Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

In a message dated 5/24/01 6:53:47 PM, LTricard writes: WHEREAS sprinters/hurdlers are the only athletes in all of track and field prevented from competing before their event essentially begins Huh? Jim Gerweck Running Times

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

yeah...as someone said, you pay $60. for a concert and you want to see the star perform LESS!!! This seems to assume that the ideal situation would be to sit and watch the star perform *forever*. But of course the reality is that either a concert or a pole vault competition that goes for

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

I am glad to see it is just a trial basis. However, I suspect this is the first step to something more. For one, the experiment is taking place in the U.S. Secondly, I can't help but express how short-sighted the decision-making appears to me: Fans who make the effort to travel to a meet,

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

thinking about the 4 jumps/throws vs 3 3. After more than 3 weeks of no rain, the skies finallylet loose here Monday, and since then CT has resembled Seattle in terms of weather, forcing 2 postponements of local HS track championships, finally painting organizers into a corner where the boys

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon I am glad to see it is just a trial basis. However, I suspect this is the first step to something more. For one, the experiment is taking place in the U.S. Secondly, I can't help but express how short-sighted the decision-making

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

or not it participated in the trial. Original Message - From: Paul Banta [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: track list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 2:28 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon The IAAF did not just single out the pole vault

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

, apparently had the option of trying them at its Glasgow international meeting and chose not to, but that's about it. I think rebel is too strong a word. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]'; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 3:25 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon Andy, what you say is true, but I do not see the parallel to these track changes. Baseball games have been shortened by a matter of minutes, very insignificant minutes. The general structure of the game is never changed. In none

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

One possible response that I don't think has been advanced yet would be for athletes in the events affected to boycott the meet. That should considerably reduce the time to contest the event, as well as letting the IAAF know what the athletes and coaches think of the experiment. Cheers, Roger

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

I find it strange that no one so far has suggested what would obviously be the most efficient method of conducting the high jump. It would, however, require the modification of the present upright and bar setup. The uprights would have supports for the bar located at two-inch

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

Assuming you weren't being facetious, I see several problems with this approach: 1. Unless the jumpers somehow declare an estimated upper limit to their upcoming jump and the placement of bars is adjusted accordingly for each jumper, some of the bars would be placed much higher than many of

t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

New Rules to Challenge Athletes at adidas Oregon Track Classic PORTLAND - Experimental rules aimed at speeding up the field events and decreasing false starts will be tried at North America's only IAAF Grand Prix II meet, the adidas Oregon Track Classic. The adidas Oregon Track Classic will

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

Pole vaulters will have two jumps at each height instead of the traditional three attempts. This is progress? Imagine for a moment that baseball rules are changed: Batters come to the plate with one strike against them (two strikes and they're out). They're "choking-up" on the bat, sacrificing

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

Why not try a compromise? Two jumps at each height until there are 4 or 6 competitors in the event, then go to the three attempts each. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That is sad to know, again. I will not begin on the false start rule, but I am dismayed by the lack of foresight in the field events.

RE: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

[[ Pole vaulters will have two jumps at each height instead of the traditional three attempts. This is progress? Imagine for a moment that baseball rules are changed: Batters come to the plate with one strike against them (two strikes and they're out). They're choking-up on the bat,

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

Andy, what you say is true, but I do not see the parallel to these track changes. Baseball games have been shortened by a matter of minutes, very insignificant minutes. The general structure of the game is never changed. In none of the other sports do they change rules that redefine the nature

Re: t-and-f: New rules to challenge athletes at adidas Oregon

yeah...as someone said, you pay $60. for a concert and you want to see the star perform LESS!!!

Re: t-and-f: New rules

You might think this is a misconception, but I don't. To say that all the sprinters have an equal chance to cheat by anticipation does not make it fair, anymore than a discus thrower who uses a lighter implement smuggled into his bag would be considered within the rules just because any of the

RE: t-and-f: New rules

[EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules Brian, Your intellegence preceeds you. Here is something you don't know. Every athlete that is contracted knows and respect every fan that sits in the stadium. Where your ignorance shows is, you

Re: t-and-f: new rules

In a message dated 03/21/2001 7:08:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Neither, of course. But, you wouldn't understand what actually should be going on in the mind of the superior starter. By all means, he should be anticipating that a gun is about to be fired. He should

Re: t-and-f: new rules

In a message dated 3/22/01 10:12:54 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Neither, of course. But, you wouldn't understand what actually should be going on in the mind of the superior starter. By all means, he should be anticipating that a gun is about to be fired. He should be

RE: t-and-f: New rules

Dear Brian, You said, in quite a nasty way, - "And who is Michael Jordon? Is he France's answer to America's Michael Jor-DAN? Don't say typos happen ... the "A" to the "O" is a lot of real estate. Best way to boost your perceived IQ: CHOOSE :

RE: t-and-f: New rules

[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 7:55 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules No! YOU HAVE NO CLUE!! THERE WILL NEVER BE A DAY WHEN FANS DON'T SHOW UP TO A TRACK MEET!!! PERIOD!! You are not the only one who c

RE: t-and-f: New rules

hat the chicks dig smart guys. CCL about that start rule, Brian McEwen -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 11:14 PMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules Brian, Your intellegence prec

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Brian wrote: A lesson followed for the young mantis: Miyagi: MOST IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER DANIEL-SAN: Race only about who win, and how fast time. Not about start. Daniel: Yeah... but if I really studied the starter and could anti... Miyagi: Uht, UHHT! Only practice REACTING to starter.

RE: t-and-f: New rules

Brian wrote: I can't win, so I am changing my name to: CCLANFS R. McEwen. Pronounced: Clan-fiss Ahr Mac-yew-ehn. Stands for: Couldn't Care Less About No False Start Rule. It was a JOKE, Conway. Since I am apparently the only evil-incarnate on the list I was making a little joke. If the

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 03/21/2001 4:07:18 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If the Rule really is going into effect, shouldn't the ones among us who oppose it put effort into stopping it? Instead of debating how fast we could react to the gun, or a youth hockey test, or how

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Having watched the best collegians operate with the no false start rule, I have to say that, at least for me, their skills and abilities are even more impressive under that compunction. Knowing that if someone goes early, that person will be eliminated, creates great drama. I know that these

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 3/21/01 6:33:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe that great sprinters will shine all the more brightly with a no false start rule. Will some great sprinter be eliminated by a false start at some major meet? Probably so. But it will be a rare

Re: t-and-f: new rules

In a message dated 3/21/2001 10:08:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I sprinted for four years for CCNY wow...real high tech sprinting...it's like saying, i sprinted for hunter.

RE: t-and-f: New rules

Netters Brian wrote: It was a JOKE, Conway. Since I am apparently the only evil-incarnate on the list I was making a little joke. Having been known at one time or another as "THE RACEWALKER FROM HELL" I can assure you all that Brian is not evil incarnate. (No I am not making that up

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Kurt wrote: Why not? Why not change the rules to benefit the fans? People seem to forget that in pro track it is the ticket-buying, Nike-wearing, Gatorade-drinking, Powerbar-eating, TV-watching FANS that, either directly or indirectly, fund the entire enterprise. If all the track fans in

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Conway writes: And as of yet no one has shown where changing the false start rule will benefit the athlete .. And the only benefit being tossed about for the fan is a cut down in time ... And when that is mentioned it is said as if there is soo much time being lost at track meets due to

Re: t-and-f: New rules

GH wrote: Harden and Montgomery, the two NCAA-trained sprinters, sat patiently in their blocks, were not charged with any false starts, and while everyone else was playing these games, they just did what they were supposed to do. They might have won the gold and silver anyway, but I had

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 03/20/2001 7:35:13 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Harden and Montgomery, the two NCAA-trained sprinters, sat patiently in their blocks, were not charged with any false starts, and while everyone else was playing these games, they just did what they

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Conway writes: And as of yet no one has shown where changing the false start rule will benefit the athlete .. And the only benefit being tossed about for the fan is a cut down in time ... And when that is mentioned it is said as if there is soo much time being lost at track meets due to

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:10:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Most of teh people in major finals are NCAA trained, no matter what country they are from. certainly wasn't the situation in Lisbon,w hich was the case in point with Harden and Montgomery.

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 03/20/2001 12:15:44 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And THAT is why other sports, at least at the professional end, are willing to constantly consider ways of reinventing and repackaging themselves. Very well stated. And all that says you do not destroy

Re: t-and-f: New rules

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or you could institute the "Carl Lewis" rule for invitational meets, where people are paying to see stars compete.. I believe it was at the Olympic Invitational at the Meadowlands many moons ago that it looked like Carl would be dq'd for two false starts. Instead

Re: t-and-f: New rules

and are distracted by the increasing number of false starts. CT --Original Message-- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: March 19, 2001 4:14:08 PM GMT Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules In a message dated Mon, 19 Mar 2001 10:40:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, Ed Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED

Re: t-and-f: New rules

I recall when first colleges and then high schools changed over to the one false start rule. Coaches saw this as some sort of apocolypse and thought it would totally ruin the sprints and hurdles. Needless to say, it didn't happen that way at all. Athletes, fans, and coaches all take it for

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Yeah, and ask yourself. Is the effect of Kobe, Shaq, MJ, Magic, Bird fouling out detrimental to the allure of the game? No. It is a team sport. People have their favorite players, but they will continue to root for the team to win. And in the NBA, and similar sports, the star played in that

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Justin I see the argument but it does not fly for me. From what I hear and read, the false starts matter ONLY to the hard-core fan. The casual fan accepts it as part of the game. Especially in the States, where we are bombarded with endless TV timeouts. In the NBA there are time outs that are

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 03/19/2001 9:01:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: False starting is cheating or an attempt to cheat, plain and simple. Plain and simple? Give me a break. There are so many factors that can lead to a false start, other than guessing wrong. Let's see;

Re: t-and-f: New rules

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or you could institute the "Carl Lewis" rule for invitational meets, where people are paying to see stars compete.. Wayne Armbrust replied: This type of "solution" is the worst of all possible worlds in that it introduces a situation where there are one set of

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated Mon, 19 Mar 2001 1:40:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: what hurts more? False starts, or the disqualification of the star over one false start? We are talking appeal here, remember. Is the fan more likely to endure the false start or the

Re: t-and-f: New rules

on 19/3/01 4:14 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i think it can be argued that most false starting IS unsportsmanlike conduct. gh As I said before, what about starting stalls as used in horse racing. Clearly the athletes cannot be trusted not to anticipate the gun, this

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Steve wrote: I recall when first colleges and then high schools changed over to the one false start rule. Coaches saw this as some sort of apocolypse and thought it would totally ruin the sprints and hurdles. Needless to say, it didn't happen that way at all. Athletes, fans, and coaches all take

Re: t-and-f: New rules

This proposed rule change will have ZERO, non, nada positive effect on the popularity of the sport and may be to the detriment if anyone is paying attention. There is a difference between a rule of conduct and a rule of sport. A rule of conduct such as striking an official or opposing athlete

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Message text written by Ed Dana Parrot In no other major American sport will an athlete be kicked out in the beginning of the competition for anything other than unsportsmanlike conduct. How about college track? The NCAA has been doing it that way for more than two decades.

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Dave writes: I can't let this slippery bit of logic get by without sticking up for Conway. He means that he can't think of a single DIRECT benefit to the athletes. Everything Bray mentions is a secondary or derived benefit. I think the original intent of Conway's statement was quite

Re: t-and-f: New rules

GH wrote: i think it can be argued that most false starting IS unsportsmanlike conduct. Why ?? Because an athlete is trying to get an advantage over those he/she is competing against ?? Isn't that athletes do in sports ?? Try ot gain an advantage ?? BE it mental, physical, psychological or

RE: t-and-f: New rules

Message-From: Conway Hill [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 2:59 PMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; t-and-f_1Subject: Re: t-and-f: New rules Steve wrote: I recall when first colleges and then high schools changed over to the one false start rule. Coaches

t-and-f: New rules

Netters: Two comments on the suggested rule changes 1) In regards to new structure for field events, the best thing would be to leave the present standards in place, but with a new proviso that the games committee may make any changes it wishes for a particular meet. 2) With regard

Re: t-and-f: New rules

In a message dated 03/19/2001 11:26:50 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: At least if they're the touchy things that were in evidence in Seville. Now THAT could lead to some gruesome DQs. You bring back a terrible memory, Garry. Everyone remember the debacle that was

Re: t-and-f: New rules

Netters Ed wrote PS: I cannot agree that all false starts are "unsportsmanlike conduct." Certainly there have been runners, past and present, who have used them in a suspicious manner, but there are ceratinly times when nervousness (yes, even in experienced

RE: t-and-f: New rules

and-f@darkwing. uoregon. edu' (E-mail" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: March 19, 2001 3:01:14 AM GMT Subject: t-and-f: New rules Conway wrote: . . . most high level competitions are not over run with false starts (outdoors not indoors) ... I think the committee would be better served by looking for

Re: t-and-f: New rules

The National Basketball Association pro games in the U.S. are actually foyr quarters of 12 minutes each, so the proportion is exact, 1.2-1 on minutes and 1.2 on fouls as well, compared to the college game. Steve

Re: t-and-f: New rules

The National Basketball Association pro games in the U.S. are actually foyr quarters of 12 minutes each, so the proportion is exact, 1.2-1 on minutes and 1.2 on fouls as well, compared to the college game. I stand corrected. But the point remains that pro players are not given an "extra"