Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 30.11.2007, at 00:09, Steph Fox wrote: Stas - we don't even know what they're planning to put into CVS. Just And waiting couple of days for the explanation is of course not an option. But opening up a module in the php.net CVS repository that php.net contributors are excluded from

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 16:31, David Zülke wrote: No. This Apache CLA most of today's CLAs used by open source projects (Zend Framework, Cake etc) are derived from require you to grant an unlimited, unrevocable, royalte-free, blah-blah license to use your contribution, and, if _you_ hold

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 17:07, Marcus Boerger wrote: should ever be necessary. And to Lukas, you either violated a signed agreement here by telling us stuff you learned while being part of that group - or you are speculating. You should however not do that! Maybe not even IBM is interested in

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Dropping Namespace

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 04.12.2007, at 23:41, Steph Fox wrote: Can I just ask one thing? If namespace support is once again pulled before it sees the light of a release, can we _please_ document exactly what the problems were, loud and clear, and put the document somewhere people are likely to see it?

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 17:57, David Zülke wrote: Then read it again. It's pretty clear. 3. Grant of Patent License. Subject to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, You hereby grant to the Foundation and to recipients of software distributed by the Foundation a perpetual,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 18:41, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: grant the same for those patents you own. Those CLAs do not require that you guarantee that your contribution is not violating any 3rd-party patents. Nobody can require that, that'd be stupid - how one can guarantee nobody has patent to

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 18:58, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: BTW - I hope you don't think that if you didn't sign the CLA and you contributed code to PHP that you didn't have rights to contribute, not signing would help you in any way. Or that if you contributed code that violates patents, not

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 19:19, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Of course. The only difference being that if users of my code cannot fallback on a CLA as a deflector, they have a much bigger interest in Deflector of what? CLA gives the users of the code reasonable - not 100%, but reasonably good -

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.12.2007, at 20:54, David Zülke wrote: Am 20.12.2007 um 19:25 schrieb Lukas Kahwe Smith: So maybe enlighten me what the purpose of the CLA is. The purpose is that a project/company/whoever has written confirmation that the developer who contributes something gives the respective

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 21.12.2007, at 10:08, David Zülke wrote: I wonder why they need such elaborate bla bla to just say so trivial things. The copyright part seems irrelevant given your assessment and the patent clause seems overly complex if all they are saying that any patents that are infringed upon by

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] cvs: CVSROOT / avail loginfo

2007-12-22 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 21.12.2007, at 19:38, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Sounds to me like we should stop accepting this legal BS. Then they will only be able to pay for a nice little house if they write understandable stuff or nothing is they are unwilling to adapt to the demands of their customers. It is

Re: [PHP-DEV] type hinting

2008-01-04 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 4, 2008, at 6:37 PM, Robert Cummings wrote: On Fri, 2008-01-04 at 18:23 +0100, Pierre wrote: On Jan 4, 2008 6:20 PM, Marcus Boerger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Pierre, we never accepted this as a pro argument. Infact we often saw the necessaity to highlight something is optional

Re: [PHP-DEV] type hinting

2008-01-04 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, Ok here is a genious idea. We call for a 24 hour period of silence on this topic. All people eager to post just re-read all previous emails and once the 24 hours are over you know what has been said already so that you can actually make sure to say something novel. What would be even

Re: [PHP-DEV] type hinting

2008-01-09 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, I am still wondering if we ever going to get a summary of this discussion. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

Re: [PHP-DEV] [PATCH] date/timelib: use system timezone database

2008-01-10 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 10, 2008, at 1:05 PM, Joe Orton wrote: I'm not sure I find the logic of the but the system-provided data will become stale arguments convincing; systems which are left unmaintained by the administrators will have old versions of software on; that's a given. I can't see why adding

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Square brackets shortcut

2008-01-10 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 10, 2008, at 3:12 PM, Tomi Kaistila wrote: Well if confusing is the goal, then yes, since this is classic Perl. I started using PHP, instead of Perl, just so that I would not need play around with confusing syntax. Right, PHP was always about making it easy to see whats going on

Re: [PHP-DEV] no read-only, no moderation, just a simple self-enforced checklist

2008-01-10 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 10, 2008, at 4:51 PM, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 10-Jan-08, at 10:33 AM, Derick Rethans wrote: On Thu, 13 Dec 2007, Gregory Beaver wrote: We don't need moderation, we don't need read-only. We need people to follow a simple common-sense checklist. It's either that nobody saw

Re: [PHP-DEV] no read-only, no moderation, just a simple self-enforced checklist

2008-01-10 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 10, 2008, at 4:55 PM, Antony Dovgal wrote: On 10.01.2008 18:33, Derick Rethans wrote: On Thu, 13 Dec 2007, Gregory Beaver wrote: We don't need moderation, we don't need read-only. We need people to follow a simple common-sense checklist. It's either that nobody saw this mail, or

[PHP-DEV] mailinglist rules

2008-01-11 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 10, 2008, at 8:57 PM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: On Jan 10, 2008, at 4:55 PM, Antony Dovgal wrote: On 10.01.2008 18:33, Derick Rethans wrote: On Thu, 13 Dec 2007, Gregory Beaver wrote: We don't need moderation, we don't need read-only. We need people to follow a simple common

Re: [PHP-DEV] Array syntax []

2008-01-11 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 11, 2008, at 1:18 PM, Pierre wrote: +1 (for the record in this thread :) -1 regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

[PHP-DEV] voting

2008-01-12 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, I think its painfully obvious that a system to manage the voting is needed. Like I said, ideally it should also have an email interface. People should be able to vote from +1 to -1 and be able to add a comment. Notifications should be send to this list about the start and final

Re: [PHP-DEV] voting

2008-01-15 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 14, 2008, at 4:34 , Pierre wrote: On Jan 14, 2008 2:58 AM, Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Voting to achieve what? Fair decisions in a simpler, effective and right manner (and not discutable, ideally). I do not consider fairness, whatever that could mean, having

Re: [PHP-DEV] U

2008-01-16 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 16, 2008, at 9:17 , Stefan Esser wrote: Stanislav Malyshev schrieb: @Richard: You don't understand the Problem with _REQUEST. It is not about the fact that someone can forge GET, POST; COOKIE variables. It is about the fact that COOKIEs will overwrite GET and POST data in REQUEST.

Re: [PHP-DEV] U

2008-01-16 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 16, 2008, at 11:55 , Stanislav Malyshev wrote: I dont understand the problem. You use request if you do not care where a parameter is set and you use the other superglobals when you do care. The problem is that variables_order should specify what gets into _REQUEST (as documented

Re: [PHP-DEV] U

2008-01-17 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:17 , Stefan Esser wrote: When someone injects you a cookie like +++action=logout through an XSS or through a feature like foobar.co.kr can set cookies for *.co.kr (in FF atleast). Ok, you are assuming one security issue here, that is not related to the topic.

Re: [PHP-DEV] why we must get rid of unicode.semantics switch ASAP

2008-01-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 22.01.2008, at 04:14, Andi Gutmans wrote: I don't think this affects PHP 5.3 (http://wiki.pooteeweet.org/PhP53VoteResult ) which I believe we're making good progress on. It allows us to get some of those features out earlier including things like namespaces which the various framework

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP-CVS] [ZEND-ENGINE-CVS] cvs: ZendEngine2(PHP_5_3) / zend_API.c zend_API.h php-src/ext/standard type.c

2008-02-01 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 01.02.2008, at 23:05, Pierre Joye wrote: 2008/2/1 Marcus Boerger [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Crosspost, hopefully silencing this issue for 5.* AND 6 will have an E_WARNING or even an E_ERROR on this. What are the gains? What are the real reasons behing strictness? I really get annoying by

[PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, I know I have been guilty of formulating my concerns about PDO's history in an unfortunate way that turned out to sound more like a personal attack on Wez, than a sound technical commentary (which is all that counts on an OSS mailinglist). So I cannot pretend to have a white vest in

Re: [PHP-DEV] Splitting the subject: the PECL/PHP relationship

2008-02-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.02.2008, at 10:16, Lester Caine wrote: Steph Fox wrote: Hi Marcus, what I want is php-src as minimum you can depend on. And php- default as release managers playground. The RM can then say what he thinks is mature enough to make it into a release. What _I_ want is a PHP core that is

Re: [PHP-DEV] Splitting the subject: the PECL/PHP relationship

2008-02-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.02.2008, at 18:24, Steph Fox wrote: Hi Marcus, Anyway my idea is to start everything in PECL and to to move everything out that can be moved out. And that includes all MySQL extensions as well as SQLite. Only this way people will use the PELC infrastructure. Otherwise we would just

[PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.02.2008, at 19:24, Steph Fox wrote: I see no point to discuss solutions for some unknown entities willing to contribute when they do not consider to introduce themselves. When they don't explain clearly why we should do the move and what will be the actual gains for us (read: for us

[PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.02.2008, at 20:04, Steph Fox wrote: Moin Lukas, Now, PECL has a couple of CLA'd modules already. I don't like them being there, and you have stated your own opinion loud and clear. I think we should be looking for some way to separate out CLA'd PECL modules to elsewhere but

Re: [PHP-DEV] Splitting the subject: the PECL/PHP relationship

2008-02-04 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 04.02.2008, at 11:38, Marcus Boerger wrote: Hello Ben, None of this is necessary though. What I proposed was moving extension development from php-src to PECL an dthen bundle what we see fit into the distribution just as we do now, whith the RM having the last say what goes in and

Re: [PHP-DEV] type hinting

2008-02-06 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi All, Just a suggestion. Maybe make your case analyzing a set of representative php applications for calls to the various is*() methods (maybe even factoring in assert()). This could help in showing how often people are currently forced to write out type checks. My humble guess:

Re: [PHP-DEV] get_magic_quotes_gpc, get-magic-quotes-runtime in head, get a final decision

2008-02-07 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 07.02.2008, at 00:59, Pierre Joye wrote: Hi Andi, On Feb 7, 2008 12:56 AM, Andi Gutmans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -1 Suggestion to enhance the suggestion: return false + emit E_STRICT message (but I am also fine with pure return false if people don't like this suggestion). Sounds

Re: [PHP-DEV] magic_quotes and the question of BC

2008-02-08 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 08.02.2008, at 17:46, Pierre Joye wrote: On Feb 8, 2008 5:38 PM, Gregory Beaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Frankly, I don't see why there is any vote whatsoever. It's plain stupid to consider removing them when a fully backwards-compatible solution exists that has no performance penalty,

Re: [PHP-DEV] final keyword

2008-02-13 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 13.02.2008, at 21:52, Andi Gutmans wrote: Guys, I think we are over-engineering and over-complicating here. Reminds me of all the ugly workarounds in C++. If this is really what you need then just declare it private/ protected and create accessor methods (getters/setters). I don't

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-13 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 04:04, Steph Fox wrote: Tell us the names of these entities, companies or persons, who are going to contribute and what are actually their requirements. What will they bring (saying expertise is not something I can buy)? I don't understand what is so hard to understand that

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] prepend_include_path()/append_include_path()

2008-02-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 10:20, Markus Fischer wrote: Lars Strojny wrote: Am Donnerstag, den 14.02.2008, 00:56 +0100 schrieb Jochem Maas: I think Lars has a point ... maybe set_include_path() could be given a second parameter instead to mitigate the need for seperate funcs?:

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] prepend_include_path()/append_include_path()

2008-02-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 10:07, Lars Strojny wrote: Hi Jochem, Am Donnerstag, den 14.02.2008, 00:56 +0100 schrieb Jochem Maas: I think Lars has a point ... maybe set_include_path() could be given a second parameter instead to mitigate the need for seperate funcs?: set_include_path('foo',

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 22:07, Christopher Jones wrote: Pierre Joye wrote: You (as group) We are individuals, all members of the mail lists. Ok, could the Microsoft and IBM people on this list please speak up then? Could also one of the Oracle internals guys speak up on this list? That is

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 22:19, Christopher Jones wrote: Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: On 14.02.2008, at 22:07, Christopher Jones wrote: Pierre Joye wrote: You (as group) We are individuals, all members of the mail lists. Ok, could the Microsoft and IBM people on this list please speak up

[PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.02.2008, at 23:06, Christopher Jones wrote: I think most multi-person plans that impact an existing OSS project have had some genesis in private discussions before being broadcast. For PDO V2, this discussion was just really slow and intermittent. Yeah, I am basically fine with this. I

Re: [PHP-DEV] E_DEPRECATED for 5.3

2008-02-18 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 16.02.2008, at 02:14, Lars Strojny wrote: I've heard that E_DEPRECATED is still missing nevertheless its introduction is planned for 5.3. So I've wrote it [1] based on a slightly outdated patch by Felipe. The patch is so far complete, as far Thx! as I can tell, but one thing I'm

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Conditional INI support

2008-02-18 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 16.02.2008, at 11:05, Marcus Boerger wrote: Hello Steph, so here's my take on the matters. For 5.4 we collect ideas and implement them. So that 5.4 comes out with mostly PECL. I guess we can collect action items on Lukas' wiki. Well maybe we should target this stuff for PHP6 for

Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP mail() header patch for SafeMode

2008-02-18 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 18.02.2008, at 15:04, Paul van Brouwershaven wrote: Hi Lars Markus, Lars Strojny wrote: As safemode is going to be (finally!) removed in PHP 6, I would propose not to make this dependent on safe-mode. I would rather allow this feature to be enabled separetely in the php.ini. Something

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-19 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 19.02.2008, at 15:32, Marcus Boerger wrote: In fact I'd love to issue a deprecated message as soon as class is found outside of a main block. err .. deprecated? as in you want to deprecate the possibility entirely? or you just want to hin to the user that its a bad idea .. (not sure

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Annotations

2008-02-19 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 19.02.2008, at 00:22, clynx wrote: I have thought about a new feature for some days now. The initial plan was to create a new keyword deprecated which should simply trigger a warning when the right error level was set. This could have been combined with the E_DEPRECATED level from 5.3

[PHP-DEV] Role model RFC

2008-02-19 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, I really like what Stefan did here with his traits RFC. Very solid work, even if there are still some people not convinced if they want this feature in, I have seen little complaints about the way this proposal was made. Quite the contrary actually. I would like this kind of detailed

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.02.2008, at 09:28, Stefan Marr wrote: Hi Lars, What about abstract methods in traits? I think this could be handy to enforce the user class implement a data getter. trait Foo { public function doSomething() { return str_replace(foo, bar, $this-_getString()); } abstract

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 20.02.2008, at 21:43, Stefan Marr wrote: If we feel it gets necessary we probbaly might want to support a syntax like: 'trait_method' = false 'trait_method' = 'new_name' 'trait_method' = array('new_name', 'trait_method' I'm not comfortable with this notation, since it strengthens the

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 21.02.2008, at 03:26, Andi Gutmans wrote: a) I think Traits should be able to act as a self-contained behavior which can always be expected to work. For example if I want a Counter behavior I would like that not to depend on the properties in the containing class. While I don't think

Re: [PHP-DEV] Trait aliasing syntax suggestions

2008-02-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 21.02.2008, at 07:55, Gregory Beaver wrote: Simply re-using trait instead of use is a more self-documenting solution. I found it slightly confusing to see use when that is a namespace-specific token currently. This is also in keeping with the way functions are defined in interfaces vs.

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 21.02.2008, at 19:09, Andi Gutmans wrote: I don't think so. I think the value here is not copypaste but to be able to encapsulate some functionality which a class can be decorated with. Giving a basic storage mechanism to that would be very beneficial in a large amount of uses. Again,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Trait aliasing syntax suggestions

2008-02-21 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 22.02.2008, at 06:56, Gregory Beaver wrote: Another detail: The implementation of the parser changes should still allow a class or function called trait, i.e. trait should only be a keyword at specific positions in the source to avoid unneccesary BC breaks. The current patch has this BC

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-22 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 22.02.2008, at 15:45, Gregory Beaver wrote: Marcus Boerger wrote: Hello Lukas, alright, 'foo as bar' is ok to me and does not even add a new keyword. Ignore or any more keywords are bad and I also think that the correct would be hide(ing). But as I further more explained it should

[PHP-DEV] nettiquette on this mailinglist

2008-02-22 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hello all, Let me briefly pick on poor David's (unfortunately I could have picked any number of posts on any given day just as well) recent emails [1] [2]: they are prima example of very bad quoting. Again I do not expect everybody to read through the mailinglist README [3] from cover to

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-22 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 22.02.2008, at 23:31, Gregory Beaver wrote: I think you may be confused, because your statement about refactoring is inaccurate - for most methods, there would be no change from the current proposal. In other words, in my example above, you could use trait1::a() simply as Blah::a, for

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: Traits for PHP

2008-02-22 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 22.02.2008, at 18:20, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Hi! A trait may contain methods and properties. When importing a trait into a class, all methods and properties are imported in a way that makes them only visible within the trait (I dont like the use of private How you are going to

[PHP-DEV] RFC: documentation collaboration toolchain

2008-02-23 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, Ok, since there seems to be controversy about how to best collaborate on documents like TODO lists, RFC's, README's etc. and I do not want to piss people of by making final decisions on this in a closed circle. Here it goes. Honestly I do not think its a big issue either way as long

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC: documentation collaboration toolchain

2008-02-26 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 25.02.2008, at 17:20, Stefan Marr wrote: Pierre Joye schrieb: Limiting the RFC to existing php.net's member sound like a bad idea and create CVS accounts only for a RFC does not sound any better. I would rather use the wiki for the complete process. Once a RFC reached a stable status, we

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: How to build a real Trait thing without exclusion and renaming

2008-02-27 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 26.02.2008, at 04:19, Gregory Beaver wrote: My only objection is that this introduces two new keywords, trait and instead. In addition, this can get very awkward if multiple traits (more than 2) implement the same method name. I would prefer a simple recycling of the = sign for both use

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PDO] [RFC] An Idea for PDO 2

2008-02-28 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 28.02.2008, at 15:19, Marcus Boerger wrote: Hello David, Wednesday, February 27, 2008, 9:27:16 PM, you wrote: Greetings, PDO community! My name is David Sceppa and I am a program manager working at Microsoft on improving SQL Server for PHP data hosting. Thanks fro writing and

[PHP-DEV] PDO2 or PDO

2008-02-28 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hello, First up, I have been quite outspoken against CLA'ed code in PECL in the past. With the current proposal I am willing to reconsider this position. The main difference to me is that is that I expect the different vendors to take a much more active role in the development. This

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Replace the flex-based scanner with an re2c [1] based lexer

2008-03-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.03.2008, at 00:48, Alan Knowles wrote: Can you clarify the Multibyte issues: - I presume this means that it can handle ASCII/UTF8/16 etc. but will not handle things like BIG5/GB encoding in source code - this may be a bit of an issue around here.. At first I also thought that

[PHP-DEV] wiki.php.net

2008-03-05 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, Ok so we have a wiki up and running at wiki.php.net. It is integrated with master.php.net, so you can use your cvs password to login. Pierre and I are currently the only ones with admin accounts, but aside from administration of ACL's etc anyone with a CVS based login can create,

Re: [PHP-DEV] wiki.php.net

2008-03-05 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 05.03.2008, at 18:54, Pierre Joye wrote: Hi Stan, On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 6:41 PM, Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! Ok so we have a wiki up and running at wiki.php.net. It is integrated Great! Thanks a lot! I should have also mentioned that in fact Pierre was the

Re: [PHP-DEV] wiki.php.net

2008-03-05 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 06.03.2008, at 00:45, Lars Strojny wrote: Hi, Am Mittwoch, den 05.03.2008, 18:54 +0100 schrieb Pierre Joye: [...] Yes, that's the plan. Lukas will do it as far as I remember. I also updated the syntax hightlighter (code tag), it sill uses Geshi but in a nicer way (for those interested, it

Re: [PHP-DEV] wiki.php.net

2008-03-06 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 06.03.2008, at 09:26, Pierre Joye wrote: On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 2:23 AM, Lars Strojny [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Am Donnerstag, den 06.03.2008, 01:24 +0100 schrieb Pierre Joye: [...] Maybe SOC:2008, using SOC as namespace and 200X for the main pages is better. I like that. Is it

Re: [PHP-DEV] PHPUnit under the umbrella of PHP for GSoC

2008-03-06 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 06.03.2008, at 21:40, Pierre Joye wrote: Hi All, 1) php internals (php-src, qa, docs etc) 2) any other php.net subproject 3) other php projects if a proposal falls in 3) it needs to be really good and all the prosals left in 1) and 2) need to be pretty unexciting in order to be

Re: [PHP-DEV] google SoC - dbobj

2008-03-19 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hello Banko, I remember that you proposed an ORM written in C/C++ last year around the same time. Back then I was quite opposed to the idea, saying that something like this best belongs in userland, and that at most certain bottleneck features should be moved to C (following the example of

Re: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag

2008-03-26 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 26.03.2008, at 20:55, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Hi! I don't think I've ever said I don't like short tags. It's not the issue here. The issue is that allowing to change it during runtime adds more WTF to PHP. WTF factors are bad. 2. For any code messing with this value - and this

Re: [PHP-DEV] Backporting to 5_3

2008-03-26 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 26.03.2008, at 22:05, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: never heard of XPath.class.php and also never heard of some code deep inside this Xayara CMS. And used by people. Did I or anybody here on the list actually contacted with these people or not does not matter - we can't contact millions

Re: [PHP-DEV] Backporting to 5_3

2008-03-27 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 26.03.2008, at 17:56, Pierre Joye wrote: On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 5:39 PM, Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! - Added runtime JIT auto-globals fetching and caching. (Dmitry, Sara) Does this change any semantics, etc? Any reason why it wasn't merged in the first place?

Re: [PHP-DEV] Backporting to 5_3

2008-03-30 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 26.03.2008, at 14:04, Felipe Pena wrote: So what is the conclusion here? - Added runtime JIT auto-globals fetching and caching. (Dmitry, Sara) backport (based on the arguments from Pierre) - Added jump label operator (limited goto). (Dmitry, Sara) backport - Removed support for

[PHP-DEV] little regulation on competing/extending RFC's

2008-04-02 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hi, I unilaterally put in a regulation in place on the wiki on how to deal with competing/extending proposals, where the original RFC creator and would be contributors cannot agree on how to integrate the differences into the original RFC [1]. I already made a note of this on the wiki

Re: [PHP-DEV] CVS Account Request: goldoraf

2008-04-03 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.04.2008, at 10:42, Raphaël Rougeron wrote: I need access to the php-testfest-web module in order to contribute to it I trust that Raphael will do a good job here. For those of you that have attended PHP Quebec this year, he was one of the speakers from Paris. regards, Lukas --

Re: [PHP-DEV] Return type hints

2008-04-07 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 07.04.2008, at 18:49, Christian Schneider wrote: Felipe Pena wrote: Right, this shouldn't even be on the agenda before we have scalar type hints. So, perhaps you can make a patch for that first Felipe? I don't thought this before! Sure, i'll try provide a patch. Just so this side was

Re: [PHP-DEV] Return type hints

2008-04-07 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 07.04.2008, at 18:57, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Hi! I just ran into this (IMHO unnecessary) limitation with array_reduce: Why should it only reduce to an int? Why not a string or an array? I plan on submitting a patch for PHP 6 to allow other types too. I'm not sure I understand - how

Re: [PHP-DEV] testfest

2008-04-07 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 03.04.2008, at 15:47, Ligaya Turmelle wrote: I wish to help with the testfest. Lukas told me to start asking some questions in here. So to help organize things I will add this information to the testfest wiki page and if you want pass on any changes for the testfest web page (or you

Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 == PHP 6?

2008-04-11 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 11.04.2008, at 21:30, Ryan Panning wrote: I have been wondering the answer to this question for a while now. A LOT of stuff has been backported from PHP 6 to PHP 5.3. So much in fact, why don't you just call PHP 5.3 version 6? What major new features are left for PHP 6? The big one I

Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 == PHP 6?

2008-04-11 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 11.04.2008, at 21:41, Ryan Panning wrote: Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Native unicode is not big enough for you? regards, Lukas If you're looking for good PR and reviews, no. I think if you have very limited new features, the people writing reviews are going to say PHP 6 doesn't have much

Re: [PHP-DEV] Return type hints

2008-04-13 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 08.04.2008, at 12:13, Krister Karlström wrote: Yes indeed you can implement it using the __call method, but it would be more readable if the language structure itself would support it. I suggested this just because I think that this is the most common way of using overloading, thus this

Re: [PHP-DEV] Return type hints

2008-04-13 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 07.04.2008, at 19:59, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Hi! Right if at all I would agree on having a type hint scalar, but not a separate one per type. IMO (as already was discussed like 10 times?) scalar makes no sense. It doesn't save you any checks, and doesn't provide any useful

Re: [PHP-DEV] Return type hints

2008-04-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.04.2008, at 19:49, Christian Schneider wrote: Am 14.04.2008 um 19:04 schrieb Chris Stockton: You are missing the point, why be strict on return types, and liberal on parameters? Be strict Because IMHO a function can easily specify what it is returning but should be flexible in what

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Strict type hints (parameter and return value)

2008-04-18 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
Hello All, I just want to bring in a different perception on the proposed feature. I think people are very focused on what I call library code. This is the kind of code that should in theory be worked on less, than the glue code that you write in every project to finish up the

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [ZEND-ENGINE-CVS] cvs: ZendEngine2 / zend_API.c zend_compile.c /tests ns_063.phpt

2008-05-05 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 05.05.2008, at 20:51, Pierre Joye wrote: On Mon, May 5, 2008 at 8:43 PM, Dmitry Stogov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's just simple to make constructors work in the same way in namespaces and out of them. It would be difficult to explain why the first script prints ok and the second

Re: [PHP-DEV] Removal of unicode_semantics

2008-05-07 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 07.05.2008, at 18:35, Andrei Zmievski wrote: As far as I remember, the latest point was to remove the unicode_semantics switch and presume that its value is always On. At the same time we said that binary strings should probably be the default string type (which I don't agree with),

Re: [PHP-DEV] Unicode progress [Was: unicode.semantics ad infinitum]

2008-05-19 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 19.05.2008, at 23:34, Cristian Rodríguez wrote: Andrei Zmievski escribió: Done. See latest commit: switch is removed and mode is defaulted to On. Thank you , VERY MUCH Andrei, now we can **really** move forward.. well the next question is binary or unicode as the default for strings

Re: [PHP-DEV] Advanced SOAP

2008-05-20 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 19.05.2008, at 15:40, Marco wrote: This could be a silly question but one of the things that I struggle with whilst developing my applications is the lack of WSDL generation in the PHP Soap extension and the need to secure my SOAP messages using signing etc which isn't really

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Short syntax for array literals [...]

2008-05-28 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
-1 regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

[PHP-DEV] TestFest reviewers needed

2008-06-12 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
. It should hopefully be a fairly low effort way for extension authors to get their test coverage up a bit and maybe they will get regular test contributions for their extension of all goes well. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] [1] http://testfest.php.net -- PHP Internals - PHP

Re: [PHP-DEV] TestFest reviewers needed

2008-06-12 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 12.06.2008, at 20:52, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: So we still have a number of unreviewed submissions in the TestFest bug tracker [1]. We need people willing to review these submissions. The process is quite easy, just head on over to the website, pick a submission, assign the submission

Re: [PHP-DEV] extensions status, to move to pecl or to drop

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 12.06.2008, at 16:31, Pierre Joye wrote: - interbase - fbsql - sybase and sybase_ct I think moving fbsql is quite reasonable. However interbase and sybase I do not agree with. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List

Re: [PHP-DEV] deprecation status of $str{42} versus $str[42]

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
the docs. See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.. ;) I do not know the decision (anyone who cares about decisions being remembered should write an RFC nowadays), but I think what Jani is saying sounds reasonable to me. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals

Re: [PHP-DEV] extensions status, to move to pecl or to drop

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
On 14.06.2008, at 16:24, Pierre Joye wrote: On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 3:24 PM, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 12.06.2008, at 16:31, Pierre Joye wrote: - interbase - fbsql - sybase and sybase_ct I think moving fbsql is quite reasonable. However interbase and sybase I do

Re: [PHP-DEV] extensions status, to move to pecl or to drop

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
in 5.3. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

Re: [PHP-DEV] extensions status, to move to pecl or to drop

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
the shouting. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

Re: [PHP-DEV] New flame

2008-06-14 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
understanding we still do not have any example of this being used in the wild .. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

Re: [PHP-DEV] The battle between users and developers

2008-06-15 Thread Lukas Kahwe Smith
entire words, please take a deep breather and hit deleted instead. regards, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] PS: How about instead sending a mail to the firebird foundation, to which you seem well conntected, and see if they can help? -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List

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