Andreas Hartmann wrote:
Michael Wechner wrote:
[...]
How can we solve this problem?
by listening to each other and not just doing stuff with high
potential of breaking things without discussing it beforehand. This
is what really destroys a community.
IMO with a CTR policy
what exactly do you mean by CTR (there are many acronyms out there and
maybe we want to clarify this first)
every committer should decide when a change should
be discussed. Sometimes the decision can be wrong - for instance, I have
recognized that I should have discussed some of my recent changes before-
hand. But then a discussion can follow, and changes can be reverted.
some changes cannot be reverted that easily. For instance if someone is
changing the content model
and some people upgrade and spend a lot of time on this, and then it
will be reverted, what do you think
how many poeple will be frustrated in the end. And then it might change
again ...
I think it is important how the community handles such a situation.
"Breaking things" is not always a bad thing, sometimes a change just
shows
where problems exist (e.g., a change to the repository layer might show
where the layer was bypassed).
one can break things locally and then discuss it with others.
This is one of the reasons why local workspaces are a great thing.
I agree that one cannot share the local findings so easily, but this one
of the reasons why we have
the sandbox
Even the perception if something is
"broken" can depend on the point of view. E.g., IMO things are really
broken if principles like SoC or IoC are violated, or antipatterns occur.
I wouldn't call this broken and I think it's important that we agree
what a term means.
Functional bugs can be fixed, I don't consider them real problems
(at least in an unstable branch).
it depends on the siutation.
I share Thorsten's concerns about the community.
Some ideas how to improve it from my point of view:
- Stronger participation in discussions, reacting to proposals.
Even a "+-0" or "Interesting, but I have no idea" is great.
yes, this would be nice, but I am afraid these things will always slip
through sometimes
(for instance some people might be on vacation or it is weekend or they
have too much else to do and don't find
the time to work through the backlog)
People should feel encouraged to express their ideas on the list.
I have to admit that I'm rather discouraged, which unfortunately
resulted in unannounced commits.
why are you discouraged? I am very often discouraged, but that doesn't
mean I give up or that I am allowed
to hit my family. I think one should rather talk about why one is
discouraged and then there is at least the chance that
something can be changed (or mabye not)
Michi
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in
the case of others it might result in holding back ideas.
- Focusing on solutions (example: the guidelines thread).
IMO we should start with existing guidelines.
Just my $0.02 - I'm the type of person who is motivated by progress.
-- Andreas
--
Michael Wechner
Wyona - Open Source Content Management - Apache Lenya
http://www.wyona.com http://lenya.apache.org
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