Tom, as an opening remark, I wasn't suggesting that my own speculation was
in any way realistic in the current environment. That said...
One problem with your experiments is the way you're talking about "wages".
When I was talking about wages going higher, I did not imagine more SUVs.
What I was imagining was that work (or welfare but NOT revenues from
capital) would be paid better per hour (or "per effort" if the imaginary societal
transformation includes a transformation of working conditions). This could
very well mean less consumption because not only in this thought experiment
the wasteful minority would not be in a position to waste anymore but also
because people would probably choose to work less. Working less also
means less traffic, less consumption of time-sparing devices, etc.
Do you have an idea of the waste generated by the bosses and the rentiers? It
seems that it's a significant portion of our countries' populations. Do you have
an idea of the waste generated by excessive advertising, packaging, etc.
which is IMO caused by excess profits? Do you have an idea of the waste
generated by gross capital misallocations caused by the all-out quest for
profit? I don't. If anyone had figures, it would be nice to share it.
You see, Tom, wages are not a function of the natural ressources consumed,
as evidenced by internation comparaisons between living standards and
ressource consumption. But they are not independent either, granted. There
are many ways to reduce consumption of natural ressources without hurting
living standards (depending on your value judgements determining your
definition of living standards of course). I too think that the world population has
to go down quickly and will go down anyway except that my outlook is not as
catastrophic as yours.
I'll add that in my mind the question was not wages now compared to wages in
25 years but rather wages next year under capitalism as opposed to wages
next year under an alternative. IMO, we'll be also do better without the current
flavour of capitalism when the big crisis hits.
Disclaimer: I have talked of wages as if they were the equivalent of purchasing
power, which is of course not the case. Replace wages by purchasing power.
I'm obviously also evading the problem of the compared values of different
things but I think that it doesn't matter much at this level of generality as long as
we all have sane ideas of value (unlinke: a car's value is a function of its
weight).
Also, you seem to think that there exists some kind of united global market. I
don't think this is true. There is world markets but most of what is consumed in
today's world does not go through these markets. So I was not imagining
"fractionalization", whatever that means.
>3) Now try to imagine wages increasing in the face of the ecosystem
>disintegration that ultimatly comes as the payoff of "global capitalism":
There you have a point. Long term, it would indeed be better for "wages" to
get rid of capitalism altogether now. Again, I was talking short term.
>Julien, you can deal out my punishment.
What do you mean?
Waiting for a "Conquest of Bread" for our times,
Julien
The idea of the people will be to provide bread for all. And while middle-class
citizens, and workmen infested with middle-class ideas admire their own
rhetoric in the "Talking Shops," and "practical people" are engaged in
endless discussions on forms of government, we, the "Utopian dreamers" - we
shall have to consider the question of daily bread.
- Kropotkin
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