Together
in a Cave and Grooving with a Pict? :-)
TTYL, DougF
Shouldn't that be 'Several Species ...' ?
(Yes, I'm back from the UK)
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
Hello. My name is Darth
From: Shel Belinkoff [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
. . . I no longer have any cameras or lenses so it's a moot point.
I know I've been away for a while; did I miss something?
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101
-Original Message-
From: Bruce Dayton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2001 1:01 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Re: Images or Photographs
Welcome back, John. How was the trip?
Far too short - I could easily have used another six weeks!
I didn't
.
Image depth and capture rate (or density ratio and film speed) are
interrelated. Again, the theoretical limit is physically based;
you can't have a sensor that measures in units smaller than a
single photon.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com
.
As for accents - I just spent six weeks back in the UK, and kept
getting told that I hadn't picked up any trace of an American
accent in the years I have been over this side of the pond.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101
a wider colour gamut than CRTs, and a far
better contrast ratio.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
Hello. My name is Darth Vader. I am your Father. Prepare to die.
-
This message is from
Aaron muttered:
p.s. trick question: I don't have a car.
Is this car you don't have automatic or manual?
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
Hello. My name is Darth Vader. I am your
colour aliasing artifacts and/or
a slight colour cast at the extreme ends of the intensity range.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
Hello. My name is Darth Vader. I am your Father. Prepare
)...
Gianfranco
One can only hope...
Yes - that was indeed Tonghang Zhou - I recognise the address
(I purchased a spare MX winder from him at one time).
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
For real longevity, buy a Volvo.
The current record-holder is a Volvo P-18, with 1,690,000 miles.
And that was 2 1/2 years ago, so who knows what it reads now.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA
PAUL STENQUIST added:
The previous record holder was a 1958 Mercedes 180D diesel sedan.
I was a little surprised to find a Volvo claiming the honours -
that Mercedes was the car I expected to find.
Guess what Shel drives, by the way ...
John Francis wrote:
For real longevity, buy
William Robb answered this query:
William,
May I ask you to explain what a Dear Squid letter is ??
I'm at a serious
loss here !
A rejection letter that leaves you feeling really depressed.
William Robb
I know what would cheer you up - a nice slice of toast!
--
John Francis
for if not ruining the wedding, at least taking the icing off
the cake :-) was to offer to refund us the difference between
surface and air shipping.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 429-4427
MyWay.com 444 Castro St. Suite 101,Mt. View, CA 94041
Hello
?
By interpolation (a less charitable answer would be 'by lying').
Doesn't that screw with quality, especially with larger prints?
Yes (according to reviews posted on the digital camera review sites).
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 565-4427
MyWay.com 1070
from the camera to advance the film.
Evan
That's the primary reason why I have winders for my M-bodies;
not only am I left-eyed, I also wear glasses, making it even
more difficult to advance the film manually.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 565-4427
MyWay.com
the
sensor technology ceases to be the limiting factor in the quality of
digital images we can expect to see the cameras continuing to become
obsolete at around the current rate.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 565-4427
MyWay.com 1070 Arastradero Rd, Palo
sensor.
We, the Pentax users, feel this pain more deeply than Canon/Nikon
users because we don't have any alternative K-mount digital body
to tide us over until the eventual high-end bodies become reality.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 565-4427
MyWay.com
that?
Photoshop, Ulead PhotoImpact, and imagENGine will do that. There may
be other programs with an Export for Web or similar feature.
I'm pretty sure ThumbsPlus has an HTML option, too.
--
John Francis . . . . . . . . . . (650) 565-4427
MyWay.com 1070 Arastradero Rd, Palo
to lie to you to get my images shown anywhere.
But if it matter to you that much, don't worry - I'd be quite
happy to have all my images removed from the Pentax gallery.
I don't think I'll bother to submit to any future galleries,
either. In fact I think I'll just unsubscribe from the PDML.
--
John
This will be my last post on this subject, but let me say
I have really enjoyed it, as far as off-topic threads go.
To bring it back onto topic, somewhat:
A few years ago a SR-71 was supposed to be making a low, slow
pass over Moffett Field as part of their airshow. (It wasn't
exactly a
The ist D supports a 1 gb card, saying it will store 70 RAW files, 56 full
resolution tiffs. It will do smaller than full resolution tiffs also, 87
medium resolution (2400x1600) or 512 small (1536x1024).
Something seems wrong with those figures. Only 56 full-resolution (6MP) TIFFs,
and yet
Am I remembering right that JPEG format files re-compress each time they are
saved? In other words, saving the image on your CF card as a JPEG and then
transferring to the PC would be two steps of loss?
No. Copying a JPEG file is just like copying any other file - lossless.
You could go
Boris wrote:
BL This is most unusual. My ZX-L for instance, shows aperture value in
BL the viewfinder if a lens that has A position is set to some other
BL aperture. I thought that it came through electronics, this displayed
BL value. Why it is not supported in this case?
Aperture
I guess I've used the DOF preview button on my other two bodies more than I
knew, miss it here. Camera could very well do this but I don't know how
yet.
Isn't it the same as the MZ-S? Push the On-Off switch beyond the On position.
I own over a dozen PENTAX KM lenses, all superb.
I own 1 (ONE) A type or later lens . . .
This represents maybe ONE new lens in the last twenty years?
Unless you've bought a whole lot of other stuff, I don't think
that's the sort of customer that keeps a company in business.
Not that I've
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(graywolf) wrote:
You may need a powered hub. Often that is the case when there is more
than one USB device per controller.
Thanks - that's just solved my problem with a Hama USB 2.0 Pocketdrive
6-in-1. I have Windows XP running on
Hi,
John F wrote:
I've spent far more than that, over the same period, in picking
up used equipment. Nice for me, but it doesn't support Pentax.
I disagree. Although indirect, it does support Pentax. Buyers of new
equipment would do so at a much(?) lower rate if there was no
As I've said before, I think Pentax has plans for electrical contacts
(for USM, electronic aperture control, etc.) in places where the
aperture simulator is located on the original K mount . . .
I'd be very surprised if they used that part of the lens mount for new
purposes; it would
Another of the things you have to realize here is that most of folks
here on this list, or any other photo equipment list for that matter,
are nitpickers. One honestly would be hard pressed to tell the quality
difference in any non-defective Pentax lens or another in a good 8x10
print.
I got mine from KEH.
CW
In fact they show three of them right now: 2 As, one F
This still comes down to demanding that everybody pay
the extra $10 or so, even if this is for functionality
they don't want and will never use.
No offence, but everyone keeps pulling numbers out of thin air. Sometimes
it's ten bucks, sometimes it's twenty, but no one with any
Yeah, this is my problem. I bemoaned the lack of aperture control on the
body with the MZ-S because I liked using the TV wheel on the PZ-1p to
set the aperture. It's a real pain having to change the lens setting
when switching a lens from a PZ-1p (or *ist/*ist-D) to an MZ-S or MX,
for
I never got the MZ-S, so I'm going from the PZ series to the *D, which
should prove to be an easier transition than if I had. What was it
about the MZ-S that made people move from the PZ-1*?
Far, *far* better autofocus
Extremely rigid metal chassis
Battery grip that took AAs (and
Peter Alling wrote:
I have three things to say, if simpler is better 1.) Don't use
auto-focus don't use digital neither is simple. 2.) If you insist in
using a camera that sets exposures that are not guestimates then you
have one choice, the LX. Everything else is just that
Caterham has improved them a bit. Many more engine options. De Dion rear
suspension. Actual seats that slide forward and backward to adjust for
different sized drivers.
But, they're still pretty basic, elemental things, that go like stink.
I'm sure it's anathema to mention them in
want to think about what sort of power you could end up with if
you really tried. Certainly well over 500HP.
What are they REALLY called, then?
keith
John Francis wrote:
Caterham has improved them a bit. Many more engine options. De Dion rear
suspension. Actual seats
I'm sure that the market for SLRs of any kind is pretty small,
and getting smaller every year.
The 35mm SLR was successful against the cameras of the day because
it was smaller, lighter, and cheaper. The picture quality wasn't
as good, but it was good enough. And the SLR design was ideal for
I remember those days. Those big heavy ugly DSLRs which were not designed
for the general public, but press photographers only. Even so, few were
using them.
I guess it depends where you looked. In my experience as soon as the D1
came out you could hardly find an F5 in the media centre at
Perhaps I have a different way to approach the digital products. The 1st
thing I check is the picture quality. If they aren't good, I don't care. Why
bother to produce a 5MP model when the images are(sic) that good anyway?
Have you checked the Canon PowerShot G1/2/3/4/5? The Olympus 30x0
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white card to do white
balancing? Just like how many digital slr users carry a light meter around
with them all the time so they can get more accurate metering that their
dslr doesn't seemingly give them. Lots of extra stuff to carry.
What I am worrying is that good quality processing might become harder and
harder to find in the near future.
Alan Chan
Near Future be blowed. In two years I've had to find a new place to get
my slides processed twice because the lab I was using closed down, and one
of the two labs that
What is the exposure accuracy requirement of a digital sensor as compared to
film?
Well, just like slide film, you really don't want to overexpose; blow out the
highlights and there's nothing you can do about it. Underexposure introduces
noise (pretty much as can be seen by looking at shots
Vic is right. IMO there can only be 2 possible reasons for buying a 300mm
2.8 lens:
1. You need the extra stop over a much cheaper f/4 lens, notably for
sport or (say) rock concerts or whatever (where flash may not be
appropriate)...
... or if you plan to use it with a TC
I can't see spending $1500 for a six megapixel camera.
In two or three years it will be a paperweight.
No. In two or three years it will still produce 6MP images.
That's more than enough for most purposes; it's a full-frame
8x10 print at 300ppi. Unless you're shooting on a tripod, at
Guarav asked
I am quite used to the split-image and matte (?) screen of the
ME-Super. Are there such screens for PZ-1?
Beattie Intenscreen has made such a screen for the PZ-1. I think I bought mine
from BH.
Jost one word of caution; the Beattie screens can cause the in-camera
Here's my little theory about WB - you don't need to worry about it.
What have print labs been doing for years? Working with a media that
is stuck on daylight balance but shot in a multitude of conditions. If
you're making prints, find an expert printer and let him do his job.
Yep. I must
passed by before you are convinced
that the outlay on the digital was worth it.
-Original Message-
From: John Francis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 13 October 2003 04:51
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Has Pentax missed again?
And, of course, in three years it's
Guarav asked
I am quite used to the split-image and matte (?) screen of the
ME-Super. Are there such screens for PZ-1?
Beattie Intenscreen has made such a screen for the PZ-1. I think I bought
mine
from BH.
Jost one word of caution; the Beattie screens can cause
A lot of people get excited about CF speed, but I really don't think
it is too big of a deal unless you plan on shooting sports or other
things were timing is critical. The buffer on the *ist D is pretty
big and I've never filled it in normal shooting...only when I was
holding the shutter
Next question, how much more accurately (if at all) is the diaphram
controlled on an A lens rather than a K lens.
Simple question, tricky answer.
First of all: there's no requirement for the aperture response of any
K lens to be the same as a different lens; all that is required is that
the
OK, now we're getting to the part where my analysis has to be spot on.
Shooting motorsports, I'm not going to have time to review in camera.
Not something you want to do, in any case, with large heavy objects
whizzing by at 200mph. Not that I haven't seen people doing that;
sitting on the
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 09:57:50 +1000, Rob Studdert wrote:
Will this high speed shooting be out of doors? If so set the white
balance to a fixed value and get it right all the time instead.
It will, and if a fixed value or the presets is close enough for this
usage, that sounds great
At 01:41 AM 10/14/03, you wrote:
Given the above info, is there any way that the back of a K mount lens
could be modified to let the *ist D fire using stop down metering in
similar modes?
snip
I suspect that more people would complain about the loss of full-
aperture
John, have you got a web site? Fast cars fast cars fast cars fast cars *~*
I get my track access from motorsport.com, so most of my stuff goes there.
I've got a few older shots up at my home page http://www.panix.com/~johnf/,
and I've recently been given some space on a system operated by a
one feature i would like to see in a digital camera is a portrait mode that
would rotate the orientation of the sensor in the camera without rotating
the camera.
Why? It's an extra mechanical thing that could go wrong, and one which affects
the most critical element in the camera - the
I am on holiday in Greece and have shot 2 Kodak T-MAX 400 (@800, if it
makes any difference). I would like to develop them in my favourite lab
(Ilfords in the UK) but I am worried about X-ray machines and
metal-detector arches etc.
Do you see any problem? Would you fly with them back to
-Original Message-
From: J. C. O'Connell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I stand by my reply. His post makes no sense.
You cant really do studio strobes at weddings
and receptions. His teachers must be the
stupid jerks.
Actually, a stupid jerk is someone who does all his
I knew I had an example somewhere!
This is a shot I took at Goodwood a couple of years ago.
http://www.panix.com/~johnf/temp/airshow.jpg
I was using an MZ-S with the A* 300/f2.8, quite probably
with the AF 1.7 adapter. I started off trying to use a
monopod, but soon gave that up.
I believe
It's been a good day for finding things: I also found
the scans I made to compare two film scanners.
So if anyone has been wondering what a checker looks like:
http://www.panix.com/~johnf/digital/chart.html
(Now you can see why I switched to the LS30, can't you?)
The colours of each
Cotty wrote:
C Rob, I bet you are soo relieved you didn't cave in to the Sigma
C DSLR a while back ;-) The *ist D is a little cutey.
Yes, a nice box but still a box around the sensor. And the cutey thing
in Sigma is that Foveon sensor, something I wish to see in a Pentax
UPDATE:
The basic mod is pretty simple -- changing M to A.
And you don't have to modify anyting.
1) set the lens to the minimum aperture. f22, etc.
2) short the A pin to the body or lens. Use a piece of foil or 32 awg wire.
Without the lens information pins you'll not get matrix
Anders posted:
In last week's issue of Resumé, the Swedish weekly magazine for the
advertizing business, there is a full page article where a long list of
female photographers accuse Pentax of being sexistic in their adverts for
the new *ist-D. They make clear that because of this ad,
John Francis:
The complaint is just as bad as the original ad - possibly even worse.
A long list of *female* photographers? Why is there this assumption
that only females might find the advertisement offensive, or that only
the opinion of female photographers is worth reporting
I'm shopping around for new compact flash memory cards for my *ist-D
and noticed that Rob Galbraith has now posted benchmarks for the *ist-D:
http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=6007-6432
Can anyone with an *ist-D using any of the cards verify the reported
numbers? Are
Wish I had that setup anyway!
There's several folks on this list with the 600/f4;
I don't know if any of them are getting an *ist-D.
When mine gets here I'll be using it with a long
lens, too. Not quite as wide, but the 250-600/f5.6
is still quite a nice lens. I also plan on trying
the
you are kidding, right?
i am almost envisioning a large, mostly empty highway from Boston to NYC
( i guess that should count for major towns, eh? ).
The Atlantic corridor is not representative of the US as a whole. But the
point is that since the Eisenhower administration created the
Electric Light Orchestra, by any chance?
Egad, am I dating myself! And no, I didn't look it up!
Doesn't matter, as I don't recall anything they did.
Think that's dating yourself? I know what they were
called before they changed their name to Electric Light
Orchestra, and can name several
Well, I'm sure I'll be corrected by someone in the Mother Country if I'm
wrong, but I think there are several express trains and a controlled access
highway between London and Glascow, so that the travel time, either by train
or car, is the same as it is between Montreal and Toronto.
I
*The Marvelous Toy recorded by Peter, Paul Mary
... amongst others, including Val Doonican John Denver.
And, of course, the guy who wrote it: Tom Paxton.
For an on-topic reference, see my May 01 PUG entry:
http://pug.komkon.org/01may/paxton.html
if I had spent $1500 on a camera that will undoubtedly be obsolete in
less than a year.
You reckon? What's going to obsolete it, then?
And even if Pentax *do* come out with a new model (which I don't
believe will happen) what's going to be wrong with the *ist-D?
Raimo Korhonen wrote:
Hi!
MZ-S prints exposure data on the film between the sprocket holes - easy to
retrieve.
All the best!
Raimo
[B]etween the sprocket holes? I measure that width at about 2.8 mm.
How does one put ANY info in that small a space?
In teeny-weeny letters.
På mandag, 20. oktober 2003, kl. 18:40, skrev John Francis:
Nothing new here - it's just the normal semiconductor technology
progression.
Yep, that was what I was saying in the lines you omitted in you
response. We´ve been discussing this for months :-)
It would have been hard
Thanks John, but that's the way it's set and still no thumbs or photos.
Try emptying the Internet cache (Tools/Internet Options/General, then
click on Delete files... in the Temporary Internet Files.
If that doesn't work then toggle all the settings mentioned below,
exit from IE, restart it,
There is also a thing called hyper something or other.
The word hyper scared me off, and I still don't know
what hyper whatever does.
Probably my favourite feature (also found on the PZ-1p).
If you put the camera in HyperProgram mode then it starts
off in full-program point-and-shoot mode.
On Tuesday, Oct 21, 2003, at 10:59 America/New_York, alex wetmore wrote:
The *ist D does Hypermanual too and it works exactly in this
manner.
Yup. Because parts of it operate so similarly to my PZ-1p, I can pretty
much use the *ist-D out-of-the-box without having to read the
John, thank for the explanation.
What you are describing is what I call Program Shift
(I come from a simpler era).
It is a form of program shift, although not the usual one.
On the Canons, for example, using Program Shift will simply
bias the camera away from the default program line so that
well, i suppose, for printing uncropped images at 8x10,
6M of RGB pixels is as goot as it gets. but i don't
now any digicam capable of that. yet.
Not yet. The Foveon sensor in the Sigma XD-9 is only 3MP
6MP digicam has exactly 2M of pixels of each color
Not even that. It's usually 1.5M
What I meant is that it should be spec.ed at
the number of independent |full color| output
pixels
I'm sorry, but you're several years too late with this argument.
The pixel count on all digital cameras (with the exception of
BW cameras and one one other case mentioned below) is the count
The shot of the beetle drinking dew is, of course, much better on the
wall than on a screen. There's still no substitute for a real
exhibition!
I assumed this to be the case. While I expect to disagree with the
final placing quite often (I much prefer the jackrabbit to the pelican,
as just
I finally have some pictures from the Northern California PDML Meet up.
http://members.aol.com/doepage2/PDML/
Some people pixs, more scenery pixs, and a humorous (to me, anyway)
accompanying little story. Nothing fantastic photograph-wise, but some passable.
A little better than
One thing which make shutter lag bad on PS cameras is that the CCD in
them is always live, updating the LCD. When it is time to take the
picture they need to turn off the CCD for a short amount of time to
let it clear it's registers and go completely black.
I don't think this can be the
It looks like I have a lot of reading to do. I just
bought my friend's PZ-1P. From the initial inspection
it appears to be a robust, capable camera.
It is. For many things it's the most capable automatic
camera that Pentax offer. As a recent thread discussed
the MZ-S can surpass it in
Thanks everyone that replied to this post so quickly! They were very
positive answers since I had heard that the earlier Canons also suffered
from shutter lag.
Which earlier Canons would this be? I've never heard any complaints of
shutter lag from Canon DSLR users, and I hang out with a
The MZ/S really IS that good, huh, John?
Maybe we need to arrange a mini-PDML meet.
You're going to be up in Boulder Creek; Thomas is in Santa Cruz;
I'm in south San Jose. You could try the MZ-S and/or the PZ-1p.
Or even the *ist-D, if I'm prepared to take my hands off it ...
I could probably
The refresh rate is 60Hz. I don't know if that's high or low.
That's low. Minimum specs for workplace monitors in some parts
of the EU is 72hz. I have my home monitor set to 85Hz.
60Hz with a low-persistence phosphor will cause flicker. Even
worse is if you are using the system in a
The microdrives aren't here yet, but I've got a 256M CF card
stolen from my Canon PS (it can live with 128M).
Yeah - I'll bet that the Canon PS won't be seeing a lot of use over
the next few days... ;-)
You think? But it's got the 256MB card back, anyway; the microdrives
turned up a
D30. Lotta guys said you couldn't shoot action with it.
I will admit that most of the D30 users I know did switch to D60s
as soon as the new model came out. But several people did manage
to shoot action with the D30 quite succesfully.
I assume the same sort of tricks that let me use a
I'd disagree with a lot of the opinions expressed in this thread.
But in this post I won't talk about digital in the pro market.
Digital penetration of the mass market isn't because of agressive
marketing; it's because digital is a better product, *when judged
by the criteria that are important
The latest round of HP's (6 color) are much better than people
give them credit for.
I got a chance to see the latest HP photo printers this week; HP
were partial underwriters of a Computer History Museum event, and
sent along some HP 945 digital cameras, some of their 6x4 printers,
and one
This one time, at band camp, tom [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Photo labs do every kind of printing.
What are you talking about?
What type of printing machines do they use?
dye sublimation or other?
Other, usually. They don't use printers - they use light-sensitive
photographic paper,
My (presently) biggest gripe with digital imaging is the cost. For a
process that is not significantly better, except in immediacy of
results, I am expected to pay a very significant premium? No, thank
you. I can do almost the same thing by buying a film scanner for about
1/5th of the
I wish the Av wheel was on the front of the camera to be operated by the
index finger with the Tv wheel on the back, operated by the thumb.
Hmm. So that would be at least eight different variations; Av or Tv on the
front wheel, plus choice of direction for each of the two controls. I think
I
Mailwasher is my choice. Same sort of thing, but it lets you 'bounce'
spam - those sending spam messages think it never reached you.
Not true, usually. The normal result of mailwasher (or other post-
delivery anti-spam tools) is that the poor innocent third party whose
mail identity is
OK, I've read through the last few digests and learned all about how the
*istD feels, who would like which knobs in different places and so. Don't
you guys take pictures with those things?
Naah - why would we do that?
Actually my other half has me fairly busy this weekend, so I can't get
1. It's good that those with some discretionary funds buy early, They
partially finance the better camera everyone else will buy in 3-5 years
That already happened, of course. The original DSLRS (such as the Kodak)
were horrendously expensive - I believe the high-end model was $25,000
Then
After much to-and-froing, my own Canon/Epson/HP decision finally
got resolved in favour of HP. It's only six-colour (not their
latest eight-ink unit), but the biggest difference there would
be if I did a lot of black-and-white printing.
The single biggest factor was my fear of printheads
All,
I was doing some still-life and macro shooting with my MZ-S this morning
with a couple of big lenses. I wanted to do some aperture bracketing to
experiment with different depths of field, and I caught myself wishing that
my MZ-S had an aperture wheel!
So perhaps hou should consider
When I last posted that live preview caused an increase in shutter
lag I had a few people who doubted this. Here is the design book ...
That just shows that some particular chip designs have this problem.
It doesn't mean that it's an inherent problem if you use CCD sensors.
As I pointed
On Mon, 27 Oct 2003, John Francis wrote:
As I pointed out, CCD TV cameras work just fine, so it's obviously
possible to have a live-preview CCD SLR which adds less than 1/60 of
a second to the shutter lag - something you'd be hard put to detect.
On the other hand, CCD TV cameras
You score 8½ for intellectual snobbery g
Infamy! Infamy! They've all got it in for me!
Kenneth Williams (RIP), Carry on Caesar, IIRC.
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