I think this should be taken off the list.... I'll responded to you directly.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Fleischer, Beth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, December 07, 2001 5:30 AM Subject: RE: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > You said that I could only view you via my "sterotypical view" whcih is > calling me unable to make my own decision. You dont' know the first thing > about me nor my feelings about the news nor where I form my opinions. Your > assumption is always that those who disagree with you must be disillusioned > which is insulting and quite wrong. You are quite free to disagree with > others and offer arguments against their opinions however what you choose to > do instead is insult them and assume all sorts of things about them. > Basically, YOU are the judgemental one - you are the one making assumptions > about other peoples motives. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Benjamin Falloon [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 10:13 AM > > To: CF-Community > > Subject: Re: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > > > > Beth, > > > > I'm sorry but you are just making things up! > > Manufacture is not the same as invent. Look up the word in a dictionary. I > > never called anyone a) horrible war wonger or b) sheep? Where did you get > > this from? > > > > Your crazy! > > > > Benjamin > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Fleischer, Beth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2001 4:05 AM > > Subject: RE: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > > > > > > > That is NOT what you said. I didnt' exaggerate one iota. > > > > > > Here is what you said: > > > > > > "manufacture of 'stories' (one of these being the > > > > > celebrating Palistinians, another being the oppression of women > > > in > > > > > Aphganistan for example). > > > > > > manufacture (INVENT) > > > verb [T] > > > to invent (an excuse, reason, story etc.) in order to deceive someone > > > > > > > > > I would assume you put quotes around stories because you meant to imply > > they > > > were ficticious. > > > Obviously you implied that you felt these stories were invented and > > untrue. > > > > > > > > > So you think the media isn't objective. well, no shit benjamin - the > > media > > > isn't objective (as no human being is) and shows what they think its > > > important rather than other things. > > > > > > I actually would agree that the pictures of the palestinians dancing in > > the > > > streets may have been taken out of context - a good palestinian friend > > > pointed out to me that the palestinians generally look much worse when > > > expressing anti american sentiment, burning flags and such. But i also > > > think its a part of the culture of the people at this point to respect > > the > > > lives of israelis or americans. > > > > > > However, I don't believe that the stories of taliban oppression were > > > exaggerated at all. > > > > > > Note, benjamin I make both of these conclusions based on non-media > > sources. > > > We aren't all being blindly led around by the finger of CNN, nor are we > > > stupid enough to not be able to make critical judgements of the media. > > We > > > aren't sheep. your assumption that anyone who disagrees with you is a) > > a > > > horrible war monger and b) a sheep is quite irritating. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Benjamin Falloon [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 8:18 PM > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > Subject: Re: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > > > > > > > > Beth, > > > > > > > > I'm not certain how you arrived at such an exaggerated understanding > > of > > my > > > > original post. But allow me at least the oppertunity to expand my > > > > perspetive > > > > before you sarcastically attack my posts once more, even though the > > > > original > > > > post was not even address to you. > > > > > > > > I may have refered to television (and this can be broadened to any > > > > corporately own/operated news service) as manufactured, but I did not > > in > > > > any > > > > way insinuate that the 'stories' were myth. News services (mostly) > > deliver > > > > their content in a highly constructed way. News is like coka cola; > > coke > > is > > > > based on sugar, a 'real world' ingredient, just as the "oppression of > > > > afghanistan women" may too be 'real world', but the end result > > delivered > > > > by > > > > the news services is nothing 'natural'... it is a manufacured > > construct > > > > intentionally mixed to produce the desired effect. This is how I view > > > > corporate news services. Most of what is aired looks no different > > from, > > > > and > > > > indeed reflects the kind of news approach highlighted by the nineties > > film > > > > "Wag the Dog". > > > > > > > > Images are carefully selected, edited and cut with emotive music and > > > > commentry designed to promote a certain perspective. Exactly whose > > > > perspective/interests/politics represented are beyond the reach of > > this > > > > discussion, but the net effect of these kinds of presentations are not > > at > > > > all dissimilar to those effects achieved by the entertainment industry > > as > > > > a > > > > whole. > > > > > > > > News is entertainment/entertainment is news. I find making judgements > > upon > > > > other peoples/cultures etc based on this kind of information > > offensive. > > > > > > > > I recall a previous post by Gary that brought up the lack on true > > > > investigative reporting in the main stream news. My oppinion on the > > news > > > > is > > > > an extension of this logic. > > > > > > > > Benjamin > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Fleischer, Beth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 12:12 PM > > > > Subject: RE: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > > > > > > > > > > > > > Folks!! > > > > > > > > > > did you hear it! The oppression of afghanistan women is a myth, > > made > > up > > > > by > > > > > the media. > > > > > > > > > > Benjamin, I heard about the plight of afghani women several years > > ago > > > > when > > > > > an afghan woman came to speak at a university. Did she make it up > > too? > > > > was > > > > > she in on the big media conspiracy? Were the stories she told of > > women > > > > > being killed for walking down the street with a man whom they > > weren't > > > > > married to made up too? Were the stories of female lawyers and > > doctors > > > > made > > > > > up too? And she left afghanistan not because she was no longer > > > > allowed > > > > to > > > > > practice law there, but just to spread these lies about the > > wonderful > > > > > taliban rule? All those underground schools to teach girls dont' > > exist > > > > > right - because under the taliban rule girls WERE allowed to go to > > > > school? > > > > > And all this information I received prior to 9/11 - it was made up > > for > > > > WHAT > > > > > REASON? > > > > > > > > > > so, all the people in afghanistan listening to music again, shaving > > > > their > > > > > beards, taking off their masks, they weren't really oppressed its > > just > > a > > > > > media invention, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The western media is at best, extrodinatily limited in it's > > > > representation > > > > > > of 'real people' in the middle east (or media east as it's exists > > for > > > > us). > > > > > > Furthermore, it's representation is more often designed to promote > > > > this > > > > > > kind > > > > > > of discussion by manufacture of 'stories' (one of these being the > > > > > > celebrating Palistinians, another being the oppression of women in > > > > > > Aphganistan for example). These stories are the developed and made > > > > self > > > > > > referencial, repeated over and over by all media outlets until > > they > > > > become > > > > > > the measure of oppinion polls on presidencial popularity. There > > > > simplify > > > > > > polarize and synthasize politics and culture for the fast food > > culture > > > > > > that > > > > > > is America. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Michael Dinowitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 9:18 AM > > > > > > Subject: RE: Massive blasts rock Central Jerusalem :( > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. There were a LOT more than 1 woman and 5 kids. There were PA > > > > police > > > > > > > taking camera's away from reporters to avoid the news from it. > > There > > > > > > were > > > > > > > letters of protest from the AP and Reuters over it. I know > > people > > > > who > > > > > > live > > > > > > > in Israel and have first hand reports as do many others. > > > > > > > 2. The rumor that it was old footage was debunked. It started > > with > > a > > > > > > > student in Argentina and spread. It was real footage. > > > > > > > 3. I don't condemn any Palestinian for the actions of some truly > > > > sick > > > > > > > people who take pride and happiness in the suffering of others. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >As or your second quesion... > > > > > > > >First, that clip of a women dancing and five kids > > > > > > > >clapping there hands, I wouldnt realy know how that is > > > > > > > >considred 'my people', last time i checked, the > > > > > > > >Palestinian population was not reprented by a women > > > > > > > >and 5 kids, and yes, a car passing by blowings its > > > > > > > >horn...Second, CNN, which first aired the clip, was > > > > > > > >and still is accused of airing an old clip which was > > > > > > > >taking during the Iraq war, except , sadly, no media > > > > > > > >outlet would ever let the story run, nor deny or > > > > > > > >confirm the reports.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Now i dont know if that is right or wrong, I do > > > > > > > >believe that YES, its very possible that there does > > > > > > > >exist a palestinian women who danced in the streets, > > > > > > > >and its so re-assuring that a camera somehow found her > > > > > > > >dancing and aired her image, two hours after the > > > > > > > >incident.....I would think there would be more > > > > > > > >pressing issues at that time,but i guess a Palestinian > > > > > > > >women supposedly dancing in the streets of > > > > > > > >Palestine,is more important than the those tens and > > > > > > > >thousands of casualties and the chaos that was > > > > > > > >happening here.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >I guess the Palestinians where just about to get there > > > > > > > >independence and your blessings, and this women came > > > > > > > >and screwed everything up for us!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >BTW, the women was kinda a heavy set, so i wouldnt > > > > > > > >realy call it "Jumping up for Joy", the poor old lady > > > > > > > >could barely walk, but she was eating sweets, which > > > > > > > >does probably translate to her as jumping up for > > > > > > > >joy!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
