Hi Simon,
On 3 February 2016 at 23:47, Simon Spero <[email protected]> wrote: > The mechanism that is provided is pretty awful. > Agree :-) > Here is a reified statement. > > _:x a rdf:Statement, > rdf:subject :foo, > rdf:predicate :property, > rdf:object :bar . > > This does *not* entail > :foo :property :bar. > Yes, but if I understand that this entails :foo :property :bar, I can also teach my software to understand also :-) Dan > -------- > > [1] > http://isites.harvard.edu/fs/docs/icb.topic638346.files/Davidson1967.pdf > > [2] > http://www.oxfordscholarship.com/view/10.1093/0199246270.001.0001/acprof-9780199246274 > > [3] > https://books.google.com/books/about/Actions_and_Events.html?id=Tjl6QgAACAAJ&source=kp_cover > On Feb 3, 2016 2:02 PM, "Dan Matei" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Despite the fact that I'm always told that reification is not recomanded, >> I decided to "piser contre le vent" :-) >> >> Functionally, the reification is just natural. Proof: the "invention" of >> .1 properties in CRM. >> >> Aaa, if the formalisms we have do not handle it well, please invent a >> suitable formalism, my dear friends. >> >> Dan >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Dan Matei >> consultant (documentaristică, biblioteci digitale), >> Fundația Gellu Naum, >> [Institutul Național al Patrimoniului] >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: martin <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2016 20:09:26 +0200 >> Subject: Re: [Crm-sig] Modelling .1 properties >> >> > Dear Simon, >> > >> > Our messages crossed, your analysis is correct! We have discussed >> > however, that reification or annotation is not recommended, rather an >> > introduction of a node (class) representing a triary property rather >> than >> > an individual entity. From the existence of an instance of >> > PC14_carried_out_by we can automatically infer >> > the instance of P14, as described in the formalization. >> > >> > All the best, >> > >> > martin >> > >> > On 3/2/2016 7:55 μμ, Simon Spero wrote: >> > > >> > > The first order formalization given in the crm document are: >> > > >> > > P14(x,y,z) ⊃ [P14(x,y) ∧ E55(z)] >> > > >> > > Note that the predicate on the left hand side has three arguments, >> > > which is more arguments than rdf is comfortable with. >> > > >> > > The "in the role of" property is modifying an instance of a "carried >> > > out by" property. >> > > An activity can be carried out by several different agents, each in a >> > > different role, so the property cannot be attached directly to the >> > > activity. >> > > >> > > There are several possible ways of representing this using semantic >> > > web tools. >> > > >> > > The first approach is to use RDF reification. I am not going to say >> > > anything more about this. >> > > >> > > If you are using OWL 2, you can add an annotation each "carried out >> > > by" property assertion. This is not ideal, as annotations are not >> > > really supposed to be part of the data in the model, and most >> > > reasoners ignore them. They are also not easy to work with in RDF. >> > > >> > > A third approach is to define your own class for reification, >> > > representing an instance of a "carrying out" ; this class would have >> > > properties relating the activity, the agent, and the role. >> > > >> > > The best approach may be to define a sub property of P14 for each type >> > > of carrying out in a role which is relevant to your model. >> > > You can specify the role associated with all uses of this property >> > > using a property whose subject is the subproperty. >> > > >> > > Simon >> > > >> > > On Feb 3, 2016 10:01 AM, "Allison Miller" >> > > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > > Hello, >> > > >> > > I wish to use the CIDOC CRM but need a formal model to do so and >> > > have a question concerning .1 properties. >> > > >> > > eg. E7 Activity has: P14 carried out by (performed): E39 Actor and >> > > (P14.1 in the role of: E55 Type) >> > > >> > > It is a property I need to use - but I can’t work out how to >> model it! >> > > >> > > I thought I could use the Erlangen OWL implementation, but I can’t >> > > find these properties in it. (That’s not to claim they aren’t >> > > there, my knowledge of OWL is limited.) >> > > >> > > I would welcome any guidance on P14.1, and other .1 properties, in >> > > the Erlangen implementation, or advice on including them in a >> > > definition compatible with Semantic Web technologies if anyone has >> > > done this. >> > > >> > > Kind regards, >> > > >> > > Alli >> > > >> > > E-mail: [email protected] >> > > <mailto:[email protected]> >> > > >> > > Web: www.sysemia.com <http://www.sysemia.com/> >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sysemia Limited >> > > >> > > The Innovation Centre, Bristol & Bath Science Park, Dirac >> > > Crescent, Emerson's Green, Bristol BS16 7FR >> > > >> > > Registered in England and Wales. Company Number: 7555456 >> > > >> > > DISCLAIMER >> > > >> > > Information contained in this e-mail is intended for the use of >> > > the addressee only, and is confidential and may also be >> > > privileged. 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Sysemia Ltd have taken >> > > reasonable steps to minimise this risk, but we advise that any >> > > attachments are virus checked before they are opened. >> > > >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Crm-sig mailing list >> > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >> > > http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Crm-sig mailing list >> > > [email protected] >> > > http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > -------------------------------------------------------------- >> > Dr. Martin Doerr | Vox:+30(2810)391625 | >> > Research Director | Fax:+30(2810)391638 | >> > | Email: [email protected] | >> > | >> > Center for Cultural Informatics | >> > Information Systems Laboratory | >> > Institute of Computer Science | >> > Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH) | >> > | >> > N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton, | >> > GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece | >> > | >> > Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl | >> > -------------------------------------------------------------- >> > >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Crm-sig mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig >> > > _______________________________________________ > Crm-sig mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ics.forth.gr/mailman/listinfo/crm-sig > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Dan Matei consultant (documentaristică, biblioteci digitale), Fundația Gellu Naum, [Institutul Național al Patrimoniului]
