Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

I think at this point in time we need to try to get some sort of agreement on how to proceed. My first thought would be to ban the youngsters so anyone under 65 shouldn't be involved. That way it would slow the process down unfortunately it isn't really practical. I think we need time to digest

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

I think, Montreal's OSMappers would appreciate to discuss the import of the buildings there first on the local list. By the way, John, I have never said I would be taking the lead for the entirety of Québec (at least, at the moment). However, I feel that the import should be discussed on the

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

John, les contributeurs de Ottawa, vous semblez en général d'accord pour poursuivre les imports et avez la capacité technique de faire des imports rapides, ce que vous avez démontré.  Il ne manque qu'un petit pas à franchir et discuter de la qualité des données et accepter de tenir compte des

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

Which I think comes back to defining the local mappers. There has been discussion on Montreal as well and not all Ontario thinks the same way.  Ottawa local mappers for example have different opinions to Pierre and Nate on what is acceptable and I'm under the impression that not everyone in

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

On 2019-03-15 9:07 a.m., Andrew Lester wrote: I disagree. Silence won't solve anything. I'm speaking here as a local BC mapper, and I strongly disagree with these recent imports. I'm also a BC mapper, and have only seen the consultation happen over Ontario, not BC.

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

Interesting! I didn't mean to imply that etymology should be decisive, but that linking the name to the history of some beatified person would help explain the origin of the 'St'... In this case, seemingly supporting the abbreviation, but also referencing an actual 'saint' or two at the same

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

I think there are two issues here the first is I accept having a large number of anything by one mapper has the potential for a systematic error. If the import is verified by a second mapper independently I assume this would be acceptable? The second is more to do with discussion within the

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

I'm of the opinion that what the city says goes. We used that in Ottawa with things such as rue Slater rather than Rue Slater which I understand is more normal in Quebec. Cheerio John On Fri, Mar 15, 2019, 1:19 PM Jarek Piórkowski, wrote: > On Fri, 15 Mar 2019 at 13:02, Nate Wessel wrote: >

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

On Fri, 15 Mar 2019 at 13:02, Nate Wessel wrote: > Don't forget about the various alternative naming tags like alt_name=*, > short_name=*, loc_name=*, and also name:etymology=* to make things absolutely > clear. > > Having either spelling in one of these alternatives as appropriate would >

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

On 15/03/2019 16:58, Martin Chalifoux via Talk-ca wrote: The word is definitely Saint. St is a contraction and neither proper English or French. I can't comment about Canadian English, but "St" in a placename in British English is perfectly OK - St Albans is correct; "Saint Albans" is not.

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

I agree with Jarek, St. should generally not be expanded for English Canadian street names. The proper spelling is St. (or St) even if the pronunciation is Saint. name:pronunciation ( https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name:pronunciation) is a tag that can capture the pronunciation, if

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

No, I'm referring to the official records of street names held by municipalities. In many cases, at least in newer developments, they seem to be abbreviated. If it's officially short form then it would be incorrect to say it's Saint. --- Kevin Farrugia On Fri, Mar 15, 2019, 1:08 PM Martin

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

I think the osm database should use proper words. Abbreviating is a rendering issue and many rendering engines can do that. Space constraints on signage dictate the use of abbreviations for those. > On Mar 15, 2019, at 12:50, Kevin Farrugia wrote: > > Hi Jarek, > > I agree that of the

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

However, the street name is legally "St." in almost all cases, so saint is wrong. --- Kevin Farrugia On Fri, Mar 15, 2019, 1:00 PM Martin Chalifoux via Talk-ca < talk-ca@openstreetmap.org> wrote: > The word is definitely Saint. St is a contraction and neither proper > English or French. It

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

Don't forget about the various alternative naming tags like alt_name=* , short_name=* , loc_name=*, and also name:etymology=* to make

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

The word is definitely Saint. St is a contraction and neither proper English or French. It has the same Latin roots as sanctification and similar words. Similarly Av is a contraction for Avenue and not a word. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbreviation > On Mar 15, 2019, at 12:42, Jarek

Re: [Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

Hi Jarek, I agree that of the sign has a short form for saint then it should be that way on the map too, as the sign text comes from the official records of street names. I think St. Is better with a period as it makes it less ambiguous to it being an abbreviation and it may help screen readers

[Talk-ca] Saints in street names in Ontario

Hi all, A couple of months back we established a consensus [1] that "St." in Canadian English city names should not be expanded. I have been thinking of having the same for street names, and would like to ask people's opinions. My main motivation is St. Clair Avenue in Toronto. Every city

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

I disagree. Silence won't solve anything. I'm speaking here as a local BC mapper, and I strongly disagree with these recent imports. I thought we had a general consensus that we'd discuss this as a community and figure things out before restarting the import, but it seems that some mappers

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

Hi, On 15.03.19 16:23, Danny McDonald wrote: > I think many people on this list fundamentally misunderstand the way OSM > operates.  Most OSM contributions are made by individuals who see a > gap/mistake in the data and fix it. True! > It is not a "community process" > where contributions are

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

At the end of the day one would hope we are a community.  We are a large group with divergent opinions and to be honest there is a great deal of interest in non-mappers in this sort of data. For example building data is being used in Tanzania to work out the optimal areas for group solar

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

OK, so this discussion has gone a bit off the rails. In terms of the DWG, this has all happened so fast - the referral to the DWG was less than 2 hours after the initial message, and was not in response to any actual edits I made after receiving Pierre's stop message. I suggest that we all stop

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

I certainly agree with that statement ! Importing should be much more rigorous and careful, as mistakes or poor execution is costly. > On Mar 15, 2019, at 11:29, Nate Wessel wrote: > > There is a massive difference between making edits without review and > importing millions of buildings

Re: [Talk-ca] Building Import

Seriously Danny? Pierre was the first to suggest the DWG after you replied to him that wouldn't engage in further discussion. You only joined this conversation after I reported you. There is a massive difference between making edits without review and importing millions of buildings without

[Talk-ca] Building Import

By the way, I strongly object to the way Nate immediately went to the DWG, instead of attempting to engage in discussion. I think many people on this list fundamentally misunderstand the way OSM operates. Most OSM contributions are made by individuals who see a gap/mistake in the data and fix

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

As an experienced local Ontario and Quebec mapper I don't see any major problems with Stats Can building quality. It's detailed and recent, it's the best dataset we could ever possibly get and it's far superior to Microsoft quality. Having many buildings with "almost square angles" in this dataset

[Talk-ca] Building Import

As previously noted, I will continue importing, unless I hear a specific valid concern. I will wait a week before re-starting, to allow time for concerns to be raised. To address some existing concerns: - Making buildings orthogonal isn't an improvement, it is degrading correct footprints for no

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

I just reported this to the data working group, in case you haven't already. Hopefully they will step in! Cheers, Nate Wessel Jack of all trades, Master of Geography, PhD candidate in Urban Planning NateWessel.com On 3/15/19 10:30 AM, Pierre Béland wrote: Réponse

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

Given the scale of this illicit import (thanks Pierre for the stats!), I would, yes, stick my neck out and say that I oppose this action as a Canadian mapper. Contributors who are clearly violating community norms about discussion and consensus do not constitute an implicit consensus of some

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

Réponse immédiate avec refus de discussion de la part de DannyMcD_imports. Celui-ci indique qu'il prévoit continuer l'import.voir  https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/67686901 | There was a discussion, issues were raised, the problems (to the extent that they existed at all) have been

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

Bonjour Jarek Ce n'est malheureusement pas le seul contributeur qui agit ainsi.  J'estime en divisant (Objets/5) que depuis le 1er février, 6 contributeurs ont importé près de 1 million de bâtiments. Selon les commentaires, 5 provinces ont été couvertes. Cette information est parfois inexacte.

Re: [Talk-ca] Local groups as part of import plan

The problem is defining and contacting a local group.  Once defined then they can make the decision. I've seen as few as two people make a local group decision on an import before now although normally it is done over coffee. Also we get into who is a local mapper. Many people have an

Re: [Talk-ca] Local groups as part of import plan

Could we get Stats Can to support a few local groups who want to use a common framework for a collaborative research project that addresses a sustainable development goal outcome (e.g., the OSM fresh security challenge https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Food_security and

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

If the local mappers in Alberta or BC feel the data quality is not good enough then I think it is up to them to take action but I think it really is up to the local mapping community and defining them is difficult sometimes.  Also remember agreements within the local community are not always

Re: [Talk-ca] Building import in BC and Quebec

IMO the huron/hamptonavemapper import is quite clearly in active disagreement with the import suspension - while I could believe that one user could overlook clicking on the wiki link in their changeset messages just once and seeing the bold "on hold", setting up a brand new similarly named