l decision.
I think this is a curious use of the phrase "relied on". The
plaintiffs' expert (I presume you mean either Rob Pennock or John
Haught) did not "rely on" Aquinas but merely pointed out that the
argument from design is a traditional argum
components of the allegedly irreducibly complex system
(dolphins, for example, lack factor VII or Hagemann factor yet their
blood clots just fine). There is a difference between a negative
argument such as this, which can be tested, and a vague model relying
on supernatural causation (ID), which ca
don't think we can make
statements about what intelligent design theory says or doesn't say
about evolution or about natural history because there is no theory,
just a very vague and minimalist statement and a set of arguments
against evolution.
Ed Brayton
of the plaintiffs' experts as anything
but Dr
Ed Brayton
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Please note
with people
trying to get it. I'll post a link as soon as I've got it.
Ed Brayton
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If you can't get the decision from the court's website, it is available at:
http://www.stcynic.com/kitzmiller_342.pdf
It's a big, big win for the plaintiffs. A very broad ruling, exactly
what the plaintiffs wanted.
Ed Brayton
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to the decision.
Ed Brayton
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Please note that messages sent to this large
are not asserting
thatobservations about deliberate language choices
constitutecharacter assassination per se.
Well, the Discovery Institute just (predictably) called Judge Jones an
"activist judge with delusions of grandeur".
Ed Brayton
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follow the
court's ruling and not appeal it. The policy is now revoked, of course,
by Judge Jones. There will be no appeal of this case.
Ed Brayton
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that they will not file an appeal of the case.
Ed Brayton
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Please note
NOT to perform religious music. It seems to me that if
not playing Christian music amounts to unconstitutional hostility
toward Christianity, then not performing Muslim music must also be
unconstitutional hostility toward Islam, and also true for Hindu music,
Jewish music, and so forth.
Ed Brayton
candle and a nativity scene. All of those things are secular
aspects of what, for Christians, is an explicitly religious holiday and
are thus an attempt to convert the religious into the secular.
Ed Brayton
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of the now-infamous Article III
Groupie.
Ed Brayton
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Please note that messages
, but is merely the
little tree's lament sung to the same tune, in the middle of a play that
is all about Christmas. Hardly justified in throwing around war on
Christmas rhetoric here. In fact, it's downright silly and dishonest.
Ed Brayton
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activities.
But surely pointing to a song in a play that is all about Christmas as
evidence of a war on Christmas is absurd, at best, and dishonest at
worst. It's not part of some conspiracy to eliminate any mention of
Christmas, for crying out loud, it's a play ABOUT Christmas.
Ed Brayton
to cleanse the
song of religious references, something they clearly did not do. If it's
a victory, it's a victory for demagoguery over reason.
Ed Brayton
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with the ability to
turn anything negative into a compliment, totally oblivious to the
reality that people are in fact insulting them:
You suck
Thank you, you're beautiful!
I said you suck
I said thanks!
Ed Brayton
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wouldn't have bothered to attempt to dissuade you of
your views. And thank God (ironically) that so many other Christians (I
mean de facto atheists) don't agree with you in that regard. Take care.
Ed Brayton
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. It is an argument
from ignorance because we have not yet discovered the non-agent causes that
made the hate come into being.
[The above is a genre known as parody. Please read it that way]
I read it that way before I got to the disclaimer and was laughing out
loud by the end. Nice work.
Ed
and anti-ID, and who
really hopes that the doubts are unfounded. We have taken enough of a
black eye because of Mirecki in the last couple weeks; the last thing we
need is a Tawana Brawley situation on our hands.
Ed Brayton
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. My group is holding off on reporting about it until we get
more information. There are apparently a lot of things about Prof.
Mirecki that have not been reported in the press and that may change
this whole sordid story considerably.
Ed Brayton
or Joseph Mastrapaolo can
tell you plenty of stories). I'm sure not going to defend this guy.
Ed Brayton
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without first accepting that Principle X is valid.You cannot logically
demand that Principle X be followed consistently unless you, wittingly
or unwittingly, endorse Principle X as true.
Ed Brayton
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, that it is always wrong to enslave another
human being. It was upon that universal principle that we fought to end
slavery. Were the abolitionists being "hegemonic" in applying that
principle universally? If they were, then I would suggest that
"hegemonic" has no meaning at a
consistently say that they were wrong is to appeal to universal
principles of human rights. Or were we being hegemonic to object to
the Nazis killing homosexuals (and Jews...and gypsies...and dissidents...)?
Ed Brayton
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to be imprisoned,
the government would be wrong and would be a bully. But that wouldn't
make Phelps any less repulsive and disgusting, or any less a bully himself.
Ed Brayton
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be no less compelling.
Ed Brayton
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Please note that messages sent to this large
curriculum.
Isn't that pretty much an admission that the NCBCPS curriculum violates
the Supreme Court's standards for teaching about the bible in public
schools?
Ed Brayton
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their employees to say it. This is the
kind of over the top, wildly inaccurate rhetoric that should be
condemned by any reasonable person.
Ed Brayton
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speak out against homosexuality, whether that
is in the US, in Sweden as in this particular case, or in Canada with
the Stephen Boissoin case (another minister up on charges for writing
an anti-gay letter to a newspaper).
Ed Brayton
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orldly
effects would remain.) But I understand why this frightens a lot of
people.
That much is certainly true.
Ed Brayton
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,
as they are private. However, that doesn't mean, for instance, that
government-run universities can't set standards of admission that take
into account what is being taught and whether it adequately prepares a
student for college level work (as in the current lawsuit against the UC
system).
Ed Brayton
we rule out the notion that said meteor was sent
intentionally by God to facilitate the eventual evolution of human
beings? Of course we can't. Science can answer the "how" question; it
can't answer the "why" question.
Ed Brayton
_
hospitals are violating the
establishment clause by teaching it.
Ed Brayton
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a reasonable distinction. But ID is clearly in the first camp and
not the second and therefore to teach that it is false would not be an
EC problem.
Ed Brayton
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the district and
appeals courts not apply Lamb's Chapel, which seems to me to be more on
point than Good News Club in this case, and rule for the church the
first time around?
Ed Brayton
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Good News Club, the plaintiffs had a solid basis for the suit (I'd go
much further and agree with the Supreme Court that it was an absolutely
winning case, but at the very least it seems absurd to me to grant
summary judgement in the face of such an argument).
Ed Brayton
a solid legal argument based on
Lamb's Chapel demanding non-discrimination (and I would argue, far more
than just a solid argument but a very compelling and winning one).
Ed Brayton
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application so
wrong in this case. It seems to me that Lamb's Chapel should have been
applied, there was no need to wait for Good News Club, and the Supreme
Court obviously agreed with that as well when they ruled in Good News Club.
Ed Brayton
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- i.e. worship, in all of its essentials - yet
the court still ruled the same way. So what is the
constitutionally-relevant difference between them that would make one
constitutional and the other unconstitutional?
Ed Brayton
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word article on the case for Skeptic magazine and this could change
the ending pretty significantly.
Ed Brayton
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http
s other people considerably. And if people began to push the kind
of policies that France has in this regard in America, you would find
that fairly strict separationists like me will be right by your side in
battling those policies in the legislatures and the courts.
Ed Brayton
yesterday may complicate
things even more.
Ed Brayton
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Please note
ms to me that the university is singling out
bible studies from a long list of in-room and out-of-room activities
that an RA might be involved with that might make them less
"approachable" in the perceptions of other students in the dorm.
Ed Brayton
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and responses in one week.
The trial wrapped up on Friday and I know a lot of people who were very
thankful to have been able to sleep in their own beds this weekend for
the first time in many weeks.
Ed Brayton
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rom less than reliable sources. And when their only source of
information on this subject engages in inflated and wildly inaccurate rhetoric
about the courts, it's small wonder that there is such a misperception out
there.
Ed Brayton
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in this case, as
they usually do.
Ed Brayton
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Title: Message
I
didn't say "even when it is part of the curriculum".
Ed
Brayton
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Rick DuncanSent: Friday, November 04, 2005 2:57
PMTo: Law Religion issues for Law
AcademicsS
thoughts?
Ed Brayton
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Please note that messages sent
I just found another story about this that may change things. According to
the Kansas City Star, the aunt and uncle asked if he could attend church,
the judge was not requiring it. So it may well be false. I'll keep looking
for information.
Ed Brayton
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL
, regardless of the outcome. The appeals court has to
take it, of course, but the Supreme Court does not. In fact, most of the
folks I've read on the subject don't think the court will grant cert if
it goes that far.
Ed Brayton
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Gallagher's, but
that's not going to be a surprise to anyone.
Ed Brayton
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ople start to believe it.
Ed
Brayton
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Rick DuncanSent: Monday, October 31, 2005 1:05
PMTo: Law Religion issues for Law
AcademicsSubject: FYI: An Interesting "See You at the Pole"
with
a religious message attached, the ACLU was on the right side.
Ed Brayton
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005
1:26 PMTo: religionlaw@lists.ucla.eduSubject: Re: FYI
National golf club,
and it's true of the He-Man Woman Hater's Club from the Little Rascals.
Ed Brayton
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violation in making a purely descriptive statement that is entirely true, any more than there would be in describing the beliefs of Mormons in an American history class or the beliefs of Muslims in a world history class.
Ed Brayton
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organizations was put there for teachers to see what the range of
opinions are, not for them to give to students.
Ed Brayton
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y described as
evidence that religion and evolution are not inherently
incompatible. But they also acknowledge, in the text that I cited, that
some people hold religious views that are incompatible. That
alone, it seems to me, mitigates the concern over endorsement here.
Both views are described; neither are en
he
science, not a part of the scientific theory of evolution.
Ed Brayton
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d possibly
be. Surely we don't want teachers to delve into taking a position on
which one is right. That is precisely what Caldwell claims to be going
on here, though it isn't. You seem to be arguing that the failure to do
so is a problem, which I'm afraid leaves me quite confused.
Ed Brayton
N
undeniable and I have a difficult time seeing how
acknowledging that obvious fact could possibly be an establishment
clause violation. Timothy Sandefur has a more thorough analysis of this
here.
Ed Brayton
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be shown to students. It is merely a reference for teachers
to show them that some religious groups do in fact accept evolution and
therefore there is no intrinsic incompatibility.
Ed Brayton
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Title: Re: New lawsuit against U Cal Berkeley
Francis Beckwith wrote:
Ed:
On 10/18/05 9:44 PM, "Ed Brayton" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Only because they have been told that evolution = philosophical
materialism.
That is not only false, it is absurdly false.
for many years, including the American Scientific
Affiliation listserv and the Calvin evolution listserv. Perhaps Prof.
Volokh could tell us whether that is frowned upon on this list? I
wouldn't want to violate the traditions of the list.
Ed Brayton
Scarberry, Mark wrote:
I've noticed
that will be
updated throughout the trial as well.
Ed Brayton
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spect I've got a better chance of
winning the Boston Marathon than he does of getting an apology from
them.
Ed Brayton
Joel wrote:
Posted:
9/21/05
Group
revises Bible curriculum after criticism
By
Robert Marus
ABP
Washington
Bureau
WASHINGTON
(ABP)-A group that
himself, who by
all accounts is a highly capable judge. He may well grow into the
position and be just fine. But at a time when the court is more divided
than ever, I think it's a bad idea to bring someone in from the outside
to run things.
Ed Brayton
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meone from within. I fully expect that Roberts will in due time be an
effective CJ. I think I'm most curious to see how Scalia will deal with
him, to be honest.
Ed Brayton
Berg, Thomas C. wrote:
On the other hand, Earl Warren by all accounts was immediately successful as
a leader coming in from t
. But seriously, I think you're
right about Garza. It makes perfect sense politically.
Ed Brayton
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is not the admission of kids who go to Christian high schools, the issue
if admission of a few specific courses at some Christian high schools,
courses which fail to meet the standards of the university.
Ed Brayton
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dishonest, nor does it make your
response here any less pompous and unjustified. When you begin to
represent the facts of the case honestly and reasonably, then maybe you
will have earned the credibility to pull rank on those who call you on it.
Ed Brayton
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edestal on which you have
placed yourself. I'm not sure it can bear the weight of your pomposity
or your inflated ego.
Ed Brayton
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://www.presstelegram.com/Stories/0,1413,204~21474~3026833,00.html
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050827/ap_on_re_us/creationism_lawsuit;_ylt=Aj9doupMbYBM4QWi9_AfpjtvzwcF;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl
Is there any legal basis for such a suit?
Ed Brayton
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gedly from the founding fathers and lots of historical
ignorance.
Ed Brayton
Gibbens, Daniel G. wrote:
I've been a member of the ACLU
since 1979(the Skokie situation made
it clearthey were committed to basic civil rights even when it had
negative impact on their donations) -- I d
hy I specified "rank and file" rather
than conservative Christian intellectuals and why I said "seem
particularly susceptible" rather than "unanimously and uniformly are
fooled by".
Ed Brayton
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Ver
nger. Can science rule out such possibilities? No. But
science can and does seek out natural explanations for such phenomena
and it has been wildly successful at doing so. But it doesn't get
anywhere at all if we interrupt the process and say, "Well science
can't explain this, so God must have
e they only
mandated creation science be taught as an alternative and creation
science is explicitly religious.
Ed Brayton
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EC
problem.
I guess I'll teach Edwards in my Con Law II class
based upon my best reading (which I believe is correct) and Ed can
teach it in his Con Law II class based upon his best reading.
If I taught a con law class, I'm sure I would do so. :)
Ed Brayton
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gn is
just the Logos theology of Johns Gospel restated in the idiom of
information theory", it's going to be difficult to pretend under oath
that ID is not old-fashioned creation science in a new bottle.
Ed Brayton
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certain criteria and it meets none of them.
Ed Brayton
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be . . . .
. ?
I have no idea. Do you have the actual wording of the question? Most of
the time, creationists mistake any mention of embryology and evolution
as meaning recapitulation. Wells makes that mistake many times in his
book.
Ed Brayton
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s is the type of skepticism and
incredulity that ignores what we do know and that could be used to
"disprove" any explanation.
Ed Brayton
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r all of their years of training, are convinced that X is true, but
someone with no training at all in the field thinks that is
"farfetched", I'd say it's much more likely that this person just
doesn't understand the subject they are talking about.
Ed Brayton
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the phrase. This is
likely to be very compelling in court.
Ed Brayton
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l selection combined with
other non-adaptive mechanisms and reproductive isolation over time.
You're not attacking evolution, you're attacking a crude and simplistic
cartoon version of evolution that has nothing to do with the real world.
Ed Brayton
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in or
contributed to the enactment of the law. Pp. 594-596.
-
The ruling did in fact hold that teaching creation science was a
violation of the first amendment, as the portion in italics shows.
Ed Brayton
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constitute "theory Y". They will also be
asked to point to any actual scientific research has been done that
supports ID, to some evidence that ID actually is a scientific theory
that can be tested or even has a coherent model from which one might
derive ways to test it. And they
an ID model or theory
and devising ways to test it, they spend all their time complaining
about imagined persecution.
Ed Brayton
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ary theory or its status as a compelling
scientific explanation.
Ed Brayton
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ove
that it actually happened that way". Well, that's true. If the only
thing that could possibly satisfy a skeptic of how, say, the blood
clotting cascade may have evolved is a videotape of the entire process
as it evolved in species that went extinct hundreds of millions of
years ago, there
consistent with one, especially since the creationist explanation is
consistent with absolutely anything - if the evidence showed the
opposite, it could just be said that God decided to start from scratch
rather than using a common design. When an explanation can explain any
set of data, it is epistemologi
to have full access to the Smithsonian collection for research
purposes and continues to have an office in which to work in the
Smithsonian. A few rude comments does not discrimination or retaliation
make.
Ed Brayton
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of the debate.
Ed Brayton
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id was far more mild. To turn the above
into an attempt to "destroy anyone" who advocates ID is to engage in
extreme hyperbole, I think.
Ed Brayton
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was absolutely justified in intervening to insure that
Williams was doing his job of presenting relevant and accurate material
to his students.
Ed Brayton
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textbook. That was one of the big
problems with the Williams litigation, that the handouts contained
numerous quotations falsely attributed to the founding fathers and even
at least one entire document that is universally recognized as a forgery
by historians.
Ed Brayton
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chool administration
has the final say on what does and does not meet that standard. It's
nice to see the ADF come to their senses in the case, which was based
upon distortions and should never have been brought in the first place.
Ed Brayton
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churches too,
so some portion of the taxes I paid might go to protect a church I
disagree with, and so forth.
Ed Brayton
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tten volumes critiquing the ID arguments).
Ed Brayton
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To
in the closet for fear of career suicide with their doubts
about Darwin and their support for ID.
And quite convenient that, because they're in the closet, his claim can
never be verified, don't you think?
Ed Brayton
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