Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Mark A. Foster
Gilberto, At 09:59 PM 10/19/2005, you wrote: I would say that Islam is true and other religions are not true (although many contain alot of wisdom and truth). I think anyone who believes in anything also disbelieves in the negations of that thing. I don't necessarily. Although the divine

re: Abdul-Baha and savages

2005-10-20 Thread Brent Poirier
I couldn't find that letter either on Ocean or on bahai-library.com but perhaps this will be of service. Brent In spite of the fact that ... has been expelled from the Gilbert and Ellice Islands, the remarkable progress of the Faith there has been a source of great satisfaction. It shows that

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Mark A. Foster
Gilberto, At 11:38 PM 10/19/2005, you wrote: Which religion says all religions are true? Many New Agers hold to that viewpoint, including Adi Da (born Franklin Jones), the founder of the true world-religion of Adidam (formerly Free Daism), and Ken Wilber. Adi Da is Wilber's former guru.

RE: Sources for Tablets of Baha'u'llah - Revealed after the Aqdas

2005-10-20 Thread Barmak Kusha
Thank you, Max. What I meant is also, that I would like to know the actual provenance of each of those Tablets, if possible. How would I find that out? Thank you, BarmakMax Jasper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In the Persian/Arabic version of that same book. The information contained in this

Re: Contemporary Islamic Fatva regarding Baha'is

2005-10-20 Thread Iskandar Hai, M.D.
For an English translation, go to: http://www.wilayah.ir/en/library/ajwibah/taharah.php#3-13 and scroll down to Q 335 and Question 336, 337, and Q 338 This verdict is from Iran's Supreme Religious/Spiritual and political leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the Supreme Jurist Regards, Iskandar On

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Mark A. Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gilberto, At 09:59 PM 10/19/2005, you wrote: I would say that Islam is true and other religions are not true (although many contain alot of wisdom and truth). I think anyone who believes in anything also disbelieves in the negations of

Re: Abdul-Baha and savages

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/19/05, M Chase [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In his writings, Abdul-Baha made references to the savages of Africa and North America. I seem to remember a letter by the House or another source that explained the historical context of Abdul-Baha remarks. Can anyone please help me find the

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Iskandar Hai, M.D.
I don't have any particularly compelling reason to belive that the hadith that the authoritative Bukhari cites is fake but I'd love to be see compelling evidence that the Prophet Muhammad never said such a thing. Regards, Iskandar On Thu, 20 Oct 2005, Gilberto Simpson wrote: On 10/19/05,

Re: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 10/19/05 10:15:42 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gilberto: I see where you are coming from. But I would still label the Muslim interpretation of what Muhammad taught as Islamic principles. The Bahai interpretation of

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
Iskandar and Hajir, I really would appreciate a more responsive answer. Do you even believe that it is within the realm of possiblity that Muhammad (saaws) a Manifestation of God, the same God that you believe sent the Bab and Bahaullah to usher in an era of world peace, do you believe that it is

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Mark A. Foster
Gilberto, At 07:42 AM 10/20/2005, you wrote: I would say that if you can translate different perspectives into one another in a way which reconciles them, then one doesn't really negate the other. in the first place. Wouldn't that need to assume some kind of omniscience? In other words, why

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Scott Saylors
Gilberto Simpson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 10/20/05, Mark A. Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: Gilberto, At 07:42 AM 10/20/2005, you wrote: I would say that if you can "translate" different perspectives into one another in a way which reconciles them, then one doesn't really negate the

RE: Sources for Tablets of Baha'u'llah - Revealed after the Aqdas

2005-10-20 Thread Max Jasper
Title: Message Some info I found is as follows: (pages refer to English edition of Tablets of Baha'u'llah revealed after Kitab-i-Aqdas) p231 Tablet to Siyyid Mirza Afnan 8-Muharram-1299 (30-Nov-1881) p233 Tablet to Haji Siyyid Mirza Rabiu'l-Avval-1292 (April-May 1875)

RE: Sources for Tablets of Baha'u'llah - Revealed after the Aqdas

2005-10-20 Thread Barmak Kusha
Thank you very much, Max! How did you do it? Thanks, BarmakMax Jasper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some info I found is as follows: (pages refer to English edition of Tablets of Baha'u'llah revealed after Kitab-i-Aqdas) p231 Tablet to Siyyid Mirza Afnan 8-Muharram-1299 (30-Nov-1881) p233

RE: Sources for Tablets of Baha'u'llah - Revealed after the Aqdas

2005-10-20 Thread Barmak Kusha
What I meant also to ask was if you could find out who the women were who were addressed, especially in many of the latter tabletsBarmak Kusha [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thank you very much, Max! How did you do it? Thanks, BarmakMax Jasper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some info I found is as

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Iskandar Hai, M.D.
I certainly wish that Bukhari had not quoted it; but, I think that the Prophet Muhammad said it. Again, I'd love to be see some compelling evidence that the hadith is a fake and that He never said it. But, the fact that I, now in the 21st century, wish that He had not said it is not a compelling

RE: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Mark Foster
Hi, Gilberto, I'm not trying or intending to assume omniscience. It's all a work in progress. It's all tentative. Suppose there are two people and one of them says I believe in 6 gods while the other one says, I believe in 203 gods. It might turn out that the two of them can sit down together

spiritual validity? was Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Mark Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What I am arguing for is contextualization. It is difficult enough comparing narratives of the same religious category (different Baha'i faiths, Islams, Buddhisms, etc.) Comparing narratives produced within different historical and cultural

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Iskandar Hai, M.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I certainly wish that Bukhari had not quoted it; but, I think that the Prophet Muhammad said it. Again, I'd love to be see some compelling evidence that the hadith is a fake and that He never said it. But, the fact that I, now in the

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Scott Saylors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gilberto Simpson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 10/20/05, Mark A. Foster wrote: Gilberto, At 07:42 AM 10/20/2005, you wrote: I would say that if you can translate different perspectives into one another in a way which reconciles them,

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Hajir Moghaddam
I certainly wish that Bukhari had not quoted it; but, I think that theProphet Muhammad said it. Again, I'd love to be see some compellingevidence that the hadith is a fake and that He never said it. But, thefact that I, now in the 21st century, wish that He had not said it is nota

Sci. Theol. News: Baha'i conference attempts faith in action

2005-10-20 Thread Barmak Kusha
Baha'i conference attempts faith in actionScience Theology News - Quincy,MA,USABy Safa Sadeghpour. CAMBRIDGE, Mass. -- For the Baha'i faith, understanding the relationship between science and religion is crucial to spiritual growth. ... What is Baha'i?Science Theology News -

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Iskandar Hai, M.D.
I wouldn't want to read into that hadith things that are not obviously and clearly in it. That would be distortion and misrepresentation. Unless, of course, one can find another particular hadith that specifically, explicitly, and clearly addresses this hadith and elaborates on it and clarifies

Re: Abdul-Baha and savages

2005-10-20 Thread Brent Poirier Attorney at Law
I recall something along that line but don't know where it was Brent - Original Message - From: M Chase [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Baha'i Studies bahai-st@list.jccc.edu; Brent Poirier [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 4:17 PM Subject: Re: Abdul-Baha and savages Dear

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Iskandar Hai, M.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wouldn't want to read into that hadith things that are not obviously and clearly in it. That would be distortion and misrepresentation. Personally, I would want to avoid fundamentalism and a certain narrow minded approach. For most

RE: Abdul-Baha and savages

2005-10-20 Thread Max Jasper
Title: Message "If man himself is left in his natural state, he will become lower than the animal and continue to grow more ignorant and imperfect. The savage tribes of central Africa are evidences of this. Left in their natural condition, they have sunk to the lowest depths and degrees

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Hajir Moghaddam
I'm very happy you said that, Gilberto: "So it would be clearly wrong to kill someone who had done nothing wrong." The problem is, it is "wrong" for a Muslim to become a Baha'i. This is a greatest form of challenge for any religion that springs out of Islam, especially a religion that

What did Abdu'l-Bahá Know: An Historical Document

2005-10-20 Thread Max Jasper
Title: Message What did Abdu'l-Bah Know: An Historical Document http://studycircle.angeltowns.com/images/sur132.gif http://studycircle.angeltowns.com/images/sur133.gif The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto ("e-mail") is sent by the Johnson County

Re: Fwd: Interesting thread

2005-10-20 Thread Gilberto Simpson
On 10/20/05, Iskandar Hai, M.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for your attempts at clarifying the issue; but, with all due respect, I'm not persuaded yet that the Bukhari hadith that Hajir mentioned is fake. But I'd love to be able to belive what you say below. I'm not trying to argue that