Gerle uses [DEL: 1 :DEL] , [DEL: 2 :DEL] , [DEL: 3 :DEL] , [DEL: 4
:DEL] , [DEL: 5 :DEL] etc. on the 6th course and A, B, C, D, E, etc. on
the 7th course. I have not seen an 8th course intabulated in Gerle.
--Sarge
On 6/5/2020 07:33, Christopher Stetson wrote:
Thanks from me
Dear Martin, dear all
-Original-Nachricht-
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: 7c. Lute music
Datum: 2020-06-05T18:18:42+0200
Von: "Martin Shepherd"
An: "Lute List"
[snip]
Incidentally, this is also the tuning used in an early MS (Thibault?),
= I-Bu MS 596. HH. 24; I-PESo MS 1144
Just my pennywoth
You are missing the point.
You are talking to the few hundred people on Earth who play old lute
pieces...
Imagine Average Joe of today with a score of a Beatles song.
Yeah.
On 05.06.20 18:23, G. C. wrote:
So people on this list, are playing Renaissance and Baroque music
The mailing list software seems to have added a non-breaking space to
the link.
I hope the link works this time.
[1]http://gerbode.net/facsimiles/GerleH/Musica_Teutsch_1532/
J-P L
Arthur Ness kirjoitti 5.6.2020 klo 20.21:
Your link doesn't work for me. But I know how to get
http://gerbode.net/facsimiles/GerleH/Musica_Teutsch_1532/ (f. q1–q3)
J-P L
Martin Shepherd kirjoitti 5.6.2020 klo 19.16:
Can anyone provide me with a photo of the pages? When I last looked at
it, those 3 pieces seemed to be for a 7c lute (13 strings, as he says
in the rubric) with the 7th
Am Freitag, 05. Juni 2020 17:48 CEST, Monica Hall
schrieb:
[...]
> But seriously things did continue to be copied long after they had first
> appeared in print. For instance Castillian's manuscript copied in 1730
> includes pieces which were 80 years old at the time. Unless the ms. is
Dear Monica,
I don't wholly disagree with you that 'stylistic' grounds can be a bit
of a minefield but, I suggest and believe, can still be both useful and
instructive if taken with an appropriate dose of scepticism.. I don't
really accept your student's assertion that 'style
So people on this list, are playing Renaissance and Baroque music
because they have the records? H
G.
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
Can anyone provide me with a photo of the pages? When I last looked at
it, those 3 pieces seemed to be for a 7c lute (13 strings, as he says in
the rubric) with the 7th course tuned a fourth below the sixth.
Incidentally, this is also the tuning used in an early MS (Thibault?),
showing that
If we didn't have recordings, people would have to play them on
instruments...
I think many of those songs would have disappeared already...
On 05.06.20 18:03, G. C. wrote:
What are 80 years? We are still enjoying playing and listening to
Beatles and Stones music, near 60 years
What are 80 years? We are still enjoying playing and listening to
Beatles and Stones music, near 60 years old. And even older Jazz
music. Why would people in the 17th century have been any different?
G.
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
Well - you never know...many many years ago when I was still at school I made
a copy by hand of the whole of Monteverdi's Il ballo delle ingrate. I played in
an early music group and we performed this. I was very taken with it. The score
and parts were borrowed from the BBC as it had not at
The 8c. is merely an addition by Sarge.
It's nice to have this version if you don't have a D diapason ready.
On 05.06.20 16:33, Christopher Stetson wrote:
Thanks from me too, �Ron. � I looked at the transcription, and at least
one of them calls for eight courses. � I don't
Thanks from me too, Ron. I looked at the transcription, and at least
one of them calls for eight courses. I don't read German tablature
(or German language, so I need to ask for Tristan's help), but know
something of of it, so I assume Gerle would have had to use special
Thanks Ron,
though I was referring to published music, not to the fact that there
were lutes with more courses.
Are there any even earlier examples?
:
On 05.06.20 14:12, Ron Andrico wrote:
Tristan, it is a common misconception that early sixteenth-century
music should only be
Tristan, it is a common misconception that early sixteenth-century
music should only be played on a six-course lute. Just like the
misconception that lutenists only played with a plectrum until 1507,
misguided modern historians mistakenly believe that seven-course lutes
did not
Am Freitag, 05. Juni 2020 12:27 CEST, Monica Hall
schrieb:
> To be honest I don't think it is the usual classic scholarly course to
> attempt to date a source by its contents and style. Someone on an earlier
> occasion on the list commented
That's what I just wanted to reply as well.
>
Dear Monica,
Well quite true - but if there's nothing else it at least gives a rough
indication. I mean I'm pretty sure from stylistic grounds it wasn't
compiled in, say, Arthur Sullivan's times
Regarding bibliographical makeup, as said I'm entirely ignorant of its
To be honest I don't think it is the usual classic scholarly course to attempt
to date a source by its contents and style. Someone on an earlier occasion on
the list commented
"As a musicologist student, I learned that style criticism should be
avoided because it cannot be valid evidence”.
Dear Ralf,
No - I'm not suggesting your 'circular reasoning', in particular I
can't see I suggested that, as you put it, 'The music wasn't
fashionable because it isn't contained in MS. from that time'.
Rather I'm adopting the usual classic scholarly course of attempting to
date
Am Freitag, 05. Juni 2020 10:34 CEST, Martyn Hodgson
schrieb:
>Dear Monica,
>Indeed - the Ms may have been copied later than the 1680/90s I
>suggest. But bear in mind that most of the lute works are from the
>earlier generation such as Pinel (d. 1661) Strobel (d.1669),
Am Freitag, 05. Juni 2020 10:16 CEST, Martyn Hodgson
schrieb:
[...]
>Note the tiorba works are copied from the last leaf of the book going
>forwards
No - the book was started with the theorbo pieces and then someone continued
with the baroque pieces
from the end of the book ...
Dear Monica,
Indeed - the Ms may have been copied later than the 1680/90s I
suggest. But bear in mind that most of the lute works are from the
earlier generation such as Pinel (d. 1661) Strobel (d.1669), Hotman
(also a tiorba player d.1663), Dufault (d. 1672), Gautier d'Angleterre
Many thanks!!
Monica
> On 05 June 2020 at 09:16 Martyn Hodgson
> wrote:
>
>
>see here
>[1]A-Wn MusHs 17706
>
> [scribd.png]
>
> A-Wn MusHs 17706
>
>Note the tiorba works are copied from the last leaf of the book
Just follow the link given in the database
([1]https://mss.slweiss.de/index.php?id=1=ms=A-Wn17706=A
=deu=all)
Peter
Mail priva di virus. [2]www.avg.com
Il giorno ven 5 giu 2020 alle ore 10:20 Martyn Hodgson
<[3]hodgsonmar...@mail.cs.dartmouth.edu> ha scritto:
see
see here
[1]A-Wn MusHs 17706
[scribd.png]
A-Wn MusHs 17706
Note the tiorba works are copied from the last leaf of the book going
forwards
M
On Friday, 5 June 2020, 08:58:49 BST, Monica Hall
wrote:
I was
I was wondering about that as I don't actually have a copy of this particular
ms. only the Goess ms.
Monica
> On 05 June 2020 at 08:45 "s.wa...@ntlworld.com" wrote:
>
> It would be very interesting to see what this music looks like. Are there
> any images online?
>
> Sent from my
For the record Bartolotti's Libro primo de chitarra Spagnola is dated 1640. He
must have at least been in his twenties when it was printed - so born 1620 or
earlier.
He died before January 1682. In the record books of the Secrétariat de la
Maison du Roi (Louis XIV) there is an entry in
Dear Roland,
Bartolotti's precise dates seem unknown at present but c.1630 - 1682
may be a reasonable estimate. The inclusion of works for lute by Losy
(b.1650) and Ginter(b.1661) in the earlier part of this Ms suggests a
date around 1680/90 for its compilation.
The tiorba was,
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