On 21/09/16 13:13, Suneel Marthi wrote: > On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Tim Ellison <[email protected]> wrote: > >> On 21/09/16 11:36, Suneel Marthi wrote: >>> On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 10:43 AM, Tim Ellison <[email protected]> >> wrote: >>> >>>> On 21/09/16 02:40, Darin Johnson wrote: >>>>> Suneel, a google doc as promised, only a day late (sorry - sick kid). >>>>> >>>>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1K8E0TridC1hBfqDwWCqdZ8Dj_5_ >>>> mMrRQyynQ-Q6MFbI/edit?usp=sharing >>>>> >>>>> I was planning on working on this, but I'm going to take a day or two >> to >>>>> let others comment. >>>> >>>> Just swapping to my mentoring hat for a moment... >>>> >>>> If you are going to use non-ASF resources for project materials, you >>>> should make it clear under what terms those materials are offered. >>>> >>>> When we all discuss code and ideas on the ASF's mailing lists, JIRAs, >>>> wiki pages, etc, it is understood that these are contributions under the >>>> ALv2 for inclusion in the project; but if I point you to Pirk related >>>> material on my Google account, personal blog, or corporate website then >>>> it can become ambiguous as to how that material may be used. >>>> >>>> That's why I'm a proponent for keeping things on ASF infrastructure >>>> unless there is a big win for doing it elsewhere that justifies making >>>> the terms of that new location explicit. >>>> >>>> In this particular case, if you need the ability to simultaneously edit >>>> the document (or some other Google docs feature) then I'd advise adding >>>> an ALv2 footer [1]; otherwise why not just use our wiki? [2] >>>> >>>> [1] e.g. Licensed under the Apache License, Version 2.0. >>>> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/PIRK >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Tim >>>> >>> >>> Point noted. Between creating a Wiki page and a Google Doc, to me Google >>> doc takes a lot less time and its easier for others to comment and >> modify. >>> The Wiki has problems of its own, know all too well from having to >> approve >>> the monthly incubator reports and see how much time u spend waiting for >> the >>> login screen to show up and before u r granted access :-) >>> >>> The actual discussions are still happening on mailing lists which point >> to >>> the Google docs, so what's the issue here? If adding an ALv2 footer >> makes >>> a google doc ASF legitimate - fine. >>> >>> I pointed to an example of how Flink is doing process and feature >>> improvements which is using - project Wiki, Google Docs and all >> discussions >>> happening on mailing lists - >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/viewpage. >> action?pageId=65870673 >>> >>> There are other projects doing things similarly - projects like Kudu, and >>> others even have public slack channels. We can go and start picking on >>> every one of those and start crying foul. We can still use the old - >>> fashioned IRC channels (or its ultra modern avatars like Slack which I >>> would very much prefer). >> >> I'm no apologist for ASF infrastructure, which tends to be a lowest >> common denominator. There is always lots of discussion on the infra >> lists about moving things on. >> >> My point is that putting a link on this list to material hosted >> elsewhere does not make it a contribution. I am simply doing my mentor >> duty to ensure people are aware of that and (a) mark things as >> contributions where they are so, and (b) don't take things from >> elsewhere without checking the terms first. >> >> Of course, I'm not suggesting anything bad has occurred here. >> >> If other PMCs have less focus on this, that's for them to consider, but >> I have direct personal experience of an Apache project being part of a >> very expensive court case over its contributions so I am hyper-sensitive >> to it. >> >> Regards, >> Tim >> > > Apologies for my response. I see your point of view and concur. Would it > suffice to add an ASF legal footer to the Google doc? The Google doc lives > as long as we are hashing out the design, once implemented the Wiki would > be the permanent home and the Google doc ceases to exist.
Yes to all. I'll let Darin add it as he wrote the doc. I didn't mean this to be a big deal :-( and as this is all material that is on the list anyway it's a poor example. Regards, Tim
