well we know that the most W can f'up the country is 8 years unless the little sharp toothed dick cheney decides he wants to be president and takes over ;) ----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 9:08 AM Subject: RE: Patriot Act II
Ok, Here's how I am thinking about it. The framers of our form of government intended our last recourse against the federal government descending into tyranny as the armed citizen. Revolt was almost an expected part of the American ideal. Now by making it possible to loose your citizenship, you would remove some of the impetus to revolt, if after your do so, not only are you found guilty of the crime, but your no longer even a citizen. I also see your point. I mean tie it into dissent. Say I send money (never would, but I should be able to) to a Palestinian refugee organization, which unbeknownst to me is a front for some terrorist group. So now I can go to prison and have my citizenship removed. Insane. I hate to say it but I am seriously having to reconsider some of my support for our current foreign affairs policies, in light of the decrease of civil rights inside this country. What's funny is prior to Sept. 11th I really had a positive outlook, politically. I mean support for libertarian causes was way up. People were talking about privacy issues, the drug war, property and tax issues. It really felt as though things were heading towards a more free nation. Now things are becoming more restrictive every day, and it's kind of scary. Oh well, we'll see where it goes. Remember almost all of the old un-American activities laws were either removed from the books, or ruled unconstitutional. Maybe this will be just another bubble in history, and in 5 or 10 years things will get back on track. Tim - the eternal optimist :) -----Original Message----- From: Larry C. Lyons [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 11:49 AM To: CF-Community Subject: RE: Patriot Act II What also bothers me about this proposed law is the arbitrary nature of it. If, for example, you contribute to an orphanage that may get some of its money from a group declared as a terrorist organization, you can have your citizenship removed for a charitable act. Moreover, since its the government declaring a group a terrorist organization, what's to stop it from declaring the opposing party a terrorist organization and disenfranchising all those who voted for the opposition. larry At 07:46 AM 3/10/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I wasn't aware that the constitution made any provision for removing your >citizenship. I mean how can you even do that? We don't even do it to those >convicted of treason. > >Tim > >-----Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 1:49 PM >To: CF-Community >Subject: Patriot Act II > > >http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/03/06/findlaw.analysis.mariner.patriotII/index. h >tml > >So what does everyone think of this law? >I find this disturbing > >Among Patriot II's most worrying provisions are those affecting citizenship. >Section 501 of the bill, deceptively titled "Expatriation of Terrorists," >would provide for the presumptive denationalization of American citizens who >support the activities of any organization that the executive branch has >deemed "terrorist." While it is already illegal to provide material support >to such groups, even for their lawful activities, such support is considered >grounds only for criminal prosecution, not for the loss of citizenship. > > >-- >Bill Wheatley >Senior Database Developer >Macromedia Advanced Coldfusion 5 Developer >Ediets.com >ICQ - 417645 >Aim - Bill Ediets >954-360-9022 x159 > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribe&forumid=5 Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5
