Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
that spans many classes, and does not fit into a nice little tree. I think that before we take on such an idea, we should look for research about this kind of type inference. Heh well, here's where we notice that Aaron reads and replies in series by paragraph ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED

Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
silently (perhaps with an optional warning) permit it. Please think carefully about how dynamic you want Perl 6 to be Dynamic is good, but there's such a thing as too much of a good thing. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite

Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
it might change at run-time. Is that really what you want? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-31 Thread Aaron Sherman
stupid questions now means that we'll have smart answers by the time P6 is released. If I'm overly slowing the process, please say so, and I'll stop asking. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-31 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 15:25, chromatic wrote: On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 13:11 -0500, Aaron Sherman wrote: I can't answer most of these well. However... Open-Closed is a great idea until the most natural and easiest way to do something is to to redefine a little bit of the world. You seemed

Re: identity tests and comparing two references

2005-04-01 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 23:46 -0800, Darren Duncan wrote: What I want to be able to do is compare two references to see if they point to the same thing, in this case an object, but in other cases perhaps some other type of thing. Let's be clear about the difference between P5 and P6 here. In

Re: identity tests and comparing two references

2005-04-01 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Fri, 2005-04-01 at 10:46, Larry Wall wrote: On Fri, Apr 01, 2005 at 08:04:22AM -0500, Aaron Sherman wrote: : In P6, an object is a data-type. It's not a reference, and any member : payload is attached directly to the variable. Well, it's still a reference, but we try to smudge

Re: :=: (OT)

2005-04-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
Encoding) I can't tell you how long I thought my vim was broken because it would just output blanks when I used the digraphs. ;-» We need an S-1 that describes the environmental / egronomic / aesthetic issues surrounding the use of the latin-1 and/or Unicode characters. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL

Re: :=: (OT)

2005-04-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-04-04 at 16:41, Larry Wall wrote: On Mon, Apr 04, 2005 at 03:55:23PM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: : but if you use vim or emacs inside a terminal, you'll want to make sure : it's in iso-latin-1 mode (e.g. in gnome-terminal, you have to use the : menu: Terminal-Set Character

Re: identity tests and comparing two references

2005-04-06 Thread Aaron Sherman
to add a mixin, for example: $r = \$a but Ref::Weak; Now, someone gets a ref to $r, and wants to call a method defined in Ref::Weak. How should they do that? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down

Re: S26 Draft

2005-04-10 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sun, 2005-04-10 at 14:02 +0300, Yuval Kogman wrote: Please don't be lazy, everyone, and look at this: http://svn.openfoundry.org/pugs/docs/ There are some more drafts that should be reviewed, and more will probably follow. Can we please be rid of:

Re: Whither use English?

2005-04-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
a Language::Russian and Language::Nihongo? Given Perl 6, it would even be quite valid for those modules to add aliases for all of the core functions and keywords, not just global variables. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying

Re: Question about list context for String.chars

2005-04-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
equivalent? Does .chars throw an exception, or does it rely on the string to know how to characterify itself according to its vtable? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Whither use English?

2005-04-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-04-11 at 15:00, Juerd wrote: Aaron Sherman skribis 2005-04-11 14:49 (-0400): Yes, but it will be spelled: use $*LANG ;-) Seriously, is there some reason that we would not provide a Language::Russian and Language::Nihongo? Given Perl 6, it would even be quite valid

Re: Question about list context for String.chars

2005-04-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-04-11 at 15:40, gcomnz wrote: I have to say I'm slightly confused too for some languages, especiallyfor syllabic alphabets. At the same time, I'm pretty clear for CJK,Syllabaries, and alphabets, or at least I hope I'm clear (I guess I'mabout to find out), .chars just returns the

Re: Whither use English?

2005-04-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Truely temporary variables

2005-04-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
, it might be considered always thread-private and might be required to be a core, unboxed type. These extra assumptions are only worth it if they enhance the optimization possibilities surrounding such a value. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound

Re: Truely temporary variables

2005-04-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Fri, 2005-04-15 at 13:10, Luke Palmer wrote: Aaron Sherman writes: Among the various ways of declaring variables, will Perl 6 have a way to say, this variable is highly temporary, and may be re-declared within the same scope, or in a nested scope without concern? I often find myself

Re: nbsp in \s, ?ws and

2005-04-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
whitespace, but letting it match NBSP and then using \s for splitting things is wrong, I think. Thankfully, NBSP (U+00A0) is not Unicode whitespace. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Truely temporary variables

2005-04-17 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Fri, 2005-04-15 at 18:04 +0200, Juerd wrote: Aaron Sherman skribis 2005-04-15 11:45 (-0400): What I'd really like to say is: throwawaytmpvar $sql = q{...}; throwawaytmpvar $sql = q{...}; I like the idea and propose a, aliased an for this. Too short. Having such a short

Re: Closure/block/sub multiplier /// Win32 module for Perl6

2005-04-20 Thread Aaron Sherman
PROTECTED],$word])} else {print join , @$w, $word} }}' /usr/share/dict/words But, what do I know? ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Accepted abbreviations

2005-04-22 Thread Aaron Sherman
of us have a hard time making out what someone means if they say regexp vs regex? What's more, I'd rather you didn't w comments with single-letter abbreviations, as it would make it much harder for me to r. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound

Re: Parameter and trait questions - just how 'only' _is_ 'read-only'?

2005-03-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 17:09, Luke Palmer wrote: Aaron Sherman writes: What I do not think should be allowed (and I may be contradicting Larry here, which I realize is taking my life in my hands ;) is violating the compile-time view of the static type tree. That sentence is getting

Re: Thunking semantics of :=

2005-04-24 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sun, 2005-04-24 at 07:51 +, Nigel Sandever wrote: On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 21:00:11 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Larry Wall) wrote: From what I've read, the trend in most modern implementations of concurrency is away from shared state by default, essentially because shared memory simply

use English

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-04-25 at 22:24 -0500, Rod Adams wrote: Not exactly a fair comparison, since it's common to not use English due to the $ issue. I suspect that if that was not the case, it would be used more. The reasons I don't use English in P5: * Variable access is slower *

Roles as anonymous and/or closures

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
of its own model method's anon role). has not precludes ever having a type named not, and if that's a problem it could read not has or !has, but that feels a bit klunkier to me. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me

Re: Roles as anonymous and/or closures

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Deletion of members by mixin

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-04-26 at 09:58, Abhijit Mahabal wrote: On Tue, 26 Apr 2005, Aaron Sherman wrote: It also might be useful for roles to be able to delete members and methods from a class like so: role foo { has $.x; has not $.y; } But that brings up

Re: Deletion of members by mixin

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-04-26 at 10:49, Aaron Sherman wrote: Quoting S12: A class's method definition hides any role definition of the same name, so role methods are second-class citizens. On the other hand, role methods are still part of the class itself, so they hide

Re: Deletion of members by mixin

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-04-26 at 12:44, Abhijit Mahabal wrote: On Tue, 26 Apr 2005, Aaron Sherman wrote: So, as you can see, in the case of mixins, the hypothetical: role z { has not mymeth; } Sorry, my bad. I wandered sideways into talking about methods. has, of course, only

Re: LABELS: block

2005-04-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
not able to do: method: args; And I'm not even going to start on the if it's the same column thing... ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: use English

2005-04-27 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-04-26 at 10:48, Luke Palmer wrote: Aaron Sherman writes: The reasons I don't use English in P5: * Variable access is slower Hmm, looks to me like $INPUT_RECORD_SEPARATOR is faster. (Actually they're the same: on each run a different one won, but just barely like

Re: LABELS: block

2005-04-27 Thread Aaron Sherman
, and as far as I know, no one is deprecating labels). * Tagging might be useful in other situations where a keyword would be useful for visually marking the construct. I have no good examples, though. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's

Re: use English

2005-04-28 Thread Aaron Sherman
variable. Well, more to the point, autothreading of junctions will hit the wall of Parrot duping the interpreter. That's probably not something you want to suffer just to resolve a junction, is it? I suppose it depends on how snarled the junction is -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior

Re: Junctions of classes, roles, etc.

2005-04-28 Thread Aaron Sherman
make them whatever we want. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Threading in Parrot vs Perl

2005-04-28 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-04-28 at 10:00, Luke Palmer wrote: Aaron Sherman writes: Well, more to the point, autothreading of junctions will hit the wall of Parrot duping the interpreter. That's probably not something you want to suffer just to resolve a junction, is it? What? Why will it do

Re: Threading in Parrot vs Perl

2005-04-28 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-04-28 at 13:55, Rod Adams wrote: I would be dismayed if autothreading used threads to accomplish it's goals. Simple iteration in a single interpreter should be more than sufficient. Sorry, I misunderstood. Thanks for the clarification. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED

Re: use English

2005-04-28 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-04-28 at 13:52, gcomnz wrote: Aaron Sherman wrote: As a side note, I'd like to suggest that English is just rubbing people's noses in the fact that they're not allowed to program in their native tongue. Names might be less in-your-face. Why are we even having to say use

Re: Sun Fortress and Perl 6

2005-04-29 Thread Aaron Sherman
, z g3 do action x, y, z end This would execute all permutations of x, y and z in parallel (or as close to parallel as the execution environment allowed for). Kind of neat. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound

Re: Sun Fortress and Perl 6

2005-04-29 Thread Aaron Sherman
? ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Sun Fortress and Perl 6

2005-04-29 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Fri, 2005-04-29 at 08:54, Autrijus Tang wrote: On Fri, Apr 29, 2005 at 08:33:56AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: Currently per S09, Perl 6 collection types all have uniform types, so one has to use the `List of Any` or `Array of Any` return type instead. That seriously hinders inference

Re: Formal Parameters To While Block

2005-04-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-04-26 at 09:37 -0600, Luke Palmer wrote: We're thinking at the moment that `while` will probably look like this: sub statement:while (cond is lazy, block) { [...] Just curious, why a sub and not a macro? That does pose a problem with: given $foo { until

Re: Junctions of classes, roles, etc.

2005-04-30 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 22:24 +0800, Autrijus Tang wrote: On Sat, Apr 30, 2005 at 09:13:26AM -0500, Abhijit Mahabal wrote: I do not see how any auto-threading occurs in that code. It is completely innocuous in that sense, and I don't think that is what horrified David. What was troublesome

Re: Junctions of classes, roles, etc.

2005-05-01 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 16:55 -0700, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote: Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 22:24 +0800, Autrijus Tang wrote: That would be absolutely horrible. Str|Int is simply the type of Yes|1, isn't it? That would certainly make signature

Re: Code classes

2005-05-03 Thread Aaron Sherman
a method was created in the metaclass, but I don't think that's too hard. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Code classes

2005-05-03 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-05-03 at 08:07, Larry Wall wrote: On Tue, May 03, 2005 at 07:59:19AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: : On a side note about auto-accessors, if I say: : : class X { : has $.foo; : } : class Y is X { : has %.foo; : } : : What happens

Re: Open and pipe

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
::Socket.new takes parameters that are built out of its entire inheritance tree, so a change to IO::Handle might radically modify the signature of the constructor. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Open and pipe

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
; # Get IO::Pipe my IO $sock_fh = 'http://www.perl.org/' = $IO::URI; # Get IO::Socket would just DWIM. But, perhaps I'm expecting too much... -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: reduce metaoperator

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
to special-case those? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: reduce metaoperator

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-04 at 09:06, Larry Wall wrote: On Wed, May 04, 2005 at 09:00:46AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: : That said, let me try to be helpful, and not just complain: : : $sum = (+) @array; It's certainly one of the ones I considered, along with all the other brackets

Re: reduce metaoperator

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
?!) So I guess he's befunging you! -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: reduce metaoperator

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-04 at 09:45, Larry Wall wrote: On Wed, May 04, 2005 at 09:34:28AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: : Hmmm... : : $sum = [+] @array : : Nice. I just thought that'd be visually confusing in a subscript: @foo[0..9; [;[EMAIL PROTECTED]; 0..9] Now, why did I think you

Re: Coroutine Question

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
, a coroutine would be defined by the use of a variant of return, such as: sub generate_this() { for 1..10 - $_ { coreturn $_; } } Of course, I'm pulling that out of my @ss, so YMMV. ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior

Re: Coroutine Question

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-04 at 10:07, Aaron Sherman wrote: On Wed, 2005-05-04 at 09:47, Joshua Gatcomb wrote: So without asking for S17 in its entirety to be written, is it possible to get a synopsis of how p6 will do coroutines? A coroutine is just a functional unit that can be re-started after

Re: Circular dereference?

2005-05-04 Thread Aaron Sherman
. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: stdio

2005-05-05 Thread Aaron Sherman
how to re-write the string registration so that it behaves itself (that is, unregisters when the use goes out of scope), I think it would be perfect. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: stdio

2005-05-06 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-05-05 at 15:15, Aaron Sherman wrote: Dash this all on the rocks if you want, but understand that this is not an off-the-cuff reply, but something that I've spent a lot of time mulling over [...] First off, IMHO, open should be an alias for a closure-wrapped constructor, like so

Re: stdio

2005-05-09 Thread Aaron Sherman
do think that we can safely expect Perl 6 to have to deal with these concepts and would be well served by building in a standard way to add your More Than One Way later on through CPAN. On Fri, 2005-05-06 at 15:10, Larry Wall wrote: On Fri, May 06, 2005 at 08:19:05AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote

Re: Nested captures

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-11 at 17:48 +1000, Damian Conway wrote: But it does raise an important point: the discrepancy between $42 and $/[41] *is* a great opportunity for off-by-on errors. Previously, however, @Larry have tossed back and forth the possibility of using $0 as the first capture

Of fail, exceptions and catching

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
modules. That seems like a reasonable thing to want, but I'm not sure how it could be controlled correctly. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Of fail, exceptions and catching

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
), you would expect to have something like (arm-waving some naming specifics): given $program.(@args) { when Exception { $*ERR.print $_.err; exit 1 } default { exit +$_ } } Am I getting it now? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer

Re: single element lists

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
direct your attention to: http://groups-beta.google.com/group/perl.perl6.language/browse_frm/thread/24ef8f421548b806/f119fc38427f9f3b?q=comma+one+elementrnum=2#f119fc38427f9f3b -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me

Re: (1,(2,3),4)[2]

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
a little more? I'm confused as well. How does that play with Larry's comment: http://groups-beta.google.com/group/perl.perl6.language/browse_frm/thread/54a1135c012b97bf/d17b4bc5ae7db058?q=list+commarnum=5hl=en#d17b4bc5ae7db058 -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer

Mailing list indexing project

2005-05-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
I'm working on an annotated version of the mailing list so that old postings can be more easily researched. My very primitive implementation is: http://www.ajs.com/~ajs/cgi-bin/p6l-index.cgi The input datafile is: http://www.ajs.com/~ajs/p6l.dat I'm using Google Groups as a

Re: C:: in rules

2005-05-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
solution seems fine to me. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: split /(..)*/, 1234567890

2005-05-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
, split(' ') can be used to emulate awk's default behavior, whereas split(/ /) will give you as many null initial fields as there are leading spaces [...] And there you have it. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying

Re: C:: in rules

2005-05-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-05-12 at 13:44, Patrick R. Michaud wrote: On Thu, May 12, 2005 at 12:53:46PM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: In other words, it acts as though one had written $rule = rx :w / plane ::: (\d+) | train ::: (\w+) | auto ::: (\S+) / ; and not $rule = rx :w

Re: C:: in rules

2005-05-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Thu, 2005-05-12 at 15:41, Patrick R. Michaud wrote: $rule = rx :w / plane ::: (\d+) | train ::: (\w+) | auto ::: (\S+) / ; $rule = rx :w /[ plane :: (\d+) | train :: (\w+) | auto :: (\S+) ]/ ; On Thu, May 12, 2005 at 02:29:24PM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: On Thu, 2005-05-12 at 13

Re: S29: punt [pwned!]

2005-05-12 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Fri, 2005-05-13 at 12:07 +1200, Sam Vilain wrote: Rod Adams wrote: It looks like I'm going to have to punt on finishing S29. On behalf of pugs committers, we will gladly adopt this task, which is in the pugs repository already at docs/S29draft.pod, as well as having a set of foundation

Re: C:: in rules

2005-05-13 Thread Aaron Sherman
, and while ::... has a meaning in S05, :... does not, so as long as we never allow a modifier called ::, this would work. In fact, Larry, I think it's safe to say that is actually more sought-after than that : everyone wants ;-) -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith

gravity defying \

2005-05-14 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sat, 2005-05-14 at 16:22 +0200, Eirik Berg Hanssen wrote: I suppose the first must just make sure not to flatten the %hash: $leaf_value = [.{}] \%hash, @keys; # %hash .{$key1} . {$key2} ... Side point on the whole topic: I just LOVE \ as an explosive list- context flattening preventer.

Re: ^method ?

2005-05-14 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sat, 2005-05-14 at 22:06 +1000, Damian Conway wrote: Luke wrote: If the alternatives are: * declare $self, use $self.method, and .method for calling on $_ * use .method, and use $_.method for calling on $_ I'd say the former has no case. I, for one, am not nearly

S29 Q: Rules for boxed types

2005-05-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
In reviewing S29 as it stands now, I see that many builtins both receive and return boxed basic types. This seems like potentially spurious overhead in some situations, while essential in others, so I wanted to work out a set of rules for when boxed vs. unboxed types would be used in core routines

$:attr vs $.:attr

2005-05-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sun, 2005-05-15 at 18:34 +0200, Juerd wrote: I've been looking for a good moment to come with this, but there is none, making this as good a point as any: I don't like the dot in attributes, and the colon that replaces it. If we have .method and .:method, then we should have $.attr and

Re: $:attr vs $.:attr

2005-05-16 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sun, 2005-05-15 at 19:18 +0200, Juerd wrote: Now: Declaration ExplicitImplicit $_ $?SELF has $.var | $obj.var \ .var \ ./var \ has $:var | $obj.:var \ .:var \ ./:var \ Consistent: has $.var \ $obj.var \

Re: S29 Q: Rules for boxed types

2005-05-16 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Sun, 2005-05-15 at 13:33 -0500, Rod Adams wrote: Aaron Sherman wrote: In reviewing S29 as it stands now, I see that many builtins both receive and return boxed basic types. My thoughts on writing it were: The boxed version is the specification, in that the language must support them

Re: Why $.?

2005-05-16 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-05-16 at 04:02 -0600, Luke Palmer wrote: I am currently failing to see the need for a distinction between $. and $: . The only difference is in whether accessors are *generated*; Not at all! There are numerous differences as described in A12: * The attribute gets a private

Re: $:attr vs $.:attr

2005-05-16 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-05-16 at 12:23 +0200, Juerd wrote: Aaron Sherman skribis 2005-05-16 5:54 (-0400): I'm not sure I see that you changed anything [...] Okay, let's try it differently, then: [...something that looks like braille...] And now, you've s/[\$\w]+//g; what point are you making, Juerd

%$object

2005-05-16 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Mon, 2005-05-16 at 07:21, Aaron Sherman wrote: * %$obj notation includes private attributes when inside, but not when outside the class This bit was new to me this morning, when I looked it up, and I'd like to delve into a bit more. If the idea is to provide a hash-like thing

multi sub and invocants (related to colon question from earlier)

2005-05-17 Thread Aaron Sherman
to the above bit from S12, $a.x calls single dispatch first, so it should call the anonymous role's method x, right? If I wanted to call the multi, I could aways say: x($a), couldn't I? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me

Closures and CALLER

2005-05-17 Thread Aaron Sherman
, in which case, how does log find the right $_? -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Virtual methods

2005-05-18 Thread Aaron Sherman
to implement the dynamic functionality of Any, and given the recent ponie/parrot discussions around flags, I think using virtual methods as flags is probably the right way to go -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me

Re: Virtual methods

2005-05-18 Thread Aaron Sherman
, and it overrode print. But, if it just inherited a print(), then it works. In other words, this code will mysteriously fail the second someone innocently adds a print method to Foo! Action at a distance... my head hurts. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's

Re: Closures and CALLER

2005-05-18 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-18 at 14:57, TSa (Thomas Sandlaß) wrote: Aaron Sherman wrote: Ok, so log and log10: multi sub Math::Basic::log (: Num ?$x = $CALLER::_, Num +$base); log10 := log.assuming:base(10); Sorry, I don't want to interfere but two nit-pickings from me: 1

Re: Virtual methods

2005-05-26 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-05-25 at 09:11, Piers Cawley wrote: Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: There are many gotchas that fall out of that. For example, you might have a special role that overrides .print to handle structured data, so your code says: my Foo $obj; given $obj

S29 problems and plan/TODO

2005-10-19 Thread Aaron Sherman
product, and replace the draft once it's actually in a consistent state. Otherwise, I'd have to muck around with branching, and I'd rather not. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: S29 problems and plan/TODO

2005-10-19 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2005-10-19 at 16:07, Aaron Sherman wrote: I thus propose 2005-03-16 (last Rod Adams update) - 2005-10-17 (yesterday, yes that's arbitrary) on the mailing list and pugs/ext from svn as of revision 7682 as the inputs for the next revision of S29 s{pugs/ext}{pugs/t/builtins} for the most

Chained buts optimizations?

2005-11-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
, but I don't think those get to get called until everything goes away (since there's a reference chain between them). -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith It's the sound of a satellite saying, 'get me down!' -Shriekback

Re: Chained buts optimizations?

2005-11-15 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2005-11-15 at 12:30, Luke Palmer wrote: On 11/15/05, Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This question came out of a joking comment on IRC, but it's a serious concern. Can chained buts be optimized, or must the compiler strictly create intermediate metaclasses, classes

S29 proposed revision

2006-07-05 Thread Aaron Sherman
Larry (bless his wire-photographing heart) took the time to re-vamp S29. Of course, this threw off all of my collating of S29, but that's fine since he's actually answered more of my questions than I could have hoped. The fourth of July weekend was fairly slow for me, so I started with Larry's

Re: S29 proposed revision

2006-07-05 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Wed, 2006-07-05 at 16:09 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: The fourth of July weekend was fairly slow for me, so I started with Larry's S29 and went forward. My first pass at a revised S29 is attached. I already see one problem. as slipped in, which is an operator, not a function. -- Aaron

sprintf for S29

2006-07-06 Thread Aaron Sherman
of the difference in parameter passing conventions, but the example above simulates its effect using C%C. =cut -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith We had some good machines, but they don't work no more. -Shriekback

Re: namespaces, a single colon to separate HLL prefix?

2006-07-06 Thread Aaron Sherman
; elispuse hanoi; say %*ENV{PATH} hanoi(13); Inventing syntactic sugar for the back-end case probably doesn't buy you anything special. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith We had some good machines, but they don't work no more. -Shriekback

S29 update ready

2006-07-08 Thread Aaron Sherman
I've gathered my ducks in a row, used the feedback that I've gotten so far, and I think I'm ready to officially update S29. For that I need two things: 1) I'd really like Larry to glance over the changes and $s29.bless but all comments are welcome 2) I'll need commit rights to whatever

Re: S29 update ready

2006-07-09 Thread Aaron Sherman
Darren Duncan wrote: At 8:32 PM -0400 7/8/06, Joe Gottman wrote: I have one minor comment about join. You should specify its behavior when it is passed an empty list. Does it return undef or the empty string? I think it makes the most sense for it to return an empty string, which is a

Containers

2006-07-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
into the section for each type of container (too many eaches...). I don't even have a section for things like Seq and Buf yet, and I'd rather not if I don't have to. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith We had some good machines, but they don't work no more

Re: Containers

2006-07-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2006-07-11 at 10:06 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: For example: our List multi Container::each(Container [EMAIL PROTECTED]) In thinking about each, I've come across an interesting need. I wrote this example: for each(=; 1..*) - ($line, $lineno) { say $lineno: $line; } Which

Re: Containers

2006-07-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
really blows some assumptions that I'm willing to bet many people will make. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Containers

2006-07-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
On Tue, 2006-07-11 at 09:53 -0700, Trey Harris wrote: In a message dated Tue, 11 Jul 2006, Aaron Sherman writes: But would it be reasonable to also provide a named-only parameter to each for that purpose? It sounds reasonable to me, but :stop reads badly. Maybe C:strictly? Maybe it's

Re: Containers

2006-07-11 Thread Aaron Sherman
to use that modifier. -- Aaron Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer and Toolsmith We had some good machines, but they don't work no more. -Shriekback

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