John's right, guys, I know we're all hurting right now, and we're all ang
ry.
But please let's cut out the name-calling.
Judith
> Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to go nuke Afghanistan. But I do fee
l
> that if people choose to protect a terrorist, like the prez said, those
w
> ho
> harbor are no better, and are not innocent.
>
> I'm so glad the members of this list always resort to insults and name
> calling.
> "stupefyingly na�ve" that makes me feel very much like we can all fre
el
> y
> express our opinions.. I'm a stupid, un American, nazi, who can't tell
th
> e
> difference between real life and video games.. yeah I feel so much bett
er
> for expressing myself.
>
> Come on guys are you incapable of holding an argument without stooping
to
> name calling.
>
> Some of you are very kind and consider all viewpoints and reply politel
y,
> you rock.
>
> I'm glad you all consider yourselves the voices of realism and freedom.
>
> J.
>
>
> John Wilker
> Web Applications Consultant
> Macromedia Certified ColdFusion Developer
>
> www.red-omega.com <http://www.red-omega.com>
>
> What does Snoop Dogg use to do his laundry? Blee-otch!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Gilchrist [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 8:15 AM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: RE: Communication about the attack
>
>
> Look, I too want those responsible for the attacks to be found brought
> to
> trial/punished but I have a huge problem with the idea of rounding up
> "terrorists" and shooting them indiscriminately which is what you
> advocate
> below.
>
> I can appreciate that lots of people on the list are deeply hurt by the
> recent attacks and want the perps brought to justice. And from what I
> can
> see, most people want justice but with due diligence.
>
> Lets just examine your first sentence:
> "well if you had shot them all then they would not be a problem"
>
> Looking at the raw logic, yes, you're right, if *all* IRA terrorists
> were
> killed there would not have been a problem.
>
> Now let's look at it from a "realist's" point of view.
>
> What determines whether someone is an IRA terrorist?
> "They all have a problem with government and so are vocal, have beards,
> wear
> wooly Aran sweaters, like traditional Irish music. We want justice
> quickly
> so it doesn't matter if we found guns, explosives etc. although we did
> find
> some guns and ammo.
>
> Heh, maybe we caught a few innocent people who were too stupid to be
> vocal
> about civil rights but we have to kill all these terrorists so that's
> too
> bad and off we go. Sounds rational enough to me.
> Damn, we just found out that some of the really really bad guys weren't
> at
> their houses when we went to arrest them. How inconsiderate. Well
> doesn't
> matter, we'll just kill the ones we have because after that, the ones
> in
> hiding won't touch us."
>
> Can you imagine what happens next?
> The ones you couldn't catch suddenly go nuts in levels of violence and
> funnily enough they have a lot of new friends to help them.
>
> "I know it's harsh and it sucks and you know what, life sucks in a lot
> of
> ways."
>
> If your solution was even remotely viable I might barely be able to put
> with
> such an act but I just find your view stupefyingly na�ve. How can
> you
> possibly imagine that people would just put up with innocents being
> killed
> around them. If anything you've just created the best recruitment
> advertisement possible.
> Thinking of Ireland, most normal people would have no problem with
> taking
> down the terrorists but if you start taking out innocent people as well
> and
> chalk it up collateral damage that's a different story. At that point
> you're going to drive normally non-violent people to joining up to
> protect
> themselves and you have a much bigger problem on your hands.
>
> Think back to your own rebellious history here in the US? Did American
> people simply go into submission when the British won the first few
> battles?
> No, if anything it increased their resolve to become independent.
>
> All the best,
> Kevin
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Wilker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 8:47 PM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: RE: Communication about the attack
>
>
> well if you had shot them all then they would not be a problem. I know
> it's
> harsh and it sucks and you know what, life sucks in a lot of ways.
>
> The problem with taking the high road all the time is that you are up
> there
> for everyone to shoot at.
>
> Just think how much power the IRA would have if in the beginning GB had
> killed hundreds for even being suspected... I know I'd be very leery to
> join
> up. And just think how many terrorists cells will be less likely to
> mess
> with the US if we take them and the country harboring them out. How
> many
> countries are likely to continue harboring these fiends?
>
> The saying is "For every action there is an equal and opposite
> reaction",
> not "For every action we will take the high road and be better people"
> while
> our friends and family are killed at will by people who don't really
> care
> if they are sinking to a lower level.
>
> J.
>
>
> John Wilker
> Web Applications Consultant
> Macromedia Certified ColdFusion Developer
>
> www.red-omega.com <http://www.red-omega.com>
>
> What does Snoop Dogg use to do his laundry? Blee-otch!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Gilchrist [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 9:30 AM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: RE: Communication about the attack
>
>
> I don't think you understand. GB did try and put away all the
> terrorists at
> the start by introducing emergency powers and internment. They
> basically
> went out and imprisoned hundreds of people without trial.
>
> Guess what happened?
>
> A some of those folks weren't terrorists at all
> B Because of A, it just galvanised the nationalist community and people
> joined the IRA in droves.
>
> That sort of solution isn't fighting fire with fire, it's poring gas on
> the
> fire. Good job the GB didn't just round em into a field and shoot them.
> God
> knows what would have happened then.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Wilker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 11:17 AM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: RE: Communication about the attack
>
>
> No they're the reason that something like this happens so infrquently
> here
> and the rest of the world is terrorized so often. You think our
> airports
> became unsecure in the last few months. This could have happenned at
> any
> time for years now, but no one has been organized or gutsy enough to
> pull it
> off, now they have and the US needs to make it clear to the world that
> we
> won't put up with it the way GB puts up with the IRA. If you hunted
> down the
> IRA and got done with the whole thing you wouldn't have to be afraid of
> bombs each day going off. Clearly the ignore it and it will go away
> approach
> is not the right one.
>
> J.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Neil Clark [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 4:06 AM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: RE: Communication about the attack
>
>
> Jeez, listen to yourself? Your opinion(s) are why acts like these are
> aimed
> at the US! Do we in GB decide to carpet bomb Ireland after the IRA or
> its
> breakaway groups explose a bomb in London or in the UK?
>
>
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