On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 07:42:29 -0400 Elder Dan Lewis <[email protected]> wrote:
> Shelagh Manton wrote: > > On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:03:06 +0100 > > Nino Novak <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> On Tuesday 27 October 2009 02:40, Elder Dan Lewis wrote: > >> > >>> Nino Novak wrote: > >>> > >>>> On Monday 26 October 2009 15:35, Elder Dan Lewis wrote: > >>>> > >>> How big is the database in this tutorial? > >>> > >> very small (it's an appointment scheduler) > >> > >> > >>> Perhaps it might be a > >>> great help if it is large enough. Does it require the use of SQL > >>> in creating some of its queries? > >>> > >> The goals of the document are primarily to learn and understand > >> the principles and usage of a data base "by doing" (what are > >> tables/forms/queries...? How do I create and use them efficiently?) > >> > >> SQL use is not described as the document is a starter and > >> concentrates on the basics of OOo Base. > >> > >> > >>> One of the things that has bothered me is that many of the > >>> guides for OOo are written in English and then translated into the > >>> other languages. I personally believe that there are many people > >>> using a variety of languages which could be writing parts of these > >>> guides, and these could then be translated into the other > >>> languages including English. Unless someone knows what the > >>> original English document from which it was translated, it would > >>> be nice if one of your team members would translate it into > >>> English to be placed in the tutorial section of the English > >>> Documentation. Just a thought. > >> We are not a real "team", we are a volunteer community ;-) > >> > >> > >> > >>> What I want to do in the Base Guide is to describe the > >>> process of going from a general idea of the data someone has and > >>> what he wants to do with the data to the finished database. > >>> Zoltan from Hungury has suggested a business application > >>> database, and I really like this idea. I want it to be a fairly > >>> large and complex database to demonstrate how to create such a > >>> database using Base. > >> Well: try it :-) > >> > >> My personal opinion is that for beginners you should start as > >> simple as possible. The mentioned tutorial uses a very simple data > >> structure. You can add complexity later, when the basics are > >> understood. > >> > >> > >>> Unless the > >>> document to which you referred does this, I know of no > >>> documentation on Base which does this. > >>> > >>> Dies ist meine zwei pfennig. :-) > >>> > >>> Your comments are not discouraging to me at all. I don't want > >>> to "reinvent the wheel", but I do want to redesign it so that it > >>> will do more things. And I too would like to see an English > >>> translation of the document you mentioned. It may well serve a > >>> very useful purpose as a starting point for what I would like the > >>> Base Guide to become. > >>> > >> That's what I was thinking when I saw your outline discussions ;-) > >> > >> Nino > >> > > Can I put in a suggestion here? > > Last year I did a course on using databases using Access. However, > > the principles would be the same. They started out with a flat file > > database. We learnt how to enter data, use forms, tables and > > reports. Then after we had mastered that we went on to relational > > databases. That was a fairly good plan I thought, as there is a lot > > to assimilate when you are starting out with a new software and new > > concepts. Many of the other people in the course had never used a > > database of any sort before. > > > > I always intended going through the course again this time with > > OOObase, just to see how relevant the course was to OpenOffice. > > > > This summer maybe. > > > > So I agree that a beginner's chapter on databases should not dive > > straight into relational databases until the basic steps of > > building a simple database are covered. > > > > Shelagh > > > The Getting started Guide has a chapter for the Base beginner: > ""Getting Started with Base" which I wrote earlier. The Base Guide's: > "Introducing Base" contains a flat database created using only the > Wizard. The second chapter "Planning/designing a database" discusses > the steps required for planning and designing a database. The > different types of databases are mentioned, and the planning that > must go into planning and designing them are discussed. This involves > just using the wizards. Then we want to take the reader beyond only > using the wizards. This is for those who want more from a database > than what the wizards can produce. > One of the threads I see in the Base Guide is the use of basic > principles regardless of the complexity of the database to design it > first and then and more difficult principles to the design of the > database. Who are the people we want to reach with the Base Guide and > the "Getting Started with Base" chapter? They have a very wide range > of abilities from the person who has never used a database before to > the ones who have had training for other databases. > > Dan > -- Please don't take my comments as a criticism. I could not criticise as I have not used the guide to try out Base. I was just offering a viewpoint of a person who has used another guide to learn software. Perhaps something could be learnt from that method. It was very hands-on, learn theory by doing and making. It did not touch on sql at all. Perhaps people who know sql might be interested in how the base sql differs from ansi standard or more familiar sql flavours like mysql or oracle? Shelagh -- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Jabber: [email protected] Skype: shelagh2648 ----------------------------------------------------------------
