> Dana wrote:
> determination. You're right Gruss. We live in a communist society ;) If I
> could send you back to pre-Industrial England, I would.
>

You're hyperbolizing my point into a caricature.  An interesting thing
happened though.  I was catching up on my NPR and yesterday's
Marketplace had a great little story on East Germany on the 15th
anniversary of re-unification.  Guess what one of the major problems
is?

They can't get some of the East Germans off the gov't dole.  It seems
they've grown dependent on money they haven't earned in the open
market after many years of communism.  They haven't learned to fend
for themselves and aren't participating in the market economy.

Sound like one giant case study in minimum wage versus empowerment to me.

http://www.publicradio.org/tools/media/player/marketplace/2005/10/03_mpp?start=00:00:19:08.0&end=00:00:23:41.0

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