Good questions…

For us, if you have a dynamic IP either business or residential you get 
filtered on on some ports … not many but a few … such as SMTP that must be sent 
via our mail servers and cannot be sent direct (spamming prevention), customers 
can’t run a public facing DNS server (they can of course do DNS lookups 
wherever they wish although we prefer they use ours) etc….  we’ve had a small 
number of customers ask for special rules on this and declined them - too much 
administrative headaches involved

If you’re on a static IP address (small monthly charge depending on the 
connection) then no filtering applied - typically a three strikes rule re abuse 
complaints and/or DDOS activity…. and we get a fair amount of abuse “traffic” 
that we deal with (or try to at least keep up)

Paul




> On Oct 5, 2016, at 7:11 PM, Nathan Anderson <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> *raises hand*.  We filter next to zilch.
>  
> But here is a better example: how many people on this list that do proactive 
> filtering would *refuse* to disable it *if a customer explicitly asked them 
> to*?  How about for an important corporate customer that expects that when 
> they buy an internet connection from you, they are actually getting a 
> *connection to the internet*, and not an entrance pass to a walled garden?
>  
> I'm not convinced this is a good analogy anyway, because the internet isn't a 
> product, it is an ongoing service.  Hate to break it to you, but as an 
> internet provider, you are a utility company.  But you may be on to 
> something, since I think Apple and Google have both been progressing towards 
> a view of product-as-service mentality, which is another thing that I have a 
> problem with...
>  
> -- Nathan
>  
> From: Af [mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>] On 
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2016 4:06 PM
> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Google wants to be Apple
>  
> To use another example... how many people on this list are providing totally 
> open, unrestricted, unfiltered Internet service to customers? You aren't 
> filtering SMB or NetBIOS or DHCP or any other protocols that have no use on 
> the network? You are doing ZERO protection for your customers? I doubt it. 
> You are doing that because you are trying to avoid the customer support 
> calls, truck rolls, etc... because people don't understand what they are 
> doing with technology.
> 
> Apple does the same thing. Lock down the devices so people can't cause damage 
> to themselves, that Apple then has to fix. :)
> 
> Travis
> 
> 
> On 10/5/2016 4:57 PM, Nathan Anderson wrote:
> People also want their computers to work, period.  I'm not sure I see the 
> difference.  This device of mine that you call a "phone" is not actually a 
> phone.  That's a misnomer.  It is a pocket computer that happens to have a 
> phone app on it.
>  
> There are a lot of circumstances today where I used to carry a laptop, but I 
> now carry a phone SO THAT I don't have to carry a laptop with me.
>  
> The same kind of security model has been applied to so-called tablets, which 
> are basically touch-screen laptops without a keyboard on them, but many of 
> them can have a keyboard added if desired.  This is not a phone vs. computer 
> debate.  The form factor has little to do with the issue at hand.  Apple has 
> even made steps that hint at them trying to do similar things to the Mac.  It 
> may only be a matter of time until you can't even use a laptop "to do 
> whatever you want".
>  
> -- Nathan
>  
> From: Af [mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>] On 
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2016 3:51 PM
> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Google wants to be Apple
>  
> This literally made me laugh out loud... you realize this is less than 1% of 
> 1% of the population? Why not just carry a laptop with you to do whatever you 
> want?
> 
> People just want their phones to work, period. They want to text, Facebook, 
> Snap, Instagram, and take pics. There are probably 1,000 people total that 
> need to do what you are talking about with their phones... that's a VERY 
> small percentage. :)
> 
> Travis
> 
> 
> 
> On 10/5/2016 4:47 PM, Eric Kuhnke wrote:
> Just the fact that Apple now hides the file system from the user and makes it 
> impossible to directly manipulate things is a deal breaker for me. I can 
> understand why they did it, to stop people from shooting themselves in the 
> foot. 
> 
> But there a myriad of things I can do on a OnePlus One running CyanogenMod 
> that are impossible/restricted/locked down on an iPhone. With the right GUI 
> tools and Termux a cyanogenmod phone is very close to a basic Linux shell 
> system:
> 
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.termux&hl=en 
> <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.termux&hl=en>
> 
> 
>  
> On Wed, Oct 5, 2016 at 3:42 PM, Nathan Anderson <[email protected] 
> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
> To some people, such as myself, openness matters as much as or more than 
> certain design aspects.  I used iPhones from 2008-2012 and did enjoy them, 
> but that was back when jailbreaking was more or less mainstream.  The fact 
> that I even had to jailbreak in the first place, though, to use *my* phone 
> the way that *I* wanted to bothered me, and I switched to Android when 
> Apple's code-signing BS got to be too much and actually ended up screwing me 
> over at one point.
> 
> I'm not saying that code-signing is bad...it is great from a security 
> standpoint for the average user.  But if somebody desires to turn it off, 
> there should be a way for the owner of the phone to do so.  By all means, 
> make it a difficult process so that the bar to entry is high enough to 
> dissuade the average user from doing so, but make it *possible*.  Apple 
> doesn't just use code-signing for security, they also use it as a bludgeon 
> with which to bully their users.
> 
> So if there is one aspect where I hope Google did *not* copy Apple in this 
> endeavor, it is this.  The bootloader on the new phones better darn well be 
> unlockable by the user without the user having to exploit a security 
> vulnerability to do so.
> 
> -- Nathan
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Af [mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>] On 
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2016 3:31 PM
> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Google wants to be Apple
> 
> Some people ride a Honda, some people ride a Harley. Some people drive a
> Chevy, some people drive a BMW.
> 
> I think it was you that even said "If the price was the same, everyone
> would be using an iPhone"... which I honestly believe. I have used a
> brand new Samsung phone with Android, and the first thing I noticed is
> that the screen response is not the same as an iPhone... it's not as
> smooth, or as refined. Yes, it works... it scrolls and it zooms and
> resizes, just like a Chevy gets you from Point A to Point B... but if a
> BMW was the same price as a Chevy, 99% of the population would be
> driving BMW.
> 
> Just my thoughts. :)
> 
> Travis
> 
> 
> On 10/5/2016 3:15 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
> > I will point out (again) that 8 to 9 of 10 smartphones on the planet
> > are Android. So while making it "elegant" is important, it's probably
> > more important to make it affordable.
> >
> > My Nexus phone is a damn fine phone, and I don't feel like I've been
> > left out of anything at all.
> >
> >
> > bp
> > <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
> >
> > On 10/5/2016 1:57 PM, Travis Johnson wrote:
> >> https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/05/not-ok-google/ 
> >> <https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/05/not-ok-google/>
> >>
> >> It's taken a while, many years, but Google has finally admitted that
> >> Apple had it right all along... you have to control the hardware AND
> >> software to have an awesome product. This was Steve Job's goal from
> >> the very beginning with the Macintosh... and now everyone else is
> >> finally understanding.
> >>
> >> So now Google is copying everything Apple does... even down to the
> >> marketing materials.  Every commercial they run (along with Samsung
> >> and everyone else) is always "this is why our product is better than
> >> Apple". If a company really believes that, you don't have to make the
> >> direct comparison. LOL
> >>
> >> "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" ~Charles Caleb Colton
> >>
> >> Travis
> >>
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
>  

Reply via email to