I know Myra, been there - done that several times over the years, but still I say that you are only competing against the other best of breeds of the day presumably of similar quality although that can be debatable also sometimes.VBG
Annette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Myra Savant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 1:22 AM Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious > To begin with Annette, if you are competing in the toy group ring, you have > already beaten the 30 cavaliers, including the six month old roached backed, > cowhocked bitch puppy with a straight shoulder. When you go into the Toy > Group Ring, you are competing against other dogs who have Best of Breed that > day, not the winners of the classes. Myra > > > >From: Annette Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Reply-To: The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel List > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious > >Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 23:11:00 -0000 > > > >VBG correction Myra you are only competing against the winners of the > >classes - i.e. one from each breed. I forget how many there are in the Toy > >group in the US but lets say 20 - so you have a twenty to one chance in the > >group against 30 to one in the breed of taking BOB > > > >Annette > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Myra Savant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:32 PM > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious > > > > > > > Annette, I agree with you. But....I wasn't talking about specialty > >shows. > > > I was talking about AKC shows, and the number is never anywhere near as > > > large. A good sized AKC show here may have 30 cavaliers entered and > >that > >is > > > the total for all classes and includes both genders. That is why I said > > > that a class win is not as meaningful as the breed win which is followed > >by > > > being shown in the toy group ring. The class win, which you may have > >won > >by > > > competing against 4-5 cavaliers is not as meaningful as a win in the > >group > > > ring where you have essentially competed against several hundred other > >toy > > > dogs. Myra > > > > > > > > > >From: Annette Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >Reply-To: The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel List > > > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious > > > >Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 20:55:43 -0000 > > > > > > > >Sorry Myra I disagree! VBG It's at breed level the real competition is > >- > >if > > > >you beat a couple of hundred others of the same breed to me that is far > > > >better than beating one of every other breed in the Toy group. There it > > > >boils down very much to the knowledge of the judge and at the end of > >the > > > >day > > > >his/her personal preference - nothing to do with structure or movement > >- > > > >there are other breeds that have exactly the same problems or similar > >at > > > >any > > > >rate. > > > > > > > >Annette > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Myra Savant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 5:57 PM > > > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious > > > > > > > > > > > > > Look, everybody knows I am an idiot, and there are many things that > >I > > > >don't > > > > > know. However, this is something to ponder. The real "showing" > >isn't > > > >done > > > > > at a class level. It is done at a group level. For too many years, > > > > > cavaliers were judged in sort of a vacumn because they were judged > >only > > > > > against each other. It was almost like 'just go for the pretty head > > > >because > > > > > all the rear ends are so bad.' So, they didn't have to develop that > > > >kind > > > >of > > > > > structure that they needed to compete with a poodle, for instance. > >It > > > >is > > > > > important to remember that they are dogs. They need to be built > >like > >a > > > >dog. > > > > > They need to move like a well-built dog. Now for the last several > > > >years, > > > > > they have had to compete against other toy dogs in the group ring. > > > >Sure, > > > >we > > > > > see dogs in the ring that shouldn't be there. I've probably shown a > > > >couple > > > > > myself. I probably will again in the future just because of > >ignorance > > > >or > > > > > just because I feel like doing it. However.....those dogs will not > >ever > > > > > compete in a group ring. They will take their little ribbon home > >and > > > >they > > > > > may even make up their championship. They will not, however succeed > >in > > > >the > > > > > group ring. Also....if a dog places in group, you can no longer use > >the > > > > > excuse that it won because it was professionally handled. The huge > > > >majority > > > > > of dogs in the group ring are professionally handled. Not > >all....but > > > >the > > > > > majority. I'm not sure exactly what motivates me to show my dogs. > >I > > > >know > > > > > for sure it isn't greed. I guess it could be ego. The feeling I > >get > > > >when > > > > > one of my dogs wins in group, or Best Puppy in show or something > >like > > > >that > > > > > is the same feeling I used to get when my children performed at a > >piano > > > > > recital or something. I just feel proud of them, and I feel just a > > > >little > > > > > bit like bragging on them. Certainly not money motivated and not > >even > > > > > particularly fun. When my dog is in the show ring, I am very > >stressed > > > >about > > > > > it. I get very nervous. I'm so afraid he will make a mistake. > >Just > > > > > exactly like it was at the piano recital. So, is that Ego? I don't > > > > > honestly know. Myra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > > > > > http://www.hotmail.com > > > > > > > > > > ========================================================= > > > > > "Magic Commands": > > > > > to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: > > > > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL > > > > > to start it up gain click here: > > > > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > > > > > > > > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. > > > > > Search the Archives... > >http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > > > > > > > > > > All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original > >author. > > > > > > > > > > > > >========================================================= > > > >"Magic Commands": > > > >to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: > > > >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL > > > >to start it up gain click here: > > > >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > > > > > > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. > > > >Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > > > > > > > >All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original > >author. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Myra Savant Gardengate Cavaliers > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. > > > > > > ========================================================= > > > "Magic Commands": > > > to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: > > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL > > > to start it up gain click here: > > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > > > > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. > > > Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > > > > > > All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author. > > > >========================================================= > >"Magic Commands": > >to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: > >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL > >to start it up gain click here: > >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. > >Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > > > >All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author. > > > > > Myra Savant Gardengate Cavaliers > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com > > ========================================================= > "Magic Commands": > to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL > to start it up gain click here: > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. > Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > > All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author. > ========================================================= "Magic Commands": to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL to start it up gain click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. 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