But Apple has everything under their main domain apple.com. They are using
subdomains, like developer.apple.com or opensource.apple.com , no such stuff
like gnustep-desktop.org or such.
I’d prefer if we do the same, using subdomains like developer.gnustep.org and
desktop.gnustep.org and have a landing page at gnustep.org (with or without the
leading www). I am imagining a giant GNUstep logo with the words „for
developers“ and „for users“ written in white on the black side of the logo and
vice versa.
Any thoughts?
Kind regards,
Lars
> Am 11.07.2024 um 20:32 schrieb Damianos Sidiropoulos
> <[email protected]>:
>
> >
> > I think having a split website is fine, it can be made clearer, we can
> > have better working and better navigation. The only common part is the
> > painpoint: the homepage. We used the catch-all approach for years,
> > continuing to add everything so that at a glance everything is there. I
> > tried to clean it up a little, but it can be done further without fear,
> > being sure that you can read what you need.
> >
>
> GNUstep as a framework has an extremely rich set of tools in addition to the
> classes.
> If web properties were separated between a developer web site and an end user
> facing web site for a future desktop, there are a few benefits.
>
> - Each website has a distinct target audience
> - Each website will have it's own home page tailored to the needs of their
> target audience
> - It eliminates end users navigating to pages that are not relevant to them
> - This opens the opportunity to actually have multiple implementations down
> the road. NEXT style, Modern style, phone, tablet etc
> - There is more than enough content to justify a dedicated GNUstep developer
> focused site.
>
> Apple themselves have multiple implementations/platforms. They also have
> separate web sites for end users and developers. This is not by accident and
> likely for the same reasons I stated above.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 11, 2024 at 1:48 PM Ethan C <[email protected]
> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>> I had an overview of the GNUstep system at
>> https://ethanc8.github.io/Sphinx-Documentation/Reference/index.html. It's
>> unfortunately a bit outdated, but do you think this kind of index would be
>> good or do we want to organize oir docs some other way?
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2024, 12:35 Riccardo Mottola <[email protected]
>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>>> Hi ANdreas,
>>>
>>> Andreas Fink wrote:
>>> > I think the answer lays in the area of who will use the website.
>>> >
>>> > If a developer wants to use it, he will think of frameworks for his app
>>> > If a end user wants to use it, he will think of a full fledged desktop
>>> > with a lot of apps already ready to deploy.
>>>
>>> Exactly.. also there are different kind of developers. Some just want to
>>> port their app - they don't care much about project philosphy, GNU,
>>> whatever. Other choose to GNUstep core because they like it and take
>>> portability to Mac as a bonus.
>>>
>>> Also, different kind of users, some users just look at some screenshots,
>>> others, who like to dive into details can look a bit in the technical
>>> side, this is why I like them to be "one menu distance" in navigation.
>>> Distinct, but near. Like the other side of the medal.
>>>
>>> >
>>> > For me the developer is just someone using an SDK to use the
>>> > frameworks to run on the desktop. So the developer is a special user case.
>>> > If the desktop is not attractive, then the end users will not install
>>> > it, hence developers will at some point waste their time developing
>>> > for it (ignoring the fact temporarly that you can write single apps
>>> > who don't care about the desktop environment and just run on any X.org
>>> > <http://X.org <http://x.org/>> install or even without any GUI).
>>> >
>>> > For me, marketing a fully fledged desktop is the much more attractive
>>> > view. However it also means we must get a working reference
>>> > implementation into the distros. Something where when one installs XYZ
>>> > Linux, a question would appear saying "What Desktop do you want to run
>>> > on: GNOME, KDE, Gnustep,...?"
>>>
>>> Yes.. but think that GTK gives GNOME and XFCE and a lot of people like
>>> the latter (myself) and QT has KDE and Trinity... (ok, I hope we won't
>>> have stupid revision splits like these project has, pass the comparison).
>>>
>>>
>>> >
>>> > Given GNUStep is kind of a "clone" of MacOS at some point, I believe
>>> > having a well working desktop would bring MacOS developers over to the
>>> > platform to use GNUStep as the tool to port their Apps to supported
>>> > GNUStep Platforms. Of course all the latest new AI and ML and Metal
>>> > implementation stuff would be missing but there are LOTS and LOTS of
>>> > applications out there who could be ported easily. But it all starts
>>> > with a working environment a developer coming over from MacOS could use.
>>> >
>>>
>>> thank you for your thought, it is similar to mine.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think having a split website is fine, it can be made clearer, we can
>>> have better working and better navigation. The only common part is the
>>> painpoint: the homepage. We used the catch-all approach for years,
>>> continuing to add everything so that at a glance everything is there. I
>>> tried to clean it up a little, but it can be done further without fear,
>>> being sure that you can read what you need.
>>>
>>> However... we lack clear material in development, how things fit
>>> together, the structure, so that you can read. The "glue" between just
>>> raw class reference and tutorials. They should be there and cross-linked.
>>>
>>> Also some diagrams like our library structure. presentation of the
>>> different libraries beyond core.
>>>
>>> we essentially have:
>>> https://www.gnustep.org/developers/index.html
>>>
>>> which contains really little. Points out some stuff to Wiki... but we
>>> should decide that if it is stable and complete, it should be "promoted"
>>> and integrated. E.g.
>>>
>>> https://www.gnustep.org/developers/map.html
>>>
>>> Sorry for not having upgraded the style of it yet - will do. But it
>>> should have a good "text" around the images.
>>> Also... I find it a little bit confusing- gnustep make ?
>>>
>>>
>>> The real useful it has is a link here:
>>> https://www.gnustep.org/developers/documentation.html
>>>
>>>
>>> Good evening,
>>>
>>> Riccardo
>>>
