Stop right there. How can CSS stop you from linking to an h1 that's got an id? It depends where the H1 is positioned. If it's not at the top, the page won't be scrolled to the top. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Lachlan Hunt wrote: It depends where the H1 is positioned. If it's not at the top, the page won't be scrolled to the top. If the H1 isn't at the top of the content, then I'd say there's a pretty good case for saying that the H1 is in the wrong place. The top of the content is where it should go, not the top of all the nav and other guff that may be on the page as well, in my opinion. Cheers Ian -- _ zStudio - Web development and accessibility http://zStudio.co.uk Snippetz.net - Online code library File, manage and re-use your code snippets links http://snippetz.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Do you still support 4.0 browsers?
Al Sparber wrote: It's always good to ask the client if he or she wants a tangential statement associated with their business. It could make more traditional business people feel uneasy - with their web developer. Sounds reasonable :-) I never push anything in there against a client's will. OTOH: I won't lower my standards or change my mind about the matter either - and I tend to say so. This web developer tends to feel uneasy with clients that insists on IE/win-limited designs as base, and full support for old browsers. Such situations are usually solved to both parties satisfaction through open dialog at an early stage. If not; then it usually isn't worth it anyway - for me. Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
On 2/27/06, Ian Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lachlan Hunt wrote: It depends where the H1 is positioned. If it's not at the top, the page won't be scrolled to the top. If the H1 isn't at the top of the content, then I'd say there's a pretty good case for saying that the H1 is in the wrong place. The top of the content is where it should go, not the top of all the nav and other guff that may be on the page as well, in my opinion. Lachlan is right, I use image replacement to reposition and stick an image in the upper-lefthand corner of the viewport instead of the normal H1 text. It stays visible in the corner for compatible browsers. Example: http://curby.net/doc/layout/jello-new.html (Link may die in the future) Hmm... so id-ing and linking to the body might work, otherwise it seems the concensus is to just use an empty anchor/div/span with an id/name. Thanks for all the input. =) --Curby ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Curby wrote: Lachlan is right, I use image replacement to reposition and stick an image in the upper-lefthand corner of the viewport instead of the normal H1 text. It stays visible in the corner for compatible browsers. Example: http://curby.net/doc/layout/jello-new.html Sorry to disagree but looking at your code, you should be using #content as the back to top anchor destination. Your use of a decorative graphic element on the left edge is irrelevant to the issue. Hope this helps Cheers ian -- _ zStudio - Web development and accessibility http://zStudio.co.uk Snippetz.net - Online code library File, manage and re-use your code snippets links http://snippetz.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
Ian Anderson wrote:
Lachlan Hunt wrote:
It depends where the H1 is positioned. If it's not at the top, the
page won't be scrolled to the top.
If the H1 isn't at the top of the content, then I'd say there's a pretty
good case for saying that the H1 is in the wrong place.
I meant not at the top of the rendered view. i.e. It's been positioned
using CSS. Try this simple test case:
!DOCTYPE html
style#foo { margin: 100px 0 1000px; }/style
h1 id=fooHello/h1
a href=#footop/a
--
Lachlan Hunt
http://lachy.id.au/
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[WSG] form button css
Hi All
I'm having some trouble using an image as a button in a form. I've zeroed
out the margins and paddings in this simple search box and yet the button
wants to sit about 6px higher than the label and input. I've added this
klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px 0;
This just doesn't look good to me. I'm pushing it down 6px and then sucking
up the bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the label and input down
6px.
I haven't worked with buttons much, I prefer to leave the submit buttons
alone. Does anyone have a suggestion? Here's the code:
form name=searchForm action=foo method=GET onsubmit=return
checkQuery(this);
label for=prod foo:/label
input type=text name= foo id=prod size=50 /
button name=submit type=submit
img src=/images/foo.gif alt=Submit Button /
/button
/form
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }
#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }
#foo input { margin:0 5px;}
#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Thanks
Ted Drake
-- New Advanced CSS Resource Site: www.last-child.com
Contributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a mac)
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Re: [WSG] form button css
On 28/02/06, Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }#foo input{ margin:0 5px;}#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Just a suggestion... is there anywhere else in your css where you're
applying some margins or padding to img? Maybe try adding
something like:
#foo button img { margin: 0; padding: 0; }
It might make a difference, but it's hard to know without seeing the rest of the code.
Cheers,
Seona.
RE: [WSG] form button css
Hi Seona
Great idea. I dont know if I
had any sitewide img margins, but its possible. I added the reference and
was able to simplify the css:
#foo button {border:none;
background:none; padding:0; margin: 0 0 -6px 0;}
#foo button img {margin:0; padding:0;}
Im still curious if form buttons
have an inherent value that makes it display margins differently than inputs or
labels.
I got it to look spiffy when I floated everything,
but that is too drastic for a simple form.
Ted Drake
www.last-child.com
--new Advanced CSS resources site
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Seona Bellamy
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006
4:58 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] form button css
On 28/02/06, Ted Drake
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }
#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }
#foo input{ margin:0 5px;}
#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Just a suggestion... is there anywhere else in your css where you're applying
some margins or padding to img? Maybe try adding something like:
#foo button img { margin: 0; padding: 0; }
It might make a difference, but it's hard to know without seeing the rest of
the code.
Cheers,
Seona.
Re: [WSG] form button css
I tried this markup in IE6 and Firefox 1.5 without [margin:6px 0 -6px
0;]. Everything lines up well. It is obviously some other CSS that
affects your button. I agree with Seona's suggestion #foo button img {
margin: 0; padding: 0; }
Cheers, Irina.On 2/28/06, Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi AllI'm having some trouble using an image as a button in a form. I've zeroedout the margins and paddings in this simple search box and yet the buttonwants to sit about 6px higher than the label and input. I've added this
klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px 0;This just doesn't look good to me.I'm pushing it down 6px and then suckingup the bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the label and input down6px.I haven't worked with buttons much, I prefer to leave the submit buttons
alone.Does anyone have a suggestion?Here's the code:form name=searchForm action="" method=GET >checkQuery(this);label for="" foo:/label
input type=text name= foo id=prod size=50 /button name=submit type=submitimg src="" alt=Submit Button /
/button/form#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }#foo input{ margin:0 5px;}#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}ThanksTed Drake-- New Advanced CSS Resource Site: www.last-child.comContributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a mac)
**The discussion list forhttp://webstandardsgroup.org/ See
http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help**
Re: [WSG] form button css
Ted,
Its relatively easy to do what you are trying to do
..I accomplished the same thing on my site with this code.
.newsletter-button1 {font-family:'Street Corner';
font-style:normal; font-variant:small-caps; font-weight:normal; font-size:10px;
color:rgb(51,51,51); letter-spacing:3px; background-color:white;
background-image:url('images/silvernavbar.gif');
border-width:1px; border-color:black; border-style:solid; width:80px;
}.style131 {font-family: "Street Corner"}.style129 {color: #434343;
font-weight: bold; font-family: "Street Corner"; font-size: 12px; font-style:
normal; line-height: normal; font-variant: normal; text-transform: none;
}
Thanks,
James Gellan
Rayne Creative
404-468-6347
- Original Message -
From: "Ted Drake" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 19:48
Subject: [WSG] form button css
Hi All I'm having some trouble using an image as a
button in a form. I've zeroed out the margins and paddings in this
simple search box and yet the button wants to sit about 6px higher than
the label and input. I've added this klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px
0; This just doesn't look good to me. I'm pushing it down 6px and
then sucking up the bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the
label and input down 6px. I haven't worked with buttons
much, I prefer to leave the submit buttons alone. Does anyone have
a suggestion? Here's the code: form name="searchForm"
action="" method="GET" label for="" foo:/label
input type="text" name=" foo " id="prod" size="50" /
button name="submit" type="submit" img src=""
alt="Submit Button" / /button /form
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; } #foo label {
color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; } #foo
input { margin:0 5px;} #foo button {border:none; height:23px;
background:none; padding:0 0 0 0; margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Thanks Ted Drake -- New Advanced CSS Resource Site:
www.last-child.com
Contributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a
mac)
** The discussion
list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting
help **
[WSG] Quick help please...
Hi all, This is a simple question but I have not had the needed this functionality before. Is is possible to use CSS to insert text into HTML. I have a #logo where I usually insert the company logo but this client wants text and I do not particularly want to edit the application just to produce FOO Pty Ltd at the top. Any help appreciated. Thanks.Alastair
Solution! RE: [WSG] form button css
Ok, I found the ultimate solution while
working on another section where inline images were not aligning with text.
Im using button with an image per
Thierrys suggestion. I didnt want to use background image on an
input because there are some browser inconsistencies and I didnt want to
use an image in the input due to some accessibility concerns.
So, the final css:
#ytTopSearch button {border:none;
background:none; padding:0; margin:0; vertical-align:middle; cursor:pointer;
*cursor:hand; }
Vertical-align:middle has the submit
button and inline images centered vertically with the text. Ive checked
it in FF 1.5 and IE6.
Im using the
Has anyone come across any problems using
vertical-align?
By the way, Im working on a new
site, www.last-child.com that will be
my little scrapbook of code snippets, solutions, etc. This will be an example
of the kind of quick tip that will be available. Ive begun by
transferring posts from my other site. Its still a bit rough in Safari
and Im ignoring IE6 as it isnt representative of browsers used by
advanced CSS programmers.
Feel free to kick the tires, leave
suggestions, find errors, etc.
Ted
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Gellan
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006
5:44 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] form button css
Ted,
Its relatively easy to do what you are trying to do ..I
accomplished the same thing on my site with this code.
.newsletter-button1 {font-family:'Street Corner';
font-style:normal; font-variant:small-caps; font-weight:normal; font-size:10px;
color:rgb(51,51,51); letter-spacing:3px; background-color:white; background-image:url('images/silvernavbar.gif');
border-width:1px; border-color:black; border-style:solid; width:80px; }
.style131 {font-family: Street Corner}
.style129 {color: #434343; font-weight: bold; font-family: Street
Corner; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; line-height: normal;
font-variant: normal; text-transform: none; }
Thanks,
James Gellan
Rayne Creative
404-468-6347
- Original Message -
From: Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 19:48
Subject: [WSG] form button css
Hi All
I'm having some trouble using an image as a button in a form. I've zeroed
out the margins and paddings in this simple search box and yet the button
wants to sit about 6px higher than the label and input. I've added this
klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px 0;
This just doesn't look good to me. I'm pushing it down 6px and then
sucking
up the bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the label and input
down
6px.
I haven't worked with buttons much, I prefer to leave the submit buttons
alone. Does anyone have a suggestion? Here's the code:
form name=searchForm action=""
method=GET >
checkQuery(this);
label for="" foo:/label
input type=text name= foo id=prod
size=50 /
button name=submit type=submit
img src="" alt=Submit Button
/
/button
/form
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }
#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }
#foo input { margin:0 5px;}
#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Thanks
Ted Drake
-- New Advanced CSS Resource Site: www.last-child.com
Contributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a mac)
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: Solution! RE: [WSG] form button css
Ted, I apologize for getting off topic. I visited
you site last-child.com, and your link to FF Alistapart search box won't work
for me. Using FF, also can't seem to locate a contact link to notify you.
Do you mean for folks who find things that don't seem to work to leave a comment
in the comments areas? I am a bit confused.
Like they site by the way, bookmarked
it!
- Original Message -
From:
Ted Drake
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 8:13
PM
Subject: Solution! RE: [WSG] form button
css
Ok, I found the
ultimate solution while working on another section where inline images were
not aligning with text.
Im using button with
an image per Thierrys suggestion. I didnt want to use background image on an
input because there are some browser inconsistencies and I didnt want to use
an image in the input due to some accessibility
concerns.
So, the final css:
#ytTopSearch button
{border:none; background:none; padding:0; margin:0;
vertical-align:middle; cursor:pointer; *cursor:hand;
}
Vertical-align:middle
has the submit button and inline images centered vertically with the text.
Ive checked it in FF 1.5 and IE6.
Im using the
Has anyone come
across any problems using vertical-align?
By the way, Im
working on a new site, www.last-child.com that will be my
little scrapbook of code snippets, solutions, etc. This will be an example of
the kind of quick tip that will be available. Ive begun by transferring posts
from my other site. Its still a bit rough in Safari and Im ignoring IE6 as
it isnt representative of browsers used by advanced CSS
programmers.
Feel free to kick the
tires, leave suggestions, find errors, etc.
Ted
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James GellanSent: Monday, February 27, 2006 5:44
PMTo:
wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: Re: [WSG] form button
css
Ted,
Its relatively easy to do what you
are trying to do ..I accomplished the same thing on my site with this
code.
.newsletter-button1
{font-family:'Street Corner'; font-style:normal; font-variant:small-caps;
font-weight:normal; font-size:10px; color:rgb(51,51,51); letter-spacing:3px;
background-color:white; background-image:url('images/silvernavbar.gif');
border-width:1px; border-color:black; border-style:solid; width:80px;
}.style131 {font-family: "Street Corner"}.style129 {color: #434343;
font-weight: bold; font-family: "Street Corner"; font-size: 12px; font-style:
normal; line-height: normal; font-variant: normal; text-transform: none;
}
Thanks,
James
Gellan
Rayne
Creative
404-468-6347
- Original Message -
From: "Ted Drake"
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006
19:48
Subject: [WSG] form button
css
Hi All I'm
having some trouble using an image as a button in a form. I've zeroed
out the margins and paddings in this simple search box and yet the
button wants to sit about 6px higher than the label and input. I've
added this klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px 0; This just doesn't
look good to me. I'm pushing it down 6px and then sucking up the
bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the label and input down
6px. I haven't worked with buttons much, I prefer to leave
the submit buttons alone. Does anyone have a suggestion?
Here's the code: form name="searchForm" action=""
method="GET" label
for="" foo:/label input type="text" name=" foo "
id="prod" size="50" / button name="submit"
type="submit" img src="" alt="Submit Button"
/ /button /form #foo
form { text-align:center; padding:0; } #foo label { color:#fff;
font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; } #foo input {
margin:0 5px;} #foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none;
padding:0 0 0 0; margin:6px 0 -6px 0;} Thanks
Ted Drake -- New Advanced CSS Resource Site: www.last-child.com
Contributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a
mac)
** The discussion
list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free
Edition.Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.0/269 - Release Date:
2/24/2006
Re: [WSG] Quick help please...
Hi, This is a simple question but I have not had the needed this functionality before. Is is possible to use CSS to insert text into HTML. While it is possible to use CSS to generate content (http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/generate.html), IE doesn't support it. Big surprise there! Unless the application is an intranet where IE is not supported, you're out of luck. cheers, Ben -- --- http://www.200ok.com.au/ --- The future has arrived; it's just not --- evenly distributed. - William Gibson ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Quick help please...
No IE used by our users. Thanks for the link. Much appreciated. off topic I spoke to a CTO yesterday who is sticking with a 90k a year bill for an email solution because 6 executives want 100% blackberry support. LOL. That's a lot of $ to look like a w. On 28/02/2006, at 2:43 PM, Ben Buchanan wrote: Hi, This is a simple question but I have not had the needed this functionality before. Is is possible to use CSS to insert text into HTML. While it is possible to use CSS to generate content (http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/generate.html), IE doesn't support it. Big surprise there! Unless the application is an intranet where IE is not supported, you're out of luck. cheers, Ben -- --- http://www.200ok.com.au/ --- The future has arrived; it's just not --- evenly distributed. - William Gibson ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: Solution! RE: [WSG] form button css
Hi Sharron
Thanks for the note. I just started
working on the site Saturday and have tons of work fixing pages. The content is
from my other site, which is getting watered down with posts about photography,
culture, etc.
Yes, please leave a comment on the post
and Ill fix it as soon as possible. I was a teacher up until recently
and I feel the drive to teach. I had to quit when I moved to work with Yahoo.
This new site is my way of helping to teach others.
Ted
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006
6:42 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: Solution! RE: [WSG]
form button css
Ted, I apologize for getting off topic. I visited you site
last-child.com, and your link to FF Alistapart search box won't work for
me. Using FF, also can't seem to locate a contact link to notify you. Do
you mean for folks who find things that don't seem to work to leave a comment
in the comments areas? I am a bit confused.
Like they site by the way, bookmarked it!
- Original Message -
From: Ted Drake
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February
27, 2006 8:13 PM
Subject: Solution! RE:
[WSG] form button css
Ok, I found the ultimate solution while
working on another section where inline images were not aligning with text.
Im using button with an image per
Thierrys suggestion. I didnt want to use background image on an
input because there are some browser inconsistencies and I didnt want to
use an image in the input due to some accessibility concerns.
So, the final css:
#ytTopSearch button {border:none;
background:none; padding:0; margin:0; vertical-align:middle; cursor:pointer;
*cursor:hand; }
Vertical-align:middle has the submit
button and inline images centered vertically with the text. Ive checked
it in FF 1.5 and IE6.
Im using the
Has anyone come across any problems using
vertical-align?
By the way, Im working on a new
site, www.last-child.com that will be
my little scrapbook of code snippets, solutions, etc. This will be an example
of the kind of quick tip that will be available. Ive begun by
transferring posts from my other site. Its still a bit rough in Safari
and Im ignoring IE6 as it isnt representative of browsers used by
advanced CSS programmers.
Feel free to kick the tires, leave
suggestions, find errors, etc.
Ted
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Gellan
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006
5:44 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] form button css
Ted,
Its relatively easy to do what you are trying to do ..I
accomplished the same thing on my site with this code.
.newsletter-button1 {font-family:'Street Corner';
font-style:normal; font-variant:small-caps; font-weight:normal; font-size:10px;
color:rgb(51,51,51); letter-spacing:3px; background-color:white; background-image:url('images/silvernavbar.gif');
border-width:1px; border-color:black; border-style:solid; width:80px; }
.style131 {font-family: Street Corner}
.style129 {color: #434343; font-weight: bold; font-family: Street
Corner; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; line-height: normal;
font-variant: normal; text-transform: none; }
Thanks,
James Gellan
Rayne Creative
404-468-6347
- Original Message -
From: Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 19:48
Subject: [WSG] form button css
Hi All
I'm having some trouble using an image as a button in a form. I've zeroed
out the margins and paddings in this simple search box and yet the button
wants to sit about 6px higher than the label and input. I've added this
klunky css, margin:6px 0 -6px 0;
This just doesn't look good to me. I'm pushing it down 6px and then
sucking
up the bottom by 6px. If I don't do this, it pushes the label and input
down
6px.
I haven't worked with buttons much, I prefer to leave the submit buttons
alone. Does anyone have a suggestion? Here's the code:
form name=searchForm action=""
method=GET >
checkQuery(this);
label for="" foo:/label
input type=text name= foo id=prod
size=50 /
button name=submit type=submit
img src="" alt=Submit Button
/
/button
/form
#foo form { text-align:center; padding:0; }
#foo label { color:#fff; font-size:85%; margin:0 5px; font-weight:bold; }
#foo input { margin:0 5px;}
#foo button {border:none; height:23px; background:none; padding:0 0 0 0;
margin:6px 0 -6px 0;}
Thanks
Ted Drake
-- New Advanced CSS Resource Site: www.last-child.com
Contributions welcome, especially safari fine-tuning (I don't have a mac)
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
[WSG] AIMIA Awards
Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
Hi Kat, Completely agree with you. I have been member with AIMIA for a couple of years, but to be honest I didn't quite get out of it what I was hoping for. In my opinion they are blowing the Accessibility Trumpet without knowing how to read the notes. Being probably the No.1 association in Australia for people in our field, I believe AIMIA should try to be an example for best practise: they should ensure their own websites fulfills accessibility standards and make Priority 1 the minimum requirement to be elegible for an award. Andreas. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kat Sent: Tuesday, 28 February 2006 4:39 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] AIMIA Awards Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
278 errors and 799 warnings on the index page alone. - Original Message - From: Kat [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 11:39 PM Subject: [WSG] AIMIA Awards Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.0/269 - Release Date: 2/24/2006 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
Kat wrote: Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? Used to be a member when it first formed. Went to the first conference way back in the early 90's. It was quite good actually, very interesting discussions, very informative on many levels. But after that, I didn't find any reason to follow up on it. Taken a look from time to time, and find the web standards based community much more interesting, informative, and addressing the issues I'm focused on. But like a lot of things, I may have missed a lot of good things going on over there just because they dropped out of my focus. Only have two eyes, hands, etc. I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? Valid documents is a P2 checkpoint - http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10/wai-pageauth.html#tech-identify-grammar I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat If WSG members contribute to it, great, but does it provide value for membership? http://www.aimia.com.au/i-cms?page=1.3.329.8 Regards Geoff. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Converting the heathen: never again
On 27/02/2006, at 7:39 PM, Absalom Media wrote: Lachlan Hunt wrote: What kind of person would rather insult the customer instead of admitting they have a problem? A bank ? I managed to get the standard filler text for a bank's customer service department in pointing out some issues on Firefox 1.5. The problem still isn't fixed either.. Lawrence -- Lawrence Meckan Absalom Media Mob: (04) 1047 9633 ABN: 49 286 495 792 http://www.absalom.biz ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** I had a similar problem with a credit union and their Java powered interface - it would only work if you used Windows and the Microsoft VM. They did display a rather large Java logo whilst the applet was loading. I put in a polite complaint that their internet banking site wouldn't work when I was using Safari, Mozilla or Firefox from Mac OS X and/or Linux. The reply that I got was a lot less polite about the developer saying I should use a proper operating system and that Java wasn't designed to work across multiple operating systems or browsers. I replied that this was exactly what Java was designed to do and forwarded their e-mail to Sun Microsystems - and low and behold three weeks later the Java worked on all operating systems and browsers. ;-) Steve Olive Bathurst Computer Solutions Web: www.bathurstcomputers.com.au _ ... (0) ... / /\ .. / / .) .. V_/_ Linux Powered! ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
I am going to the Awards ceremony at the Adelaide Convention Centre as my work was given some invites. I'm interested to see what sort of role standards has played in the finalists projects and I'll be sure to ask lots of annoying questions if I get the chance! Sifting through the finalists doesn't give much hope, e.g. the non-flash version of the Australia Post Personalised Stamps online (http://www.pstamps.auspost.com.au/) uses javascript includes for the header and footer ... http://www.engagingcommunities2005.org/ doesn't even have alt text on the splash page images (but wait, they've broken up the image for better optimisation! wow, maybe I'm wrong, they're way ahead of the game on that one) ... I could go on... I don't think standards-compliance was a priority! Any other Adelaide WSG'ers going? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kat Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 4:09 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] AIMIA Awards Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** IMPORTANT: This e-mail, including any attachments, may contain private or confidential information. If you think you may not be the intended recipient, or if you have received this e-mail in error, please contact the sender immediately and delete all copies of this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not reproduce any part of this e-mail or disclose its contents to any other party. This email represents the views of the individual sender, which do not necessarily reflect those of education.au limited except where the sender expressly states otherwise. It is your responsibility to scan this email and any files transmitted with it for viruses or any other defects. education.au limited will not be liable for any loss, damage or consequence caused directly or indirectly by this email. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
Further investigation shows that there are a few finalists that have somewhat adhered to standards, but hardly to the level of satisfaction that many WSG regulars would want. I think they're missing a category: BEST ACCESSIBILITY -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kat Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 4:09 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] AIMIA Awards Gday, I find this list filled with dynamic, inspirational people. I come away being motivated and energised. I love youse guys. :) Today, I came across AIMIA (Australian Interactive Media Industry Association - http://www.aimia.com.au/) that are having their 12th Annual AIMIA awards. Is anyone a member of this group? Does anyone know anything about them? Is anyone a finalist? I had a look at some of the finalists and although they seem to require WCAG Priority 1 Accessibility, to reach that, don't your websites need to actually validate (at least some of their finalists don't)? Have I misunderstood? I rather think it's a good idea - but I think it misses a certain something (tableless design, validation, accessibility, etc). There are so many designers/developers on this list (and elsewhere) doing so many amazing things - why don't they ever get recognised for the good things they do? They deserve it more!! Would there be a way to give them the recognition they deserve? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** IMPORTANT: This e-mail, including any attachments, may contain private or confidential information. If you think you may not be the intended recipient, or if you have received this e-mail in error, please contact the sender immediately and delete all copies of this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not reproduce any part of this e-mail or disclose its contents to any other party. This email represents the views of the individual sender, which do not necessarily reflect those of education.au limited except where the sender expressly states otherwise. It is your responsibility to scan this email and any files transmitted with it for viruses or any other defects. education.au limited will not be liable for any loss, damage or consequence caused directly or indirectly by this email. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Linking to top of page
On 2/27/06, Ian Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curby wrote: Lachlan is right, I use image replacement to reposition and stick an image in the upper-lefthand corner of the viewport instead of the normal H1 text. It stays visible in the corner for compatible browsers. Example: http://curby.net/doc/layout/jello-new.html Sorry to disagree but looking at your code, you should be using #content as the back to top anchor destination. Your use of a decorative graphic element on the left edge is irrelevant to the issue. It is relevant insofar as it makes the header unusable for a go-to-top link, and I was explaining to those who at first didn't understand my admittedly cryptic comment about CSS breaking that functionality. I'd like to go to the very top so perhaps #content wouldn't be good for a go to top link, but I can probably use one of those existing ID-ed divs. And I just realized I don't have a skip to content link for text views... will have to think about adding that in. Thanks everyone for your help. =) --Curby ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] AIMIA Awards
On 2/28/06, Miles Tillinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think they're missing a category: BEST ACCESSIBILITY That's just one of the reasons why Port80 ran the inaugural WA Web Awards last year (http://www.wawebawards.com.au). Standards and Accessbility was one of the categories and although not all of the finalists were standards compliant, it was one of the many judging criteria used (our own Russ Weakley was one of the judges). Overall, the proportion of standards-based entries was quite high and I expect that to just get better and better. Planning is already underway for the 2006 awards and as Port80 is now expanding to other states (Canberra has started, i think Brisbane will be next) and countries (Rochester New York) in the future other state-based web awards may start popping up. In short: support any initiatives that start in your area, if a standards-friendly awards program is something you'd like to see! -- Kay Smoljak http://kay.zombiecoder.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
