Andrew, the questions where out of line and uncalled for.
On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 10:18 PM, Alex kot <ak47...@gmail.com> wrote: > Fiona, > > Shoot an email to discuss-unsubscr...@synhak.org this will send an email > back letting you know you where unsubscribe. > > Thanks, > Alex Kot > ------------------------------ > From: Fiona Casida <fcas...@gmail.com> > Sent: 5/15/2014 9:29 PM > To: SYN/HAK discussion list <discuss@synhak.org> > > Subject: Re: [SH-Discuss] Meeting Minutes 5/13/14 > > Good evening, > > Would you please remove me from the list? Thank you. > > I wish you all the best. > > Fiona Casida > > Sent from my iPhone > > On May 15, 2014, at 9:05 PM, a l <leit...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Becca, > I figured the minutes didn't accurately capture the moment. I agree that > interviews have been lax and even rushed in the past. It's obvious that > there are differing views on how we run and how we should run. Members new > and old should have some, at least casual, knowledge of how we govern and > what our mission and community goals are. > > Everyone, > Sure we hack and do-ocracy things but what does that mean? How do you > balance do-ocracy with not crushing people's toes. In the past we were > operating fairly smoothly. Part of that is due to the small size but a > bigger part of that was a clearer sense of who we were as a community. It > would be simple if we could pile all of our faults onto the actions of a > few, or single person, over the past few months. The current state is a > symptom of a general failure of us as a community. > As Becca touched on these events are the culmination of a long history of > banal interviews and little clear direction. We say our mission at the > beginning of every meeting but do we really do what we tell everyone we do. > We've got the infrastructure but our community doesn't follow a coherent > set of values. Some people want voting, some want consensus, others just > want to throw money at a cool idea so they can use the tools once a month > and help out with expenses. Others still are confused as to why we > collectively need to provide educational outlets to the public. We as a > community have lost our way, maybe we never really had it. > We've had a couple classes this year and a few talks that no one went to. > Apart from GARC the community isn't using us. They haven't been since well > before the interpersonal disputes boiled over. If we want to fulfill our > mission we need to step up our game. > > So while the questions asked were directed at AJ9, like you suggest, we > should all reflect on them. > > regards, > Andrew L > > > On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 7:51 PM, Steve Radonich IV > <nesfr...@outlook.com>wrote: > >> If that is the case Andrew then my reworded proposal meets the >> qualifications to be consented on Tuesday. Because that is what I remember >> as well >> >> >> --- Original Message --- >> >> From: "a l" <leit...@gmail.com> >> Sent: May 15, 2014 7:49 PM >> >> To: "SYN/HAK discussion list" <discuss@synhak.org> >> Subject: Re: [SH-Discuss] Meeting Minutes 5/13/14 >> >> My understanding, and how we've been operating, is that proposals >> need to be discussed either on discuss@ or brought up at a meeting and >> recorded in the minutes. Once those present have a wording they feel >> represents the solution they are looking for it is sent to proposals@ or >> brought up at a meeting and recorded in the precise wording to be >> consented. >> At least week after it has been proposed it is consented on at the >> meeting and forever enshrined in the 'approved proposals' list. >> >> The important step here are that the exact wording of the proposal is >> sent to a mailing list accessible by the community so that any dissenting >> views may be addressed. I believe proposals@ was spun off of discuss@ so >> people were aware that mail from that list was the 'finalized' wording. >> >> I wasn't aware I was having trouble seeing proposals? >> >> regards, >> Andrew L >> >> >> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 2:17 AM, Andrew Buczko >> <a4s...@dsprototyping.com>wrote: >> >> Hey Andrew, >> >> On https://synhak.org/wiki/Unified_SYNHAK_Code >> it says that: >> 6. Proposals must be sent in full to discuss@synhak.org >> >> But, on: >> https://synhak.org/wiki/Proposals >> it says: >> 2. A summary of the discussion is sent to propos...@synhak.org along >> with the actual proposal. >> >> Witch is it? One of these statements is wrong and needs to be changed. >> >> Also, >> Maybe this is why you are having trouble seeing the proposals ? >> >> Andy >> >> >> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 12:34 AM, a l <leit...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Sorry for the double post. I didn't want my comments to get >> mistaken as meeting minutes. I tried to put headings on things in case >> people didn't want to read a lengthy email >> >> 1) Apparently I wasn't clear with my wording regarding Wills membership. >> I ('the secretary') did not say that 'Everything is ok, and last weeks vote >> is upheld.". What I said was "Last week was a fairly involved interview, >> you don't need to do that again. Be sure his(and AJ9's) memberships get >> brought up." Meaning his membership needs voted/consented on properly at >> this meeting. >> That said: no one expressed any desire to block his joining and no one >> protested at the meeting. >> >> 2) While AJ9's interview was a bit hostile those are important questions >> that need asked more frequently by more people. If someone has no idea how >> or why we govern the way we do how can we expect them to follow the rules >> and help build a better community? Perhaps you could respond to the some of >> the questions via email? Particularly consensus and do-ocracy. Feel free >> disagree with them! We're an organic collaboration(or at least bill >> ourselves as such), we won't grow if we don't get new ideas. On that note, >> I'm going to add a question of my own: You mention you're interested in >> non-profit work and need a cause to work with right now. What draws you to >> SynHak compared to the other non-profits in the area? >> >> 3)Regarding the Community Working Group. There is already a proposal that >> a few people have contributed ideas to. I feel that since this changes the >> way we govern ourselves that it does warrant a full blown proposal. If we >> want the suggestions to carry any weight when they are made it needs to be >> part of the operating procedures. Xander brought up the idea of formalizing >> the face to face mediation style and incorporating it into the proposal. >> Having a few mediation templates is a great idea. My only concern is that >> we not require them to be used. Getting the disputing parties to >> communicate is goal 1A. How they do it is less important so long as they >> both agree to it and it occurs in a timely manner. >> >> I'm not convinced that using fractal groups will help. We are(were?) a >> community, intentionally dividing us further seems counter productive and >> bureaucratic. By having more mailing lists to subscribe to it makes it far >> easier for a member to be out of the loop on things that may affect them. >> People are lazy. >> >> 4) The front door. The landlord has told us not to modify it. Would we be >> able to convince him to change his mind if we(or a mutually approved >> price-quoted-prior-to-work contractor) replaced it in such a manner that >> did not prevent the easy re-installation of the original door? We need to >> balance our members physical safety with their perception of safety. By >> installing a door with a push bar we could still 'lock' the door so outside >> entry was not possible during the odd hours but in the event of a fire you >> could get out. >> >> 5) If we're going to assign blame and distribute penalties to someone >> for various signs, graffiti and other unexcellent behavior I want verified >> proof. >> >> 6) Last one I promise. Will's key application. You're a new member and a >> new face to the community. I like your enthusiasm and apologize that this >> is going to come off as an attack, it is not. You want the keys to the >> castle but a couple meetings back you were concerned with not knowing >> anyone. 24/7 is a lot of trust. Not only that our key holders won't strip >> the warehouse for machines and copper but that they'll lock up when they >> leave and be excellent hosts to visitors from the public. I don't expect >> everyone to know every other member as best friends but I find it hard to >> put faith in someone we've just met. >> Admittedly my recent and future attendance is lackluster so I welcome >> people's anecdotes to instill faith in me about this. >> >> One last time: None of the above are meant to be personal attacks. If any >> wording can be construed as such I would appreciate it if you attribute to >> poor proofreading, failure to appreciate the situation, and hasty word >> choice. >> >> regards, >> Andrew L >> >> >> On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 9:23 PM, a l <leit...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Here's the minutes so no one has to download them to read. >> >> Moderator: Becca Salchak >> Note Taker: Steve Radonich IV >> >> Introductions: >> Andy - Electronic Tech >> G - Organize civic hacking events >> Andrew - student >> Mike - Motorola Maxx doesn't float >> Justin - eat delicious stew >> AJ9 - fix things >> Philip - bicycles >> Linda - librarian >> Xander - make blankets >> Torrie - build the api for the internet of things >> Steve - I take notes >> Alex - IT specialist >> Chris Neer - thats it >> Dave - hope to be a part of synhak >> Heard about us once before then at the oddmall >> Craig - drowns in flooded computers >> Martha - likes these rolls >> Devin - I like dem rolls >> Dave2 - working on a tv script >> Becca - works overtime >> >> Announcements: >> * Dave - presentation since I'm new. I have an interest in historic >> preservation, I am currently involved in an effort to save the keyser >> farmstead in Cuyahoga Falls. Over the last few years been >> trying to make it more interesting to get younger people involved. What >> I'm looking forward to do is to take it to the next level, looking for >> someone with skills in robotics to help make a robotic >> horse, that would make people excited in history through a different >> approach. >> ** Dave2 - What do you want from us? >> **Dave - trying to get a smaller sized horse or pig >> ** Alex - robotics club on saturday >> ** Becca - GARC functions out of here on the 2nd saturday's where they >> work on robots associated with CVCA >> >> * Philip - I have 2 >> ** Last Saturday was the Akron Art Walk and I wound up being the only >> member here for 5 hours, nobody else showed up, June 7th is the next one. >> So next time we need to get things running for it, to get >> people into SYNHAK. When people come here they need to see stuff >> happening instead of looking at static objects. I think we need a much more >> active demonstration going on. So I'm setting up a signup >> sheet for the next walk. People had no idea what to expect because we >> didn't have a paragraph in the papers handed out by the city of Akron. I >> want to take over the art walk as far as doing something. >> *** Torrie - so that's a really amazing idea, but I'm leaving for San >> Francisco thursday but I'm coming back in 2 weeks. Can we meet thursday to >> work out a plan >> *** Philip - I need people >> *** Alex - Hackathon on June 7th for it >> *** Becca - We discussed last week to do our hackathon with the Akron Art >> Walk so we will have at least something going on. >> *** Philip - I appreciate that but we need people to explain what SYNHAK >> is and does so we can get people interested. >> *** Alex - I'll help you with the handouts if you want to work with me >> sometime. With info on what we do, events going on, hackathon >> *** Philip - Excellent >> ** Friend of mine owns Urban Eats, they're personal friends of mine, I >> talked to Devin last week that I wanted to do something about the crappy >> garage door. So no what I'm going to do is I have a one >> man business Patnode Photography so we are going to co-sponsor a jurried >> contest, so I'm going to make 11x17 color prints of the front of the >> building where people pay $5 to submit a picture with what they >> want to see the front door to look like. Winner will get $40 gift card, >> and 1/3 of the money raised Rest goes to costs. Those who submit designes >> and the members vote on the designs. Whoever wins by >> the most votes wins. >> *** Xander - Only comment I have is that someone would submit one great >> one and a bunch of meh ones >> *** Philip - we are going to repair the garage door, because it is bleh >> *** Becca - is this something we have to get approval by the landlord >> *** Philip - Why? >> *** Becca - Because it's his property >> *** Justin - yes we do >> *** Torrie - I will be submitting entries >> *** Justin - We need to get approval from the land lord because the lease >> says we can't put external signage without prior approval >> *** Becca - I think it's a great idea >> *** Philip - If we could get it done by the art walk that'd be great >> *** Will - are you making a requirement to say SYNHAK on it >> *** Xander - I asked for a copy of the lease, for the record >> >> * G - Just one: Akron Civic Hackathon, part of the national day of civic >> hacking, list of people making it happen, scheduled MAy 31st - June 1st, >> it's a vehicle for managers who have IT Problems >> to provide the opprotunity of volunteers to solve the problem. I'm >> hosting the event hoping for some press. Please RSVP on meetup if interested >> >> * Andy - Soap box derby race is starting up soon, I went last year it was >> really fun, check the website for a list of races >> >> * Torrie - So I started my robotics company full time phrobo.net >> >> * Alex - Doing a monthly hackathon june 7th this will be for the wireless >> mesh, I will be providing food. G if you could setup a meetup for that. >> It's basically going to be from learning how to build it >> to getting it built and benchmarked >> >> * Alex - Sundown rundown I'm doing a pitch there >> >> * Philip - Friday night 7:30 galaxy quest, free popcorn bring your own >> liquids >> >> Membership: >> >> * Becca - Confusion about wiliams application, secretary said it's fine, >> so we aren't going through the membership process again >> ** Will - Thumbs up :D >> ** Xander - Class schedule, enrollment letter to prove you're a student >> >> Name: AJ9 >> Discussion/Questions: >> * Justin - Why do you want to be a member >> * AJ9 Really interested in nonprofit develoment >> >> * Justin - any particular member you enjoy the company of >> * AJ9 - Justin >> >> * Torrie - what does consensus mean to you >> * AJ9 - Have no opnions on that subject >> >> * Philip - What can you contribute to SYNHAK >> * AJ9- Graphic designs, media management, communication, fund raising >> >> * Alex - what can synhak do for you? >> * AJ9 - don't have a specific cause at the moment, so I thought that this >> could be something to do >> >> * Torrie - What does do-ocracy mean to you? >> * AJ9 - I have no opinion >> * Torrie - So why are you applying for memberhsip which gives you access >> to governance >> * Aj9 - I'm a member of the community so I feel I should be about to vote >> * Torrie - how do we govern >> * AJ9 - We don't do good job of governance >> >> * Mike - If you would paint your workbench a color what would it be and >> why? >> * AJ9 - Pink I like pink >> >> * Andy - favorite piece of equipment at the space >> * AJ9 - Drillpress >> >> * Steve- Nintendo or Sega? >> * AJ9 - SEGA >> >> * Torrie - What does synhak means to you? >> * AJ9 - synhak is a community that is very important to me, there are >> members who I care a lot about, I don't think I'm going to be able to come >> up with an answer to please you >> >> * Xander - What makes you happy? >> * AJ9 - Music >> >> * Will - what kind of music >> * AJ9 - All kinds >> >> * Torrie - How would you improve synhak >> * AJ9 - I would improve synhak through the democratic process the >> membership determins >> * Torrie - How would you use that to improve synhak >> * AJ9 - Finances, would assist with management of >> >> * Torrie - Um... idea I've been rolling around in my head for a whil, >> other hackerspace every month the whole membership gets together, and pay >> their bills, talk about allocating money towards monthly >> expenditures, and do it as a community. What problems do you percieve? >> * AJ9 - I decline to respond >> * Torrie - Applying for membership for access to the tools to shape >> synhak? >> >> * Dave - Opinion as a guest regarding membership: Been involved in >> history and preservation and belong to a number of organizations, >> unfortunately we get a bad rap, we are considered white glove. We're >> not inclusive, we're exclusive, tell people hands off don't do this. You >> want to get as many memebrs as you can, being more inclusive. Take off the >> white gloves, take off the attitude, share ideas get >> together. >> >> * Torrie - I want to figure out what AJ9's intent of becoming a member is. >> >> * Philip - Public record that I support her membership, and if possible I >> would block the block, we need confident, reliable, experiecnced, educated >> people to help run synhak. We need people like her >> who can help run the space. If we can approve a 7 year old who can't read >> the by laws, yet block AJ9 is ridiculous. >> >> * Mike - Do you have any experience in conflict resolution >> * AJ9 - Yes I do, in college was a mediator for the student government >> organization >> >> * Devin - I see you bring a productive mem >> >> > [The entire original message is not included.] > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@synhak.org > https://synhak.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss >
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