I would only look at RT as a source of disinformation. I'm not sure
about Al Jazera. BBC is probably OK for a semi-European point of view,
but they seem to sensationalize things more than necessary. Fox with
some exceptions is almost a current admin mouthpiece. MSNBC is like the
anti-Fox, and CNN is a bit in between. I do pay attention to NPR, but I
think they tend to soft-pedal some things.
I try to read between the lines as much as possible.
bp
<part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
On 7/20/2020 10:48 AM, [email protected] wrote:
Problem is, there is no source of news you can trust. They all have a
bias.
Actually that applies to all people, they all have a bias.
So, I read CNN and MSNBC then average it with FOX and compare with RT
and Al Jazzera and then if that averages with BBC I will run with that.
-----Original Message----- From: Brian Webster
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 11:32 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
Is that all they are doing? I do not know and do not expect anyone who
is not directly involved in the activities to know at this stage, but
it is very plausible that they are doing what is within their
authority. Speculation by the media is not in itself reason either.
Fact is people should do their due diligence and try to find out their
own facts. Leaving that job up to a journalist and hanging your hat,
opinion, and perception on a journalist these days probably not the
wisest plan of action. But if a person wants to have an echo chamber
opinion, they should go ahead and pick the media outlet that supports
their point of view and stick with them. All media outlets these days
have a major bias like we have never seen before. One side or the
other, doesn't matter. Journalistic integrity is not what it used to
be yet it would seem most of society is quick to question everything
and everyone except the media.
I know that if I lived in this area I would expect my constitutional
rights to be protected as a citizen with freedom of movement in those
neighborhoods and have access to my place of business or residence. A
government letting a whole region of a city be taken over like what
happened in Seattle is absurd. That was an invasion and take over
plain and simple. Protests are one thing, occupying a place and
keeping cops out and not having 100% agreement by all those in the
occupied area is nothing short than an act of war and at minimum
domestic terrorism. Plain and simple. If you do not believe that,
seriously ask yourself if you would be ok if that happened to you on
your own property or property you own for your place of business. That
is a hostage/kidnap situation. Life, liberty, and the pursuit of your
own happiness has been taken away. Blocking you from police, fire or
EMS protection is shameful and illegal. Any politician that does not
look at things that way is a puppet and hypocrite, especially when
they have their own guards and security protecting them. At least in
Portland the Feds starting not to allow that to happen in the Federal
park or give them any more base of operations to try and accomplish
that in that city. The word "occupy" is always thrown around by
pacifists in a different context about our worldwide military presence
than how they support it for these types of protests, it's not any
different in definition on our own soil even if you do agree with the
political position or cause. No other person should be able to take
control like that and deny you the rights you are provided in this
country.
I guess my point is, don't let just one type of information intake
form your outrage. Speak to others that may have different input and
knowledge (but please do it in a civil way and with the intent to
listen not just answer back). This Portland situation likely started
from just clearing the park and then massive outrage flames were
fanned based on people not realizing that they were on federal land in
the first place and those officers were there to protect the property
and enforce those laws.
Executive orders......not a fan of them. They can easily be misused
and usually a plan of last resort when there is political deadlock. An
executive order that says protect federal property? I would expect
that every federal officer knows that is their job. Heck every
military person knows that is their job. The first general order of a
sentry is "to take charge of this post and all government property in
view". Was it an actual executive order issued or was it more of a
memo with the president reminding people that is what needs to be
done. Rioting and tearing down statues and defacing federal (and by
default taxpayer) property seems very divisive at this point. Letting
things devolve to more than that when the group has "Occupy" in their
name and cause should be treated as such and not considered just a
protest. Their intent is stated in the name.
Thank you,
Brian Webster
-----Original Message-----
From: AF [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 12:55 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
It doesn't all stem from clearing a park. That might not be what you're
trying to say, but it could be read that way.
The reason people are pointing a finger at the current administration is
there was an executive order signed a few weeks ago ordering federal
agencies to protect federal property, and that seems to be a direct
response to the ongoing protests. They can bring in this variety of
agencies because the Homeland Security Act of 2002 allows them to
deputize other federal agents to assist:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/17/us/politics/federal-agents-portland-arrests.html
So the justification is protecting federal property, but is that all
they're doing? No political motivations of any kind here? And while I'm
sure that they have the legal authority for all of this, isn't it ok to
ask whether they should?
On 7/20/2020 12:04 PM, Brian Webster wrote:
In Portland part of the protest and occupy movement protesters were
trying to camp out in a FEDERAL PARK downtown. This attempt to occupy
federal property has not happened in other cities that I am aware of
and hence the different agencies involved. That Park director
requested more federal law enforcement help in getting the people off
the park grounds and not allow them to camp there. This was not a
case of the black helicopters coming and federal officers taking over
local law enforcement authority from the locals. If was Federal Law
Enforcement protecting federal property. In ALL law enforcement
agencies it is not unusual for plain clothes officers, detectives
etc. to have unmarked vehicles and use them when making arrests. This
is hardly unusual police activity if you look at the whole picture.
Local law enforcement does this type of thing all of the time. If
these federal officers had identified people who committed a crime on
federal property and then fled, they are within their law enforcement
powers to directly pursue and apprehend them even if the apprehension
is not on federal property. Local and state officers have the same
powers. It's not typically used but it's not unheard of for say a
police officer to pursue someone who they believe has committed a
felony and cross a state line. That officer is fully empowered to
make that arrest in the other state. It has happened many times and
the laws have been upheld to allow for this. There are also still the
power to effect a citizen's arrest as well. Nobody likes to do it
because it gets messy legally after the fact but that is still
allowed in this country.
Before people get outraged at what the press is telling them is
happening, they should take a step back and gather their own facts
and knowledge and not be so quick to accept some "experts"
statements. You all know how bad a journalist can butcher up a
technical article on stuff we do and work with, what makes us think
they are any smarter in the field of law or medicine?
https://kval.com/news/local/police-remove-occupy-portland-campers-from-park?fbclid=IwAR0dSQqKXj_ikwqmSfvMvvPtOVoFVhGjwrH126Lhiomx3iZXlxTUGtT2S7E
"This morning, at request and at the lead of the US Federal
Protective Service, the Portland Police helped remove campers at
Shrunk Plaza, which is federal property across the street from
Chapman Square," Adams wrote. "The campers who were arrested - an
estimated 8 to 10 people - at Shrunk Plaza were detained by federal
police and cited under US federal law. Initial reports indicate
arrests were completed in a peaceful manner."
Thank you,
Brian Webster
-----Original Message-----
From: AF [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 11:41 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
I don't think I'd like it if Obama had dispatched federal troops to
"Republican-led cities" claiming they are stupidly and conservatively
run.
It also doesn't make me comfortable having Ken Cuccinelli driving
this. Not a guy who should have the power to send troops to your city
for political reasons, or any reason. Andy Taylor would make him
keep his one bullet in his shirt pocket.
-----Original Message-----
From: AF <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Larry Smith
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 10:20 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
The US Border Patrol is a part of the Immigration and Naturalization
Service.
--
Larry Smith
[email protected]
On Mon July 20 2020 10:14, Ken Hohhof wrote:
I thought I read they admitted to being Customs & Border Patrol, at
least in Portland. But yes other reports say that a force was
assembled from various federal agencies so maybe also US Marshals.
They have been using border patrol in questionable ways for awhile,
like setting up roadblocks on highways hundreds of miles from any
border.
From: AF <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 9:56 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
The National Guard is a state resource. I think he can request it, but
I'm not sure he can command it.
What I read, they were US Marshals, and other unidentified federal
resources.
bp
<part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
On 7/20/2020 7:41 AM, [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> wrote:
Yeah, you gotta wonder what their orders were.
Doesn’t a president normally activate the National Guard when extra
help is needed?
These guys were – what? Homeland Security? ICE?
From: Jaime Solorza
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2020 8:35 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - political
Hitler tactics by Bunker Boy...there , I said it.
On Sun, Jul 19, 2020, 2:49 PM <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]> >
wrote:
Not trying to break lent, but I am lacking understanding.
What are the young white kids rioting about in Portland?
I am from Oregon, I remember protests in the 60s and 70s over Vietnam.
I also remember a line of State Police walking through a park downtown
and busting heads of those that did not clear out. Actually one of my
first telco bosses had been one of those State Bull Cops.
Are young white kids just aching for a chance at anarchy? I don’t
get it.
Misbehaving while trying to wrap some kind of noble cause around you
is pretty childish.
--
AF mailing list
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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