On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 00:55:51 GMT Aaron Sloman <a.slo...@cs.bham.ac.uk> wrote:
> [Suspected solution to input problem below.] > > Responding to: sl...@troubleshooters.com: > > Thanks Steve, > > I've accidentally stumbled across a solution to one of my main > problems: a replacement for invoking the old NetworkManager connection > panel provided via gnome-control-center. > > For some reason I had previously been unaware of these two: > > nmcli > nm-connection-editor > > They now allow me both to select network connections and to edit them. I > can easily invoke them from the command line or a ctwm menu. They seem > to provide everything I need more conveniently than the old mechanisms > invoked via gnome-control-center. > > Regarding your recommendation to give up Fedora: I have tried other > systems from time to time, including ubuntu, crunchbang and arch but > always returned to fedora, partly because of familiarity (I started > with Redhat 6 around 1999 with my first Dell D400(?) laptop) and partly > because I found some things much cleaner in Fedora than alternatives -- > e.g. the location of 32 bit libraries is where they have always been > > /usr/lib > > and the 64 bit libraries are in > /usr/lib64 > > In contrast when I tried using ubuntu for a while, I found the system > incomprehensible. I don't know if all debian-based systems are like > that. > > Yes: the need to upgrade fedora occurs too frequently for me. I normally > skip one or two generations at a time. I could reduce the frequency of > change by switching to CentOS or Scientific Linux, both of which have > been used in my department. > > If I gave up fedora, the first thing I would try would be Arch, because > it avoids the discontinuous version changes of fedora, and its > documentation seems to be superior to documentation provided by all the > others. I often end up getting answers to my fedora questions from Arch > web pages. Another possibility would be CentOS, or possibly Scientific > Linux. Neither changes so frequently. > > Re: systemd > > I also strongly disliked it when it first arrived, when I was used to > managing the 'rc' directories, but I've got used to systemd now. > > E.g. I found the simplest way to suppress bluetooth was to remove some > systemd links, though I think bluetooth firmware still gets loaded at > boot. > > Re: keyboard/mousepad input problem on laptop > > My main remaining problem with F27 now is the strange keyboard/mousepad > behaviour on my Stone/Clevo laptop. The internet now shows a number of > linux users reporting difficulties with input via laptop keypads or > mouse pads, after boot, after hibernate, or after suspend, although > external usb mouse or keyboard works perfectly. There may be different > causes at work. > > My problem seems to be connected with the synaptics firmware, including > a "secret" (buggy?) keylogger, which I suspect may have been programmed > to go into a sleep mode after a fixed time if no keyboard/mousepad > activity has been detected, and which can be awakened only by > suspend+resume in my case). > > A user reporting a problem like mine mentioned that HP had provided a > bios update that fixed the problem. See comments 13 and 14 here: > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1508892 > > The "hidden keylogger" in the synaptics code is reported here > https://thehackernews.com/2017/12/hp-laptop-keylogger.html?m=1 > > and here: > https://support.hp.com/us-en/document/c05827409 > HPSBHF03564 rev 2 - Synaptics Touchpad Driver Potential, Local Loss > of Confidentiality > > I've initiated a request for information about bios updates available > for my Stonebook mini (re-badged Clevo W515LU) through our IT services > people. (I have to be careful not to do anything that could violate my > 5 year warranty.) > > All of this raises questions about what linux was doing (perhaps what > libinput was doing?) up to kernel 4.8.6-300 which worked (and still > works) without any of these problems, at least on my laptop, But why > does it go wrong in the later versions I have tried (in F25 and F27) up > to > > 4.14.18-300.fc27.x86_64 #1 SMP Thu Feb 8 01:35:31 UTC 2018 > > I've not stuck with 4.8.6-300 because screen handling is not so good,and > there are no longer updates for F25. > > I tried going back to an earlier version of libinput instead but that > made no difference. (I am mostly ignorant about all the relevant low > level stuff involved.) > > The fact that there's no record of the timeout, or functionality being > restored, in any linux log file I've search (e.g. /var/log/messages) > seems to be consistent with the problem lying below the level of linux. > > The laptop works perfectly at all times with external (usb) mouse and/or > keyboard. And when touchpad/keyboard input is frozen I can also login > from my PC via wifi -- e.g. to work on the laptop using a larger screen. > > For now, strangely, functionality is restored (e.g. at boot when laptop > keyboard does not work) by suspend/resume using the laptop lid. > > It's bizarre. For most of the rest of the time everything works > normally -- except when the laptop goes into a powersave(?) mode after > a time and the built in input devices stop working. But suspend/resume > using the laptop lid restores the functionality. > > Very strange. > > Thanks for the dmenu suggestion. I'll look more closely after I've > caught up with other things. > > Apologies for posting all this non-ctwm stuff to a ctwm list. It may be > useful to others with non-responding laptops. > > Aaron > http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~axs > Sorry for the late reply. I am very familiar with 7 different Linux distros: OpenSuse, Knoppix, Fedora, Ubuntu, Arch, Gentoo, and Devuan. Arch tends to be very alpha and Gentoo tends to be very beta, so I would not depend on them 24/7 although you may depend on your debugging skills heavily (: (I do love them both though!) Ubuntu tends to purposefully include every binary blob that is available online. And then there is that orange theme... OpenSuse and Fedora use systemd, though OpenSuse is the nicer of the two distros IMHO. Your best bet would be Knoppix, or Devuan. Sincerely, David
