No problem, John. Black-and-white words don't convey inflections or emotions attached as everyone well knows. Like I noted, once you get past the Off/On function, my electrical skills go downhill pretty fast. LOL. I know both solenoids still must be in a functioning capacity but my take on the Ford solenoid 'solution' is to take some burden off the GM one in a hot start situation.
I draw an analogy similar to using relays to energize headlamps, electric fans/fuel pumps, etc. where the end item still has to be able to function and it's a matter of how the energy gets there to make it function. It's all pretty much Greek to me and there are numerous solutions to the hot start problem. I used the Summit kit for a couple of reasons other than the hot start problem. One, I could 'bump' the engine over with a bumper switch by using the connections on the remote solenoid and two, I wired the R terminal connection to a junction block so I could disconnect it at the block instead of on the GM solenoid whenever I needed to drop the starter; the battery cable was easy enough to get to to take off/on when working on the starter but the R post was tight and my running it to a junction block I could leave it on the GM solenoid all the time and simply disconnect/connect it at the junction block when needed. Dale McIntosh ChevelleCD.com ChevelleStuff.com -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Nasta Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2007 10:08 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Chevelle-list] starter & starter wiring Hi Dale, Thanks for the links and please understand that I was not trying to criticize you. All I'm saying is that with either wiring method, the original solenoid still has to work. Otherwise you are just passing current to a switched point where the switch is dead. The Nova sites' method really accomplishes nothing, because all the first solenoid does is pass the current along as if you had it hooked up the old way. So, you pass 12V to the BAT and S terminals on the starter, and if you're lucky your starter will work as normal after that. With the Summit/MAD way, you at least eliminate the small wire(s) at the starter. Those wires often get burned and they are another thing to deal with from under the car when changing a starter. With the Summit/MAD way, you jumper from the BAT terminal to the S terminal on the starter so that as soon as current is passed to the BAT terminal it also goes to the S, but w/o as much length of small-gauge wire. As we know, DC current doesn't travel well over long thin wires. Also with this method, the large battery cable from the solenoid to the starter is dead unless the solenoid is activated. This is kind of nice because if your large cable does burn, at least you don't short out the battery (until the next time you try to start it). Also you can drop the starter w/o disconnecting the positive battery-to-solenoid cable, which is one less thing to have to do when changing a starter. With either method, the original solenoid still has to work though. This statement from MAD: > The problem occurs because the large solenoid on > the GM starter draws 40 to 50 amps at the moment the key is turned to > "START." And that large amount of current must flow through a very lengthy > circuit, from the battery to the dash area. Through dash wiring and > switches, back out through the under-hood wiring, finally to the starter. is not true. The whole point of the solenoid is that it is an electromagnetic switch. The switch itself draws much less current than the starter motor. The switch is also not electrically connected to the starter motor. That is why it can be serviced via a smaller wire. A small amount of current goes from the battery, through the ignition switch and the neutral safety switch to activate the electromagnet in the solenoid, which closes the circuit to allow the 12V that is coming through the big cable to get to the starter motor. "That large amount of current" does not travel through the dash. If it did, you would need a cable as fat as your battery cable passing through your dash, and you would need heavy duty ignition & neutral safety switches. You also would not need the fat cable going directly from the battery to the starter. The only thing that passes through the dash is the small amount of current that it takes to operate the solenoid (switch). I see no benefit from the Nova sites' method. The MAD/Summit way at least cuts down on the length of small-gauge wire and keeps that wire away from the heat. It also makes the big lead to the BAT terminal dead unless the solenoid is activated, which can be handy. Remember that either way, the solenoid on the starter has to work. Otherwise you are just passing current to an open switch. The MAD kit comes w/ a small plate to jumper the BAT & S terminals, which may conduct more amperage or be less susceptible to heat than wire. There is a limit to what size wire you can get to fit on those small terminals. HTH, John _____ avast! Antivirus <http://www.avast.com> : Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 071027-0, 10/27/2007 Tested on: 10/28/2007 11:14:25 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2007 ALWIL Software.
