You may be right tim, but there may be quite a few casualties in the mean time.
larry At 09:08 AM 3/10/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Ok, > Here's how I am thinking about it. The framers of our form of >government intended our last recourse against the federal government >descending into tyranny as the armed citizen. Revolt was almost an expected >part of the American ideal. Now by making it possible to loose your >citizenship, you would remove some of the impetus to revolt, if after your >do so, not only are you found guilty of the crime, but your no longer even a >citizen. > > I also see your point. I mean tie it into dissent. Say I send >money (never would, but I should be able to) to a Palestinian refugee >organization, which unbeknownst to me is a front for some terrorist group. >So now I can go to prison and have my citizenship removed. Insane. > > I hate to say it but I am seriously having to reconsider some of my >support for our current foreign affairs policies, in light of the decrease >of civil rights inside this country. What's funny is prior to Sept. 11th I >really had a positive outlook, politically. I mean support for libertarian >causes was way up. People were talking about privacy issues, the drug war, >property and tax issues. It really felt as though things were heading >towards a more free nation. Now things are becoming more restrictive every >day, and it's kind of scary. > > Oh well, we'll see where it goes. Remember almost all of the old >un-American activities laws were either removed from the books, or ruled >unconstitutional. Maybe this will be just another bubble in history, and in >5 or 10 years things will get back on track. > >Tim - the eternal optimist :) > >-----Original Message----- >From: Larry C. Lyons [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 11:49 AM >To: CF-Community >Subject: RE: Patriot Act II > > >What also bothers me about this proposed law is the arbitrary nature of it. >If, for example, you contribute to an orphanage that may get some of its >money from a group declared as a terrorist organization, you can have your >citizenship removed for a charitable act. Moreover, since its the >government declaring a group a terrorist organization, what's to stop it >from declaring the opposing party a terrorist organization and >disenfranchising all those who voted for the opposition. > >larry > >At 07:46 AM 3/10/2003 -0500, you wrote: > >I wasn't aware that the constitution made any provision for removing your > >citizenship. I mean how can you even do that? We don't even do it to >those > >convicted of treason. > > > >Tim > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 1:49 PM > >To: CF-Community > >Subject: Patriot Act II > > > > > >http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/03/06/findlaw.analysis.mariner.patriotII/index. >h > >tml > > > >So what does everyone think of this law? > >I find this disturbing > > > >Among Patriot II's most worrying provisions are those affecting >citizenship. > >Section 501 of the bill, deceptively titled "Expatriation of Terrorists," > >would provide for the presumptive denationalization of American citizens >who > >support the activities of any organization that the executive branch has > >deemed "terrorist." While it is already illegal to provide material support > >to such groups, even for their lawful activities, such support is >considered > >grounds only for criminal prosecution, not for the loss of citizenship. > > > > > >-- > >Bill Wheatley > >Senior Database Developer > >Macromedia Advanced Coldfusion 5 Developer > >Ediets.com > >ICQ - 417645 > >Aim - Bill Ediets > >954-360-9022 x159 > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribe&forumid=5 Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5
