Thanks.  Very interesting.

--- Maru <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Here's a link to that book:
>
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0393325555/qid=1098040811/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-6659867-3819261?v=glance&s=books&n=507846
> (Sorry about the length.)
> ~Maru
> 
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > From: David Brin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: Re:  Brin: Second Salvo
> 
> > 
> > True enough.  A better example of their obsession
> with
> > form over substance would be abortion.  Abortion
> RATES
> > went down under Clinton and climbed under both
> Bushes.
> >  Pragmatically speaking, lessening the number
> should
> > be the goal whether achieved by liberal means or
> not.
> > 
> > But let's be fair.  If infanticide were legal, a
> ten %
> > drop in the rate would not stop you from being
> boiling
> > mad.  The real problem isn't pragmatic but
> > philosophical.  As romantics, each neocon subgroup
> > must go for a whole loaf, never part of one. 
> > Compromise is for enlightenment humanists.
> > 
> > > Also, you *could* recouncile the neo-cons and
> the>
> > Left Behinders> if you push Judgement Day far off
> > enough into the> future.  After> all, you don't
> need
> > eternity to build a star-going> empire led by>
> > philospher-kings, just a large but finite amount
> of
> > > time. 
> > 
> > True, but that takes ALL the wind out of the sails
> of
> > the apocalypts.  Geez the "Whore of Babylon Five"
> just
> > sounds too sciencefictional to be taken seriously.
> > Likewise an antimatter anti Christ."  Doesn't
> satisfy
> > as much as"The evil one is already among us."
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Of
> > > course, it does seem a little pointless if God
> is
> > > going to come
> > > and make everything way better than mere
> humanity
> > > ever could.
> > > And also, I notice you reference the excerpt
> 'The
> > > Philospher of
> > > Islamic Terror', but not teh Book (Terror and
> > > Liberalism). Why's
> > > that? The book is well worth reading too.
> > 
> > Got a web site ref?  It sounds like a magnificent
> > reach and a diatribe.
> > 
> > OH!  I am reading COLLAPSE by one of our
> > civilization's real genius-treasures, Jared
> Diamond
> > (GUNS, GERMS AND STEEL).  It covers what factors
> > brought about civ collapse in past societies and
> what
> > factors allowed others to remain flexible enough
> to
> > evade disaster.
> > 
> > By his standards, this would be a positively
> insane
> > administration in any measure.  But his book has
> > changed my mind.  I NO LONGER think that the
> monsters'
> > worst crime is dissipating our armed forces and
> > deliberately destroying readiness by miring our
> best
> > troops and using up the reserves.
> > 
> > Worse has been the 20 years of lying and
> obfuscation
> > about climate change.  Ten years calling it a
> hoax. 
> > Ten years saying it exists but "we need more
> data"...
> > and now "yes, it's big and humans did it, but now
> it's
> > too late to do anything about it."
> > 
> > Read Diamond's book.  It says NOTHING about
> todays'
> > politics.  It says EVERYTHING about the
> destruction of
> > our resiliency by morons.
> 
> 
>               
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