Dear Jones, make some calculations please. for this case. OK? The word "constrictors" is terrific (Boa)
Peter On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 7:18 PM, Jones Beene <jone...@pacbell.net> wrote: > *From:* Peter Gluck > > > > OK, old friend I understand what you say, the energy of the pump is > consumed, is money spent for making the generator to work. > > > > No connection with heat balance of the system- but goes to expenses. > > > > Right? > > > > Dear Peter, > > > > Yes, but we can take it further. As a student of ontology you are fully > familiar with all of the logical arguments. > > > > Allow me to apply *reductio ad absurdum* to this situation. > > > > Let’s say Rossi shows up with a reactor that puts out one megawatt of heat. > It requires a large flow of water, which is coming from a local dam and goes > into a sewer. This new reactor requires no electrical input at all !! The > heat is measured by a thermal circuit that removes heat from the stainless > steel reactor, and the new owners of this magical device use it to heat the > factory. It remains warm all year without any electricity ! > > > > Let’s say the device is opened up and found to contain nothing but flow > constrictors - which convert water pressure into heat via friction – nothing > else. > > > > Is Rossi entitled to claim that the megawatt of heat is “overunity” and > therefore free energy ? > > > > He would be, if we followed this argument that power to a required pump is > not input power. > > > > Jones wrote: > > Dear Peter > > I do not understand the problem. There are two systems involved: heat and > electricity > > At the system level P-out is thermal and refers to net heat. The > calorimetry determines P-out for heat. > > P-in for the system, not for the calorimetry, is determined by the sum of > all the electrical inputs. The pump must be included as it is necessary. > > There is nothing in the calorimetry loop which is used to determine **system > P-in**. > > Yes the heat loop itself may have it own designation for P-in and P-out, > but that is not for the system; that is why I believe you could be > conflating the two issues. > > Jones > > *From:* Peter Gluck > > Want I wanted to say- the pump is part of the cooling circuit to which the > heat produced is transferred. Has nothing to do with the heat produced. > > peter > > On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 6:15 PM, Jed Rothwell <jedrothw...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > Peter Gluck wrote: > > Fortunately the inlet temperature of water is measured and this includes > or, if you wish excludes the effect of the pump/motor. > But he effect is negligible- and not on the side of Pin- it is at Pout. > > > > No, not Pout. The heat from the pump shows up past Pout, at the place where > the water stops moving. That would be either in your drain pipe, or -- if > you recycle the water -- in the reservoir tank. As long as the water is > moving at the same speed as it did when it left the pump, the energy has not > yet converted to heat. > > - Jed > > > > > -- > Dr. Peter Gluck > > Cluj, Romania > > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com > > > > > > > -- > Dr. Peter Gluck > > Cluj, Romania > > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com > > > -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
