It's the Arquivos site. The archive in Ponta Delgada said it was like a card catalog for all the islands. I don't think so. It does have Sao Miguel island stuff though: http://www.arquivos.azores.gov.pt/ Cheri Mello Listowner, Azores-Gen Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada
On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 7:22 PM JR <[email protected]> wrote: > Leonor, since you made reference to a possible inheritance, there is a > section on the Azores site that allows one to research names regarding > property and inventories. But the site address escapes me now. Perhaps > someone who knows can post the address. > > JR > > On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 12:52:25 PM UTC-5, Mara wrote: >> >> Sorry, didn’t read that detail, which speaks for itself. If the priest >> wrote it in the record that saves you having to search any further. The >> accuracy I was referring to was with regard to variations in the >> Grandparents names of the baptized. >> >> >> >> Yes, to my knowledge the Roda Publica was set up in the City Halls, thus >> “public”. Initially they were left at door steps and churches. A few >> convents had Roda’s but as the Church was overwhelmed the City took over. >> Books were created and each child was given a number. You will find >> examples of this in Sao Sebastiao, Matriz, Ponta Delgada, birth records, >> expostos. >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-PD-SAOSEBASTIAO-B-1874-1874/SMG-PD-SAOSEBASTIAO-B-1874-1874_item1/P4.html >> >> >> >> Sorry, can’t comment on family lure, which usually held some truth but if >> the records do not state the child was claimed then the mother would not >> have been able to take it back without the proper authorization. Which >> would then be appended to the child’s birth record. >> >> >> >> To answer you questions ‘would the Camara have any records of this >> abandoned child at someone’s door step” ----- the answer is dependent of >> the time period as noted above. >> >> >> >> Regarding name changes; I have seen records where the same exposto >> started off as ‘ da Camara ‘ to Camara Costa, to Costa Camara, to >> Carvalho. This to me shows the personal difficulty of this individual had >> in identifying with his own given/adopted surname. >> >> >> >> There was no official document that could firm up surnames as the Church >> only kept first name basis records. Surnames at certain points were up to >> the families or individuals to take them on. When Civil registry took over >> late 18th Century then the rules changed and every born child was >> registered with a full name and surname [s]. >> >> >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Margaret >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From: *Leonor Bertoni >> *Sent: *February 14, 2019 11:59 AM >> *To: *[email protected] >> *Subject: *Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Help with Vitorino Medeiros/Monica >> deJesus Rosario, Lagoa, Sao Miguel >> >> >> >> That's awesome! Thank you very much. I do not think that Monica had any >> type of identification as the baptismal record says "sem traser signal >> algum" but, as you said, it may not be accurate. For future reference, when >> they say "roda publica nesta freguesia", was the roda in the Camara? >> >> >> >> One more question, my aunt's husband was also abandoned but he was left >> on a wet nurse's doorstep. The story is that he, Carlos, was the son of a >> rich man whom his his mom worked for. It is said that later she went and >> took him back (when he was 2). I found Carlos' baptismal record and >> marriage record where it shows his last name, which we assume is his >> mother's name. However, later on it is said that Carlos' real father passed >> away and his children found Carlos to give him some inheritance. At that >> point, he changed his last name to match his father's. As we know, stories >> change and grow. Would the Camara have any records of this abandoned child >> since he was left at someone's doorstep? For any legal name change, he >> would also have to go through the Camara, correct? I am also aware that he >> may have just changed his name on his children's records as they were being >> registered. >> >> >> >> Thank you in advance. >> >> >> >> Leonor >> >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Feb 2019 at 11:12, Margaret Vicente <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> Hello Leonor, >> >> >> >> Here's what I've learned researching similar case [s]. If Expostos were >> not claimed there's no way of knowing who the parents were. It is the end >> of a line, sadly. The reason why the names changed over time was because >> everything was verbal and since different people may be giving the priest >> the information, that may vary. >> >> >> >> The record that can be relied on is the Marriage record, because all >> information was verified and proof of birth had to be obtained. Baptismal >> records were not verified by the priests for Grandparents veracity. >> >> >> >> The record link you posted states Monica was placed in the Roda da >> Camara. They may have kept records for their Expostos. Descriptive records >> were kept by the Camaras' and Santa Casa in which it describes the child, >> clothing and if accompanied by a note. Many expostos came with their name >> and whether or not the child had already been baptized. This info will not >> lead to the parents but does give some sort of connection to the child. So >> If you want to take it a step further, and since you are fluent in the >> native language, my suggestion is for you to contact Lagoa's Camara >> Municipal to see if they can point you in the right direction. >> >> >> >> *Gabinete de Comunicação e Relações Públicas* >> Casa da Cultura Carlos César >> >> Rua General Bernardo do Canto, 1-3 >> 9560-106 Lagoa (Santa Cruz) >> >> E-mail: [email protected] >> >> Telefone: 296 960 600 (Geral) >> >> >> >> Good luck. >> >> >> >> Margaret >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 13, 2019 at 11:56 PM Leonor Bertoni <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> It's all good, lol. >> >> >> >> On Wed, 13 Feb 2019 at 22:36, linda <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> Sorry! I mean Hi Leonor-- not Monica! >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, February 13, 2019 at 7:33:50 PM UTC-8, linda wrote: >> >> Hi Monica, >> >> >> >> I suggest you make a timeline for the events. Perhaps you should add >> annotations as to who the priest (source) is that is making the records. >> The priests' records are only as accurate as their sources. Sometimes they >> had personal knowledge of the participants-- sometimes not. It will help >> refresh your memory later, if needed. >> >> >> >> For what it's worth, you may only have two sets of potential parents for >> Monica. Manuel da Costa Elisa and Maria de Jesus might be the same couple >> as Manuel da Costa (Homem) and Maria Julia. >> >> >> >> Did you notice that Monica's baptismal godmother is also named "Maria >> Julia"? >> >> >> >> I don't know if you will get a definitive answer to your question, but >> you can collect information on the families and try to make some >> (speculative) connections. >> >> >> >> I have a similar case for one of my ancestors. She was baptised as "pai >> incognito", but in her later children's records, a maternal grandfather's >> name starts to appear. It may be her natural father, or it may be the >> priest making an assumption about her mother's husband. I can only guess >> which it might be. In another case, one of my great-grandmothers later >> children's baptismal records start to show grandparents for a different >> woman with a similar name. I assume the priest was confusing the two >> women. >> >> >> >> best of luck, >> >> >> >> Linda >> >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, February 13, 2019 at 6:08:00 PM UTC-8, [email protected] >> wrote: >> >> Hello everyone. I am looking for some help in identifying if Monica de >> Jesus was a foundling. Below are the records I have found. As you will see, >> Monica's lists 3 different couples as her parents. We do know for a fact >> that Vitorino only had one wife. My question is if there is any known >> reason as to why this would happen. >> >> >> >> Monica's baptismal record showing her as an "exposta" >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1870-1879/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1870-1879_item1/P409.html >> >> >> >> Monica's and Vitorino's marriage record showing Monica's parents as >> "incognitos" >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-C-1890-1899/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-C-1890-1899_item1/P300.html >> >> >> >> To here I think everything adds up. This is where it starts to get >> confusing. >> >> >> >> The first 2 of Monica's and Vitorino's children list the maternal >> grandparents as "incognitos" >> >> >> >> However, the third and fourth child lists the maternal grandparents as >> Maria Julia and Manuel da Costa (Homem) >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1897-1899/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1897-1899_item1/P270.html >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1900-1905/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1900-1905_item1/P379.html >> >> >> >> The fifth child list the mother as Maria do Rosario Monica - This record >> lists the maternal grandparents as Manuel da Costa Elisa and Maria de Jesus >> - (Maria bottom of the page) >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911_item1/P86.html >> >> >> >> The 6th child, Catharina, shows the mother as Monica Boniface and the >> maternal grandparents as Joao Bonifacio and Maria Machado >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911_item1/P304.html >> >> >> >> The 7th child, Diamantina, shows the mother as Maria do Rosario Monica >> and the maternal grandparents as Joao Bonifacio and Maria Machado >> >> >> >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911/SMG-LG-ROSARIO-B-1906-1911_item1/P567.html >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Azores Genealogy" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Azores Genealogy" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Margaret M Vicente >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Azores Genealogy" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Azores Genealogy" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. >> >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/azores.
