immigration :) Dana
----- Original Message -----
From: Doug White <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2004 05:45:03 -0500
Subject: Re: 9/11 Commission to Cheney - You're still wrong.
To: CF-Community <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
While a lot has been typed in this thread - its original purpose was not so much
that we were doing the wrong thing by staying in Iraq, but the criticism was
about the deceit which was practiced as the reason (justification?) for the
invasion. This deceit and misinformation is still ongoing.
As for the Russian, German and French, they are participants in the Afghanistan
campaign, France enthusiastically so. They are as interested in a legitimate
war on terror just as we should be.
Again the criticism is the unilateral, or near unilateral in terms of money and
manpower our invasion of Iraq on trumped up, completely false, and deceptive
reasons. This is not just an accusation by disgruntled liberals, it has been
established from many sources to be absolute fact.
What has come out is that the Bush administration had an agenda for Iraq even
before 9/11 and I believe war on terror had little to do with it. There was no
plan for an occupation, or at least an ill conceived plan and that has come back
to bite us.
There is evidence that the Iraqi populace, while glad to be out from under the
oppression of the Saddam regime, are likewise objecting to the US hand picked
government they have "handed over" the reins of government to. Those dissidents
are supported and financed by Syria, Saudis and Iran and more. They are not Al
Queada, they are Iraqis.
There are indications that it is a no-win situation, or will be many years
before the democratic transition takes effect, thus the term "modern day
Viet-Nam" The Vice President and the Defense Secretary have both publicly
stated that our military presence will be required in the area "for many years."
What isn't mentioned is the toll on the reservist's families, civilian jobs,
the economy and the traditional freedoms of the US populace benefiting the very
few fat cats who are insiders to the administration.
Back at home, one of the most visible government actions was in the area of
Airline security screening, and blame was placed on the fact that the screeners
were employed by private contractors and many, of not most of the screeners were
not even Us citizens, and the proposed cure was to federalize (with higher wages
and benefits) by making them all federal employees/ Now have you seen the
reports that they are not admitting that this system has not worked and that
there is a move to go back to the private contractors after all? Do you feel
safer now? If you do, you truly do have your head in the sand.
What about the practice of Immigration judges, when illegals are captured, are
releasing them into the streets, with no bond, no extradition? This is still
going on, showing that our borders are still not secure, and even when captured,
the illegals (except Mexicans) are not even deported or incarcerated. Do you
still feel safer? The government is still unable to accurately track the
movements of Legal visitors, much less the millions that are present illegally.
What about the periodic scare tactics being released as a "terrorist threat" by
he DHS with no corresponding increase in vigilance, and always quoting
non-specific intelligence data. Do you actually believe this stuff, and that a
scared public will re-elect the president?
> > Modern day Vietnam? That's what Ted Kennedy was
> using
> > to turn Americans against the war. Nobody except
> you
> > and the terrorist bought it.
>
> uh, there are quite a few people who see this
> parallel. As I recall
> WIlliam Buckley Jr is one. You've heard of WIlliam F
> Buckley Jr right?
OK, I'll give you that on a technicality. The article
he's referring to states that we can't win this kind
of war from the air alone. We still have to go on the
ground where we're no more advanced then we were
during the Vietnam War. Ted Kennedy said this is
George Bush's Vietnam and Doug said, "we are stuck in
a modern day Vietnam" So I'll give it to you.
>
> > Did you miss the memo about the handover of power
> to
> > Iraq?
>
> We are still there right?
The point is a lot of you thought the handover was
going to drag on but everything's still on schedule.
The Iraqi's are starting to take over and are exit is
in the works. May take awhile but its no 10-year war.
> > >wherein the US reputation, is being sullied,
> > By a handful of Democratic politicians here that
> want
> > to win the election and a few rogue countries that
> > lost their gravy train.
>
> Sam. Consider the possibility that the US reputation
> is being affected
> by the actions of its leaders. Does this not make
> more sense than to
> think that other countries suddenly became
> anti-American?
I keep asking what countries all the sudden hate us
and the answer I get is all.
So I need to answer myself.
France, Germany, Canada and Ireland. Turkey and Saudi
Arabia I think are on the border.
I was under the impression that France always hated
everybody. A lot of conservatives think if Chirac were
out the French would get along with us better but I
doubt it.
France and Russia profited the most from the alleged
scandal.
Germany I think is the one Country that would hate us
because of the War. But I think that has to do with
the world power thing, they don't like us calling the
shots anymore. But I was wrong about them being in on
the oil for food scandal. Sorry.
<thatDreamIHad>
I'm thinking France and Germany want Kerry elected. He
will fly over Iraq and swear he had personally seen
atrocities committed by American troops. Throw the
entire US military in jail and make EU (read Germany
and France) the new world power. Of course they hate
each other so civil war will break out and...to be
continued
</thatDreamIHad>
Canada. I heard from a Canadian journalist on the
"Only O'Reilly Can Spin Zone" that they've felt so
secure from being our neighbor all these years that
they've become pacifists and believe if everyone puts
down their guns it would be a happy world.
Don't know it to be true but I did read 85% of
Canadians don't like us and 40% of children think
we're an evil empire. Don't know how nuch should be
attributed to the war.
Ireland hates Bush and loves Clinton. I think it has
nothing to do with the war and I'll leave it at that.
I did come across this article from 2 years ago and
looks like it still applies today.
Axis of Allies
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=105001714
> > Ironic that the only ones against us are involved
> with
> > the food-for-oil scandal. Talk about a money
> train. We
> > broke up that multi-billion dollar bribery ring.
>
> So other countries either support the US
> unconditionally or they are
> just corrupt, is that what you are saying?
>
Not at all.
> ::sigh:: have you been listening to Rush Limbaugh
> again?
Yes. He wants to know why conservatives are proud to
be labeled conservative but people on the left hate
being called liberals. What gives?
Since you brought him up, everyone here makes fun of
him and calls him a junkie but I haven't heard anyone
prove him wrong once. Just a little flame bait.
-sm
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