I use the Cook and Campbell approach to natural type experiments in this case (see http://www.colorado.edu/ibs/pb/thornberry/socy7004/pdfs/causal_inference.pdf and http://www.colorado.edu/ibs/pb/thornberry/socy7004/pdfs/causal_inference.pdf). And Occam's Razor. Moreover the data does not support the supposed effect of prayer's healing power. After you eliminate the data fishing studies, and the poorly conducted research, what is left is all over the place. Some studies have found positive outcomes, more have found no effect, and some have found that the person actually got sicker. Ergo changes are it has no effect, except for the person praying. It may make them feel better.
On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 10:37 AM, GMoney <[email protected]> wrote: > > well yeah......but try telling that to a believer. > > Millions of people pray to God to cure their sick (insert family > member)....said family member dies anyway. > 1 person prays to God to cure their sick (insert family member).....and > he/she survives seemingly miraculously. > > the millions are forgotten, the 1 is remembered...God is great. > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 9:31 AM, Larry C. Lyons <[email protected]>wrote: > >> >> My problem is that there are just so many alternative explanations >> that are simpler and don't require divine intervention. >> >> On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 9:59 AM, GMoney <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > Yeah, the miracles can be pretty simplistic. In fact, I think I remember >> > reading about some of JP's "miracles" awhile back. So maybe the process >> has >> > already started. >> > >> > Saint or not, Karol Wojtyla (sp?) was a good man. >> > >> > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 8:37 AM, Larry C. Lyons <[email protected] >> >wrote: >> > >> >> >> >> In the canonization process (sounds like they're launching the remains >> >> with a cannon), don't they have someone who is supposed to be the >> >> official skeptic and whose job is to disprove the miracles. I think >> >> the name is Devil's Advocate. >> >> >> >> but typically the miracles are stuff like cancer being cured without >> >> other explanation that sort of thing. >> >> >> >> On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 8:50 AM, GMoney <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > That's pretty cool. >> >> > >> >> > My father in law met and shook hands with JP2, and has several items >> that >> >> > he blessed and gave to him. >> >> > >> >> > I don't have any doubt that he will some day be canonized. There was >> lots >> >> > of talk of miracles while he was still alive. >> >> > >> >> > (The "miracles" clause for canonization always amused me a little bit. >> >> The >> >> > Catholics laud the story of Doubting Thomas...and emphasize Jesus' >> credo >> >> of >> >> > "blessed are they who have not seen, yet believe". And yet...to crown >> a >> >> > saint....they gotta see miracles baby!) >> >> > >> >> > On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 7:33 PM, Scott Stroz <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> I don't think there will be another JP2 in our life time. >> >> >> >> >> >> Interesting (to me) side note. The former pastor at the church my >> wife >> >> >> attends gave me a rosary that was blessed by JP2 and was actually >> given >> >> to >> >> >> him by the Pope during his last public visit before he died. If he >> ever >> >> >> gets canonized, these would be considered a 2nd hand relic. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 10:34 AM, GMoney <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I never liked the guy......i'm predisposed to dislike popes as it >> >> >> is....but >> >> >> > JP 2 was a terrific force for good and peace around the world, i >> >> >> > thought....he was a good example of the capacity for good that the >> >> office >> >> >> > of pope can have. JP focused on helping children and reaching out >> to >> >> >> other >> >> >> > religions. He never condoned violence of any kind....he met with >> Bush >> >> >> > immediately after 9/11 and asked him not to retaliate violently. He >> >> took >> >> >> up >> >> >> > positions of peace and forgiveness even in matters where neither >> were >> >> >> > realistically possible....such as 9/11. He even forgave the guy who >> >> shot >> >> >> > him! >> >> >> > >> >> >> > i think that's exactly what the leader of 2+ billions people who >> >> purport >> >> >> to >> >> >> > support the teachings of Jesus Christ...should do. I hope the >> >> catholics >> >> >> > elect themselves another JP2. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Larry C. Lyons < >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> > >wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > I heard it was his Hitler Youth background finally catching up >> with >> >> >> him. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Larry C. Lyons < >> >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> > > >wrote: >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > 85 >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 9:50 AM, Bruce Sorge <[email protected] >> > >> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> The guy is 91. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> Sent from my iPhone 4S. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> On Feb 11, 2013, at 9:48 AM, Cameron Childress < >> >> [email protected]> >> >> >> > > >> wrote: >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > Conspiracy? >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > -Cameron >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > .... >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> >> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:360847 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
