A conceptual structure is most straightforwardly expressed in OpenCog as a hypergraph whose nodes/links may either be concrete ones from the AtomSpace, or VariableNodes representing "slots" to be filled
Learning these may be done via PLN inference, or via Pattern Mining for frequent/surprising conceptual-structure patterns in the AtomSpace This is important but not something I have a need to discuss at the moment, it's kind of a "solved problem" on the representation level, and we are working on getting the reasoning/learning aspect of such structures to work better -- Ben G On Sat, Dec 27, 2014 at 1:46 PM, Jim Bromer via AGI <[email protected]> wrote: > The two of you haven't actually said anything about the subject of the > thread. You were able to respond to the personal part of my statement > (which is probably the underlying reason why I make personal statements > like that) but you did not discuss some of your knowledge about the > subject. > > I didn't get it at first - because, as I am trying to say, you did not > actually say anything about the topic. However, because I have a little > familiarity with PM's program I finally made a guess about what he is > talking about. > > I think you are probably confusing my notion of 'conceptual structure' > with some kind of fundamental abstract structure of pre-programmed > relations, like the GOFAI representations of conceptual relations where > concepts were often values that filled 'slots' (in the pre-defined > structure). So PM's conceptual structure would be the relations that were > pre-defined by him. Right there is one difference between (what I believe > is) his notion of conceptual structure and my own. I believe that concepts > in AGI have to be learned so I question whether conceptual structures can > be adequately predefined by PM or anyone else. > > So even though I still haven't been able to get anyone to discuss this > topic with me I have been able to read the tea leaves of their pretensions > and learned something. If conceptual structure was something that could be > represented with a few combinations of pre-defined abstractions then the > topic would be obvious and trivial because it permeates GOFAI methodologies. > > This makes so much sense that I must have reached this conclusion before. > If you are able to truly understand the notion of a conceptual structure > (so that you could discuss it intelligently) then it would itself have to > be a concept in itself. > > Thank you. I guess it is really is time for me to move on. I know how > annoying I can be but maybe you should ask yourselves whether your > responses were anything other than tedious and trivial. > > > Jim Bromer > > On Sat, Dec 27, 2014 at 12:18 AM, Piaget Modeler via AGI <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> And some of us are onto other things. >> >> ~PM >> -------------- >> >> > Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2014 00:11:41 -0500 >> > Subject: [agi] Conceptual Structure? >> > From: [email protected] >> > To: [email protected] >> >> > >> > No one in these groups has been interested in discussing conceptual >> > structure with me. I think that is a bit odd. I suppose I should draw >> > some conclusions from that, accept it and move on. >> > >> > Structure is more than correlation. You might 'discover' structure >> > using correlation but only if your program was able to create theories >> > about structure and apply them via some mechanism other than >> > correlation. One possibility is that structure is conceptually >> > abstract so a handful of relations would be adequate to handle the >> > representation of an immense variety of structural relations. But if >> > that is true, then that should make conceptual structure easy to apply >> > and to study. And that should mean that conceptual structure is >> > something that should generate a lot of discussion in AI / AGI groups >> > like this. >> > >> > The only conclusion I can come to is that most of the people in this >> > group are not actually working on viable projects, so they are more >> > preoccupied by more familiar mainstream discussions and discussions >> > about outlier conjectures that could have a major impact on the >> > feasibility of AGI if they were themselves feasible. >> > Jim Bromer >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------------------- >> > AGI >> > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now >> > RSS Feed: >> https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/19999924-4a978ccc >> > Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; >> > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com >> *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/24379807-653794b5> | >> Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription >> <http://www.listbox.com> >> > > *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/212726-deec6279> | Modify > <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> > Your Subscription <http://www.listbox.com> > -- Ben Goertzel, PhD http://goertzel.org "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw ------------------------------------------- AGI Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424 Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
