Really, there isn't a second exit solution short of buying one of the adjacent buildings and having the lots combined or joining the structures. The only place a second door could be located is on the same facade as the current door, which is a 21' wide row house.
Jerome, I always appreciate your architectural insights, be it structural or sound-reduction or a myriad of other areas, but I think we're veering away from the message thread a bit. My anecdote was hopefully to illustrate that fire code can still be adhered to and occupancy levels increased beyond the 100 sqft/person, but it might take some creativity that isn't natively found in the code department at city hall. I owe you a drink when I see you at GCUC as a small thanks for all the help you've provided me over the years. :) *Glen Ferguson* Phone: 301-732-5165 Email: [email protected] <[email protected]> Website: http://coworkfrederick.com Address: 122 E Patrick St, Frederick, MD 21701 On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 11:47 AM, Jerome Chang <[email protected]> wrote: > There's another potential detail, that the 2nd door be certain 1/3 > diagonal distance away from the 1st door. Was that considered? > > Jerome > > On Mar 31, 2015, at 8:38 AM, Glen Ferguson <[email protected]> > wrote: > > I'm not sure if this was discussed but a simple 2nd door would've >> typically allowed occupancy to be above 49 people. > > > Jerome, it was, I just omitted some of the details to keep from being too > wordy. We also looked at an auxiliary pump with 1500 gal storage tank in > the basement to supplement sprinkler water flow, but that was too out there > and unheard of for the city. > > We only have a single exit door to a public area. We're landlocked on the > other 3 sides by private property. That's also a limitation that keeps us > from solving our lack of handicap access. Well, that and being in the > historic district both present an interesting set of constraints to work > with. Though in all, we're really pleased with our location and the > solutions we've come up with. > > > *Glen Ferguson* > Phone: 301-732-5165 > Email: [email protected] <http://[email protected]> > Website: http://coworkfrederick.com > Address: 122 E Patrick St, Frederick, MD 21701 > > On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 10:43 AM, Jerome Chang <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> I'm not sure if this was discussed but a simple 2nd door would've >> typically allowed occupancy to be above 49 people. >> >> >> Jerome >> >> On Mar 31, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Glen Ferguson <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> After many meetings with our architect and making sure he knew our usage >> plans - for example, our community room would be used for events and might >> only have chairs or standing room only - he dumped the project on one of >> his staff and told him "draw up this office." We were pretty surprised to >> discover the plans they submitted to the city stipulated 100 sqft/person >> with a max occupancy of 19 people for the entire building. Needless to say, >> we won't ever be using that architect again. >> >> We met with the city fire inspector several times and he wasn't an "out >> of the box" type of thinker, so we hired our own fire safety engineer to >> design a solution to present to the city. Part of the solution was as >> simple as adding a bookshelf/serving table in our community room to reduce >> occupiable space, the rest were relatively inexpensive modifications to the >> sprinkler system - far less expensive than the city's "suggestion" that we >> dig up the street and put in a larger water line. >> >> The end result was the city fire inspector could save face by accepting a >> plan another licensed engineer had signed off on, we can have up to 47 >> people in our event space and that's not including the other rooms, and we >> kept the costs low enough that we didn't abandon the project completely. >> >> >> *Glen Ferguson* >> Phone: 301-732-5165 >> Email: [email protected] <http://[email protected]> >> Website: http://coworkfrederick.com >> Address: 122 E Patrick St, Frederick, MD 21701 >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 8:32 PM, Jerome Chang <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> Building code inspectors are typically different from fire code >>> inspectors. >>> They also typically have different requirements. >>> How/when a fire inspector visits is less likely after passing initial >>> certificate of occupancy. >>> So my guess is that few coworking spaces and few any spaces are flagged, >>> unless you typically have a lot of very large events. >>> I realize that coworking spaces do have events, but fire inspectors >>> typically visit more typical event venues - not “office spaces”. >>> >>> >>> *JEROME CHANG* >>> >>> *WEST: Santa Monica* >>> 1450 2nd Street (@Broadway) | Santa Monica CA 90401 >>> ph: (310) 526-2255 >>> >>> *CENTRAL: Mid-Wilshire* >>> 5405 Wilshire Blvd (2 blocks west of La Brea) | Los Angeles CA 90036 >>> ph: (323) 330-9505 >>> >>> *EAST: Downtown* >>> 529 S. Broadway, Suite 4000 (@Pershing Square) | Los Angeles CA 90013 >>> ph: (213) 550-2235 >>> >>> >>> <yelp-s.png> <http://www.yelp.com/biz/blankspaces-los-angeles> >>> <twitter-bird3-square.png> <https://twitter.com/BLANKSPACES> >>> <facebook-logo-square.png> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/pages/BLANKSPACES/132257631339> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/pages/BLANKSPACES/132257631339> >>> <linkedin-logo-square2.png> >>> <http://www.linkedin.com/company/blankspaces?trk=top_nav_home> >>> <vimeo-s.png> <http://vimeo.com/blankspaces> >>> <http://vimeo.com/blankspaces> >>> On Mar 30, 2015, at 4:46 PM, Brian Ahmes <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Interesting, so have any coworking spaces been flagged for too many >>> occupants by the fire marshall? >>> >>> thanks for the response. >>> >>> On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 6:30:56 PM UTC-5, Jerome wrote: >>>> >>>> City codes and even landlords are still catching up to understand how >>>> we use our space. >>>> So in the meantime, you should submit to them whatever they need to >>>> certify that your drawings comply w/ codes. >>>> Does this mean showing/not showing furniture? Possibly. Note that city >>>> codes are more concerned about permanently affixed items like walls - not >>>> typically furniture that can be moved/relocated. >>>> >>>> >>>> *JEROME CHANG* >>>> >>>> *WEST: Santa Monica* >>>> 1450 2nd Street (@Broadway) | Santa Monica CA 90401 >>>> ph: (310) 526-2255 >>>> >>>> *CENTRAL: Mid-Wilshire* >>>> 5405 Wilshire Blvd (2 blocks west of La Brea) | Los Angeles CA 90036 >>>> ph: (323) 330-9505 >>>> >>>> *EAST: Downtown* >>>> 529 S. Broadway, Suite 4000 (@Pershing Square) | Los Angeles CA 90013 >>>> ph: (213) 550-2235 >>>> >>>> >>>> <http://www.yelp.com/biz/blankspaces-los-angeles> >>>> <https://twitter.com/BLANKSPACES> >>>> <https://www.facebook.com/pages/BLANKSPACES/132257631339> >>>> <https://www.facebook.com/pages/BLANKSPACES/132257631339> >>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/company/blankspaces?trk=top_nav_home> >>>> <http://vimeo.com/blankspaces> >>>> <http://vimeo.com/blankspaces> >>>> On Mar 30, 2015, at 2:53 PM, Brian Ahmes <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hey there, >>>> let me continue with asking about the building occupancy amount. >>>> Based on the city, a building with a Business or Mercantile Use type has a >>>> square footage per occupant defined? My city states 100sf per person, even >>>> though I can have a space zppx 50sf with a chair and desk. How are >>>> coworking spaces getting around city codes and occupancy? Just not show >>>> the furniture in the city permit plans and add later? Any insight would be >>>> great, because 100sf per person in a coworking space significantly reduces >>>> the # of members. >>>> >>>> thanks, brian >>>> >>>> On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 4:37:10 PM UTC-5, Piper Hood wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Thank you Aaron and Jerome. That is helpful. Any input on what >>>>> percentage you can sell over the spaces you have accounting for people not >>>>> using the space regularly? >>>>> >>>>> On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 12:38:48 PM UTC-4, Aaron Cruikshank wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Piper, >>>>>> >>>>>> 40 sqft per desk seems reasonable. Just make sure you're measuring >>>>>> out common areas. Most spaces have 25-30% set aside for meeting rooms, >>>>>> lounges, kitchenettes, hallways, phone booths, etc... >>>>>> >>>>>> - Aaron >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________ >>>>>> Aaron Cruikshank >>>>>> Principal, CRUIKSHANK >>>>>> Phone: 778.908.4560 >>>>>> email: [email protected] >>>>>> web: cruikshank.me >>>>>> twitter: @cruikshank >>>>>> book a meeting: doodle.com/cruikshank >>>>>> linkedin: linkedin.com/in/cruikshank >>>>>> On Mar 30, 2015 9:35 AM, "'Piper Hood' via Coworking" < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I am in the process of leasing space for a new coworking business. >>>>>>> Is there any industry standard for # SQ Ft needed per person? For >>>>>>> example, >>>>>>> I am thinking 40 square feet for each seat I can sell (averaged out for >>>>>>> shared, dedicated desk and mini office suites), so a 4,000 square foot >>>>>>> space would allow me to sell 100 memberships. Also, is there a >>>>>>> standard # >>>>>>> or percentage you can oversell by? Thanks for any help for the newbie! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Coworking" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> -- >> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Coworking" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Coworking" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > -- > Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Coworking" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
