Peter,
Thanks for positive feedback.
I'd be keen to jump through the hoops necessary.
Regards,
- Paul
--- Peter Donald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi,
>
> Considering I am working at same problem (but from other end) I like the
> idea. There is a few issues I see jumping out though.
>
> From comments made by JDD (ex-PMC head), the presence of alternate licensed
> code in CVS is fine, even if copyright is not owned by Apache. The one
> proviso is that Apache members must not be modifying that code (The only
> example cases I know of include the jaxp/sax classes which are either
> copyright sun or in public domain). I am not sure if that is edified
> anywhere but in the worst case you could host the BSD interface layer
> elsewhere and just use it from ASLed code.
>
> The real issue is whether jesktop is in scope. A while back jakarta was
> declared out of scope as it had things like oro, regex, ant in it which
> were not part of the charter. There was a few proposed solutions; widen
> scope of jakarta to include tools, split jakarta into sites like
> * tools.apache.org (ant/oro/regex/log4j)
> * frameworks.apache.org (avalon/turbine/struts)
> ...
>
> The choice was made to widen scope to "server and server support". There
> was also discussion about where the future lies. I listed a whole bunch of
> things I wanted to see at jakarta but nothing much has happened. There are
> those who like the idea of a more controlled "JakartaForge" but then there
> are those that hate it (they term it dumping ground). (I personally think
> that a JakartaForge with proper controls on growth would be beneficial).
>
> jesktop as it stands is out of scope. The question is - would the PMC
> change the scope for you? and would the foundation let them? The answer: I
> don't know ;) Even if they did decide to change the scope I think it would
> be a gradual thing, so it would take time (and probably a fair bit of effort).
>
> I guess you will never know untill you ask.
>
> At 12:09 AM 6/8/01 +0100, Paul Hammant wrote:
> >Folks,
> >
> >Not everyone's idea of a sane server application, but Jesktop (to remind
> people) is a server app
> >that sits on top of Avalon/phoenix. Sane so far, yes, insane in that it
> is a layer that performs
> >the functions of a desktop operating system.
> >
> >It's been my intention all along to give it to Apache when it reaches a
> level of maturity. It is
> >kinda close.
> >
> >Jesktop grants multi hot-installable applications the ability to sit
> inside one VM and co-exist in
> >in the same GUI space, but under separate classloaders. Themes can be set
> for all apps (Decorator
> >concept), a mime registry has been started, there is abstractions for
> types of containment
> >(JFrames versus JInternalFrames).
> >
> >The core code is Apache license. The interfaces are BSD. The reason for
> BSD is simple - I have
> >ported a number of applications to Jesktop from the open source community
> and some of them are
> >GPL. To not break their licenses (any further than the original authors
> have done - ho ho), I
> >have used BSD as it's approved both by Apache and by the FSF. That
> situations not ideal as I'd
> >like to have made the licenses Apache throughout. I still could of course
> as it's all my work.
> >
> >As I say I am in a position soon enough to donate what I can to Apache
> (and still continue with it
> >myself). Questions, would the PMC say yes (they are not allergic to GUI
> apps are they)? What
> >should I do with the interfaces? Leave them as BSD, move them to Apache
> license (and damn the
> >consequences to the GPL ported apps that import them)?
> >
> >It might also be nice to know what I have done by way of ports:
> >
> > * Batik - the xml.apache.org GUI tool
> > * Horstscape (a browser with a commercial widget for rendering HTML)
> > * Beanshell - full scripting/command line env, with dynamic java
> capability. V cool.
> > * XBrowser - the GPL HTML Browser
> > * TextPad - GPL text editor
> > * Demos (various hacky gui demos of mixed license)
> > * Skin Look and Feel (Apache clone license) - as a Decorator
> > - this allows all hosted apps to look like Mac, Windows, Beos, Mozilla
> etc.
> > * OYOAHA (decorator too, with commercial but free look/widget)
> > * JPad - Text editor - GPL
> > * Jipe - IDE (non compiling) - GPL
> > * JTetris - Game - free
> > * JFileManager - as it says
> > * JCDSee - graphics browser - GPL
> > * JarUtil (winzip alike) Apache license
> > * Apps (clock, image viewer etc)
> >
> >Porting apps has become quite boring. It's a way for me to avoid the nitty
> gritty of making the
> >core code better and completing the partially done bits....
> >
> >To recap, all can run at the same time. Jesktop can run alongside James,
> Cornerstone demos, other
> >SAR aplications. It has a pluggable window manager scheme (two Windows
> variants so far, Amiga,
> >Mac to do).
> >
> >I think it would be a worthy project for Apache, and with Avalon itself,
> could become ApacheOS
> >(forgetting for a min the underlying JDK).
> >
> >Jesktop itself is hosted at www.jesktop.org (down for a day or two while I
> rebuild). The ported
> >apps (of whichever license) are hosted at www.jesktop.net (also down).
> >
> >How to proceed?
> >
> >Could I gather some thoughts from those Avalon fans here before I go to
> the Jon Stevens & the PMC
> >?
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >- Paul H
> >
> >____________________________________________________________
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> >
> Cheers,
>
> Pete
>
> *-----------------------------------------------------*
> | "Faced with the choice between changing one's mind, |
> | and proving that there is no need to do so - almost |
> | everyone gets busy on the proof." |
> | - John Kenneth Galbraith |
> *-----------------------------------------------------*
>
>
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