> On Oct 2, 2019, at 3:52 PM, Peter Gutmann <pgut...@cs.auckland.ac.nz> wrote:
> Paul Walsh <p...@metacert.com>​ writes:
>> I would like to see one research paper published by one browser vendor to
>> show that website identity visual indicators can not work.
> Uhhh... are you serious with that request?  You're asking for a study from a
> browser vendor, a group who in any case don't publish research papers but
> write browsers, indicating that their own UI doesn't work?

[PW] I see where you are coming from Peter. I wouldn’t expect any browser 
vendor to provide studies or evidence to explain why they’re implementing 
features. And separately, I wouldn’t expect Google to provide anything to 
anyone for any reason, because they pretty much do what they do for profit. 
Chrome dev is directed by advertising dollars, not by privacy or user safety. 

However, I'd love to think that the Mozilla team still care about the developer 
community and end users more than they care about profit [1] or following other 
browser vendors. Firefox isn’t the “leader” it was, but I still love the brand 
and cause.  

I’m sure you don’t need to be reminded that Mozilla is a foundation, but I 
personally wanted to remind myself of their core values. So with this in mind, 
I’d like to think that the team would stop and rethink decisions that have a 
massive impact on stakeholders and end-users. And when asked for some 
supporting evidence, they wouldn’t fall silent but engage in a meaningful 

It has been a long time since my team or I were involved in any way, so this 
might have changed. 

[1] https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/ <https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/>
>> I’d love you to show me the type of research I’ve asked for. I’m open to
>> learning more. I’m not new to this game. I worked on integrated browsers and
>> search engines in the 90’s at AOL.
> If it's OK to cite peer-reviewed papers from universities published at
> conferences and in journals, I can dig up a few of those.

[PW] If you ever do find the time to dig them out, please do. No pressure.

- Paul

> Peter.

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