They are a PR firm, so they will respond to $$ arguments. I suggest you build two compliant pages, of exactly the same html code and re-present them differently using CSS (like floats, PDA style. Show this to them, flick between the two explaining how both sites can use the same backend and code base if needed, saving $$$.
Now, try and do the same thing with a page where the presentation is locked up in the HTML Turn _javascript_ off and tell them about functionality.
Explain to them about the importance of web sites being interoperable with each other - of which standards are a stepping stone towards.
You need to do a CSS Zen Garden for PR :D - even better, take them through the csszengarden.com.
At the end of the day separating the business logic from the presentation logic helps everyone in the site development and design food chain. Remember PR and marketing people will respond to completely different arguments than your web dev peers - $$$, results, traffic, feet through the door etc etc they generally don't give a hoot about closing end tags and the like.
HTH
James
On 12/6/05, Donna Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Dear CSS Listers:
in another thread, someone essentially asked "why code like this", in
trying to convince a friend. I don't think he's getting very good
answers but at any rate, it made me think of a "problem" I'm having and
I've decided to make a new thread.
A non-profit that i've maintained the website for for 8 years or so has
recently had some special grant money and as part of a package hired a
PR firm to work with that segment from the grant (including the
website). They would rather I continue to maintain it but the PR firm
feels otherwise. The situation now, the PR firm has put up a number of
pages, its tag soup, tables, js menu (with graphics) - you know. I've
done the same, based on the PR's firm design - css-p etc. The
non-profit doesn't know what code is, doesn't know there are browsers
other than IE and don't feel they have the time to learn.
I need to be able to explain, by looking at the surface, the difference
between standards coding versus "you-know-what". Just about the only
thing I can come up with is the ability to increase font size in IE. I
also thought of making a PDA example using Opera's PDA emulator and
comparing the two codings, with screen shots, next to each other and did
that but i don't think they get what they're looking at. Or else make
very short sentences i.e. "what the PR firm is doing is the way someone
would have commonly done it five years ago ... "
Any other ideas. Also, I'm afraid, the PR firm has convinced them that
I am just the "in-house volunteer" and that *I'm* liable to mess up the
site ... quoting an experience they had when they turned over a site to
another customer.
I hope this is enough on-topic for some discussion.
best regards,
Donna
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