Shaun, No need to question my experience or SCAA standards here... know all about them 'golden rules'.
Clearly you haven't tasted what I suggested because your first fact (below) states coarsely ground... and that's exactly the reason why I'm suggestion this alternative... to use fine ground. The same grind setting as your espresso. Let me try to explain again what I mean; Over here, it's fairly common to yield 5oz with either an espresso + hot water or a double basket filled with appr. 18-20grams coarsely grind coffee, right? Still with me? The alternative I was suggesting to try is to use a double basket filled with 8-10 or 11 grams of FINELY grind coffee. Why? Because you won't have to change your grinder setup going back and forth between an espresso and a 5oz cup of regular/lungo/crema... (whatever you like to call it on your side of the ocean). Now, the point I was trying to make... is to compare this alternative against the espresso topped off with hot water. Despite the slight over extraction I (and many others) experience a better tasting cup compared to an espresso topped off with hot water. Why? Probably because the entire amount of water has been in touch with the finely grind coffee. So, if someone happens to like this alternative too (which happen to be a lot of visitors I get), you can: a. serve a better tasting 5oz. cup compared to the 5oz. 'americano' b. quickly change back and forth between an espresso and a 5oz. cup without the need of changing your grinder settings c. save yourself the costs of buying an extra grinder in order to be quickly able to switch between fine and coarsely grind. Especially if you're used to serve a 5oz. cup with 20grams of coarsely grind coffee. The pix below look very nice, yet very common to me too. I don't see the point of them at all, because I see them every day and they don't make any sense to the experiment I was talking about. Of course they taste better than any 5oz 'compromise'. Point is that not everyone drinks an espresso, cappuccino, macchiatto, latte or latte-macchiatto. The links and information you mentioned are pretty basic. Here's something else I'd like to suggest... an inspiration for all experienced barista, willing to expand their search, beyond the so called 'golden or SCAA rules'. And lots of incredible pix too: https://www.espressoquest.com/book.html Good luck and kind regards, Hybrid Ps. I hope you weren't planning on topping your wife's bevie with boiling water (212 degrees). That would have burned some flavours, don't you think? Considering your experience I presume you meant hot water. Pps. I consider this threat closed. I think it's getting too much off topic (not brewtus related) if we take it any further. One thing is for sure though... the Brewtus allows us to take the everlasting coffee quest further and beyond. -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Namens onemoreshot Verzonden: zondag 25 januari 2009 21:02 Aan: Brewtus Onderwerp: Re: Quick regular without changing the grind Hybrid, I've tasted what you describe. I don't want you to think I'm talking down from a podium at you, I'm a nobody in a big coffee world, I'm simply stating facts. I've pulled thousands of shots and if you can think of a really obscure way to make coffee with an espresso machine I've either done it for my own purposes or done it at the request of a customer in the past. Lastly, I don't want to turn this into a shooting match. Here's the facts: - 5oz run through 7-11gms of coarsely ground coffee in a double basket is by definition... over-extraction. Period. Refer to SCAA standards if you need to. - Pulling an acceptable shot using approx 17gms in a double basket in approx 26secs producing approx 1.50z volume, then adding 3.5oz of boiling water will provide with a great opportunity to surpass a lungo. This is what I pulled 30mins ago: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3350/3225517371_2274f68953_o.jpg And created a 4oz latte for my wife: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3332/3226373822_f1b4032311_o.jpg If I had used boiling water instead of microfoam I would have had an equally delicious bevie. A lungo, in my opinion, is a poor representation of what the coffee can be and I'm not the only one of that opinion. I don't want to assume that you haven't yet started following some of the truly inspiring barista's on the Internet via their websites or blog's but if you haven't you should go see what's going on out there. Here's a couple to start you off, but again maybe you are far more advanced that this, who am I to guess. http://www.jimseven.com/ http://www.chemicallyimbalanced.org/ Shaun On Jan 25, 3:25 am, Hybrid <[email protected]> wrote: > Wow... I never intended to start a revolution here... but pls allow me > to make things more clear... > > The yield I get in 30 seconds is indeed between 4.5 and 5oz. > Within 30 seconds, so no over extraction with a capital O at all. > Maybe I should have stated my definition of a 'regular' cup first (5oz > max instead of 12oz). > Lesson learned. > Unless you're not open for suggestions or experiments there no need to > read any further. > > But if you're more open minded here's a test I'd like to suggest... > shoot one espresso in a single basket (30 seconds max.) and add hot > (not boiling!) water until you yield 4.5oz to 5oz max. > Then put the same amount of grind (for 1 espresso) in a double basket > and shoot for 30 seconds max... which should > yield in 4.5oz to 5oz too, due to the lack of resistance. > Then compare the taste and see which version you prefer. > > Again... it'll be a matter of personal taste... so no need to start > yelling at me or calling me names... > I just thought it would be worth sharing this to the coffee world and > I don't consider it bad advice from my dealer > at all. I just should have been more clear on the yield at first I > guess. > > For the record, 3 ways to make a regular cup of 4.5 or 5oz within 30 > seconds of extraction time: > 1. americano; topping off an espresso with hot water > 2. Lungo; using a double basket with double amount of grind but > changing the grind to coarse > 3. Lungo-variation; using a double basket with a single amount of fine > grind (same grind as espresso). > > So, you can a. choose to try this experiment or b. skip it... it's > still a free world, you know. > Although if you're only used to drinking a 12oz. truck stop americano > I suggest you skip this > experiment... the yield might be much to strong for you. > > No need to comment any further if you haven't tried this first... > I'm very interested in your findings between #1 and #3. > > Good luck and tada for now... > > On 25 jan, 00:19, "Shaun Taylor" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > At 5oz it makes it just half as bad as a 12oz (which is 4 times as bad as a > > 2oz). > > > Lungo is the term, which I believe was derived from the Italian notion of > > coughing up a lung-o when you taste coffee extracted like this. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > > Shaun Taylor > > >http://shaundoreenevankeegan.blogspot.com/ > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf > > > Of Dennis Keating > > Sent: 24 January 2009 17:12 > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: Quick regular without changing the grind > > > I have heard of this, but I think he is referring to a 5 oz serving size. I > > don't know about the coffee dose. Isn't that called a "Lungo" or > > something? - Dennis > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Shaun Taylor" <[email protected]> > > To: <[email protected]> > > Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 3:12 PM > > Subject: RE: Quick regular without changing the grind > > > > I'm still not sure if it was a practical joke, or not? > > > > And so instead of scratching my head a bunch more, I just wandered over to > > > the Brewtus and pull a shot of 80% Jacaranda/20% Sanani and whipped up my > > > usual 4oz latte. Suddenly, everything was good in the coffee universe > > > again. > > > ;-) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > -- > > > > Shaun Taylor > > > >http://shaundoreenevankeegan.blogspot.com/ > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf > > > Of Neil Atwood > > > Sent: 24 January 2009 16:06 > > > To: [email protected] > > > Subject: RE: Quick regular without changing the grind > > > > I'd be wary of feeding the trolls Shaun... ;-) > > > > Neil A. > > > Blue Mountains, Oz > > >http://minstrygrounds.net.au-A blog about selecting, roasting and > > > drinking > > > fine coffee > > > __________________________ > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf > > > Of Shaun Taylor > > > Sent: Sunday, 25 January 2009 8:35 AM > > > To: [email protected] > > > Subject: RE: Quick regular without changing the grind > > > > I'm not sure I understand but if by Regular, you mean a 12oz cup of coffee > > > and you are suggesting pulling 12ozs of water through 7-11gms in a basket > > > that generally holds 18gms... well please don't take offence, but really, > > > that's not very good advice at all. What you just outlined is called > > > over-extraction with a capital O. > > > > There's only one acceptable way to achieve that 12oz using an espresso > > > machine as the coffee extraction method... pull a shot using generally > > > acceptable standards (which have been discussed at great length in this > > > group) this will result in a 1.25-2oz shot, then top it off with boiling > > > water which can be drawn from the hot water wand on the Brewtus or from a > > > kettle. > > > > The golden rule tip you got from your dealer, which you mentioned, was bad > > > advice. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > -- > > > > Shaun Taylor > > > >http://shaundoreenevankeegan.blogspot.com/ > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf > > > Of Hybrid > > > Sent: 24 January 2009 14:11 > > > To: Brewtus > > > Subject: Quick regular without changing the grind > > > > Here's a great tip I got from my dealer; > > > The golden rule for a 'regular' on an espresso machine is to change > > > the grind from > > > fine into more coarse, right? > > > > Maybe old news, but here's a way to never change the grind and still > > > serve a wonderful > > > cup of 'regular' coffee w/ crema and all, straight after you've made > > > an espresso on your Brewtus. > > > > Use a portafilter w/ a double 'portion' filter basket and only fill it > > > with just one serving > > > (say 7 to 9 grams of fine grind beans). Tamp lightly, polish and hit > > > that shot... within 30 seconds > > > you'll have a full cup of great tasting regular coffee where all the > > > water has actually 'touched' > > > the fine grind beans (compared to an 'americano' where hot water is > > > just added to an espresso). > > > If someone likes a stronger 'regular' just use a single portion of 9 > > > to 11 grams instead (but still > > > use that double 'portion' basket). > > > > Hence the advantages: > > > No more switching your grinder settings > > > No additional grinder needed if you need to switch frequently between > > > regular / espresso. > > > IMHO better taste compared to a 'regular' with coarse grind or an > > > 'americano'. > > > > Give it a try if you like... the 10-11 grams in a double basket has > > > become my favorite 'regular' now. > > > Hope you like it. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Brewtus" group. 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