On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 8:14 AM, Colin Walters walt...@verbum.org wrote:
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 12:22 +0200, Florian Müllner wrote:
First: If we are actually ready to roll out ostree images, that's
awesome news!
Depends who the audience is...no security updates and you need to build
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 23:24 -0700, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
So it's important that we get it right the first time.
No, it's not.
It's important that we make the changes when we get details wrong, as is
the case in any software.
If we had to get things right the first time, we wouldn't be
On 24 April 2013 04:54, Mathieu Bridon boche...@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 04:00 +0300, Luc Pionchon wrote:
On 24 April 2013 02:14, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org wrote:
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Marco Scannadinari
ma...@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
I
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:14 AM, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org wrote:
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Marco Scannadinari
ma...@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
In fact, I think that these sorts of subtle
design-based decisions should be held in something like loomio (see
recent loomio post
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:53 AM, Luc Pionchon pionchon@gmail.com wrote:
The main point is that so-called controversial features does not have to
be either a hard default, either rotting in a branch. They can be shipped as
default, but with a way to revert them in the case they block the
On 24 April 2013 11:57, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org wrote:
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:53 AM, Luc Pionchon pionchon@gmail.com
wrote:
The main point is that so-called controversial features does not have
to
be either a hard default, either rotting in a branch. They can be
shipped
Planning an ostree hackfest would be more useful I would say, instead of
arguing over (another) new way of shipping code to
users/developers/testers...
Once ostree is usable all this will be moot: let developers code the thing
and once finished let everyone know that feature X can be tested with
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 3:51 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me wrote:
At least until we get a better testing infrastructure in place, the
only way to get at least *some* user testing is [...] to get some minimal
exposure to adventurous users of unstable/experimental distributions
Again
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 12:22 +0200, Florian Müllner wrote:
First: If we are actually ready to roll out ostree images, that's
awesome news!
Depends who the audience is...no security updates and you need to build
applications from source. But if you want to see GNOME as it is a few
minutes or
El 22/04/13 18:57, Allan Day escribió:
Federico Mena Quintero feder...@gnome.org wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
* Unsuitability of 16x16px icons on touch screens
So make them larger :)
And make the bar taller in the process? I don't think that people
would
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 19:55 +0200, Giovanni Campagna wrote:
To me, a reasonable compromise (yet to decide if technically possible)
would be to have a feature branch, that is not merged in master
until after it's thoroughly user tested. And that possibly gets punted
to 3.12 or never, if it
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 20:56 -0700, Andrew Potter wrote:
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 6:36 AM, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com
wrote:
It should be said that, as with any design, there are
tradeoffs here.
There are lots of advantages to this approach (see the design
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 11:28 -0400, Jasper St. Pierre wrote:
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 11:25 AM, Bastien Nocera had...@hadess.net
wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 11:18 -0400, Jasper St. Pierre wrote:
I'm concerned about the automatically opening dialog thing
because
Allan Day (allanp...@gmail.com) said:
The other day she called me as she couldn't
figure out how to increase the volume. It turns out that audio was
muted, and what gnome-shell shows in that case is a dark gray audio icon
with a tiny little X on its corner.
The dark gray icon (around
Hello,
Any plan to add a suspend menu entry, or should we still use the
undiscoverable 'alt' trick? Newer GNOME version (3.6 ?) fixed the
problem of not being able to shutdown with another problem of not being
able to suspend, that's not an improvement... Or did I miss something?
Sorry if that
Le lundi 22 avril 2013 à 14:36 +0100, Allan Day a écrit :
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm proposing it as a feature for 3.10 [1].
The main element of the
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:25 AM, Bill Nottingham nott...@redhat.com wrote:
To echo Federico, I think it's a problem with any of the icons that use the
two-tone scheme, or a problem with the tone itself rather than the icon.
The 'inactive/background' dark gray used in the status indicators
Unfortunately, we don't have the benefit of two years of betas,
so if we implement and deliver this 3.10, there is a risk of an
impendance mismatch between what's expected from the designs and
theory behind them, and how the user effectively react. Which
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Marco Scannadinari
ma...@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
In fact, I think that these sorts of subtle
design-based decisions should be held in something like loomio (see
recent loomio post in desktop-devel), to be later implemented if the
response is positive.
And
On 24 April 2013 02:14, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org wrote:
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Marco Scannadinari
ma...@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
I think your suggestion of a feature branch can be a worthy
compromise, though.
Except that Bastien is right - while on a branch, a
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.orgwrote:
I think your suggestion of a feature branch can be a worthy
compromise, though.
Except that Bastien is right - while on a branch, a feature will
hardly be tested by anyone than other core developers of the same
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 04:00 +0300, Luc Pionchon wrote:
On 24 April 2013 02:14, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org wrote:
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Marco Scannadinari
ma...@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
I think your suggestion of a feature branch can be a worthy
compromise, though.
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm proposing it as a feature for 3.10 [1].
It looks like all the pictures from the
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 15:50 +0200, Frederic Crozat wrote:
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
snip
However, while switching wi-fi networks will require an extra step, I
actually think that the the experience will be better with the new
design. The current network menu contains a lot of
Hey Allan,
first of all thanks a lot for taking the time to look into these issues
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
snip
However, while switching wi-fi networks will require an extra step, I
actually think that the the experience will be better with the new
design.
I would make it clear that Wi-Fi networks that connect automatically
(known networks)
2013/4/22 Bastien Nocera had...@hadess.net:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 15:50 +0200, Frederic Crozat wrote:
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
snip
However, while switching wi-fi networks will require an extra step, I
actually think that the the experience will be better with the new
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 16:01 +0200, Frederic Crozat wrote:
2013/4/22 Bastien Nocera had...@hadess.net:
snip
I also think that we'll need to have more applications, and desktop
daemons making use of GNetworkMonitor to check whether they have access
to the Internet before trying to access
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm proposing it as a feature for 3.10 [1].
The main element of the design
I'm concerned about the automatically opening dialog thing because I'm
not sure we can tell when something automatically requests network or
requests network on account of the user.
For instance, is an AJAX request to a website a user request or not? We
don't know. It could be clicking a button
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 9:59 AM, Alberto Ruiz ar...@gnome.org wrote:
Hey Allan,
first of all thanks a lot for taking the time to look into these issues
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time,
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 11:18 -0400, Jasper St. Pierre wrote:
I'm concerned about the automatically opening dialog thing because
I'm not sure we can tell when something automatically requests network
or requests network on account of the user.
For instance, is an AJAX request to a website a
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 11:25 AM, Bastien Nocera had...@hadess.net wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 11:18 -0400, Jasper St. Pierre wrote:
I'm concerned about the automatically opening dialog thing because
I'm not sure we can tell when something automatically requests network
or requests
Part two of my reply. :)
Alberto Ruiz ar...@gnome.org wrote:
...
More details are outlined on the wiki [2]. If you do look at the
designs, please pay particular attention to the example scenarios -
these give a clearer idea of what the menu will actually look like.
The designs aren't
Jasper St. Pierre jstpie...@mecheye.net wrote:
Otherwise, the UX of the giant dialog looks good to me, and I'm
already starting to implement it. (But where's the avatar?)
Avatar?
Excellent. Is there a bug to track it?
Not yet. It's in a local branch on my system, as it's nowhere near
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
The main element of the design is to combine the sound, network,
bluetooth, power and user menus into a single menu.
The update proposal [1] lists the following items as problems, but it
doesn't say *why* they are problems. I'll comment:
*
Federico Mena Quintero feder...@gnome.org wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
The main element of the design is to combine the sound, network,
bluetooth, power and user menus into a single menu.
The update proposal [1] lists the following items as problems, but it
On 22 April 2013 19:57, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote:
Federico Mena Quintero feder...@gnome.org wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 14:36 +0100, Allan Day wrote:
But on non-touch screens, some people like my mom (whose eyesight is not
so great these days) could also benefit from bigger
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 11:57 AM, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote:
But on non-touch screens, some people like my mom (whose eyesight is not
so great these days) could also benefit from bigger icons, or at least
*more contrasty* icons.
Dude, they couldn't have any more contrast.
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm proposing it as a feature for 3.10 [1].
The main element of the design is to
Hi Allen, I appreciate the opportunity to give feeedback on this. Thank
you.
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 6:36 AM, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote:
It should be said that, as with any design, there are tradeoffs here.
There are lots of advantages to this approach (see the design page),
but
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 8:29 AM, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote:
Part two of my reply. :)
Alberto Ruiz ar...@gnome.org wrote:
...
More details are outlined on the wiki [2]. If you do look at the
designs, please pay particular attention to the example scenarios -
these give a
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 8:10 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me wrote:
This is problematic is for those of us who use VPN
The mockup[0] linked from the proposal shows VPN(s) directly in the
menu when a VPN has been set up. Non-issue?
[0]
Hey Giovanni!
Giovanni Campagna scampa.giova...@gmail.com wrote:
As one of the implementors of the current status icons, and current
developer of gnome-shell, I can tell it's a small can of worms, but that's
not what this is about.
Rather, what I'd like to point out is that, in my opinion,
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.orgwrote:
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 8:10 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me
wrote:
This is problematic is for those of us who use VPN
The mockup[0] linked from the proposal shows VPN(s) directly in the
menu when a VPN
Sriram Ramkrishna s...@ramkrishna.me wrote:
Thanks, I must have missed it. I did peruse it and it's still an extra
click and misses the convenience of going to the network menu and hitting
vpn on. If you're doing a lot of it I can see it getting a little
irritating.
Yep, that's a downside
, 4/22/13, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote:
From: Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Feature proposal: combined system status menu
To: Giovanni Campagna scampa.giova...@gmail.com
Cc: desktop-devel-list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org
Date: Monday, April 22, 2013, 2:18 PM
Hey Giovanni
On Mon, 22.04.13 15:58, Bastien Nocera (had...@hadess.net) wrote:
On Mon, 2013-04-22 at 15:50 +0200, Frederic Crozat wrote:
2013/4/22 Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com:
snip
However, while switching wi-fi networks will require an extra step, I
actually think that the the experience will
On Mon, 22.04.13 14:36, Allan Day (allanp...@gmail.com) wrote:
Hi all,
This is something that me, Jon and Jakub have been thinking about for
some time, and is now at the stage where we can start to think about
implementation. I'm proposing it as a feature for 3.10 [1].
The main element
Lennart Poettering mzta...@0pointer.de wrote:
This all looks so ... crowded in the wireframes. So very very
crowded. That can't be good?
First of all, did you look at the example scenarios?
On my current machine, the user menu has 6 items, with the avatar,
user name and chat status on top.
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 1:55 PM, Giovanni Campagna
scampa.giova...@gmail.com wrote:
Rather, what I'd like to point out is that, in my opinion, this needs more
thinking through before going straight to shipping.
I mean, I trust the design team and I value your experience in the field,
but
Matthias Clasen matthias.cla...@gmail.com wrote:
Rather, what I'd like to point out is that, in my opinion, this needs more
thinking through before going straight to shipping.
I mean, I trust the design team and I value your experience in the field,
but this is another radical change, and it's
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 2:24 PM, Matthias Clasen
matthias.cla...@gmail.comwrote:
On Mon, Apr 22, 2013 at 1:55 PM, Giovanni Campagna
scampa.giova...@gmail.com wrote:
Rather, what I'd like to point out is that, in my opinion, this needs
more
thinking through before going straight to
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