> Monte':
>       I DO realize that I'm the product of a sexist and racist society, 
>         and I AM TRYING TO CHANGE.  Is it really constructive for me to 
>         accept _personal_ blame for what our culture did to me?  

That right there is the whole reason so many women on this list are not 
impressed with your posts.  You are not going to get any pity from me 
over 'what this society has done to you'.  Asking this group of women to 
pity you like you are the victim in this world is absolutely ludicrious.  
If you want to believe that you go right ahead, but don't do it here on 
ecofem.  We're not havin' it!

          Isn't it 
>         enough to try to change?  And how does it help me to change if 
>         folks I'm trying to be friends with distrust me right off the bat?  
>         Doesn't that simply perpetuate the defensiveness on both sides?
>                                                                       Al
> 
> 
> 

Al-

        It is not our responsibility to put you at ease.  (If anything it's the 
other way around!)  It's not our jobs to help you change, that's up to 
you.  (What do you think a black slave would have said if the master all 
of a sudden decided to reform and repent and wanted to be friends?  Don't 
you think the slave would have more than a few reservations about just 
trusting that individual after all the pain and suffering he caused?)  If 
you truly want to be an ally you are going to have to deal with our 
anger and you'll have to work to earn our trust.  This group is called 
Ecofeminist because that is who it is here to serve.  I must agree with one of
the previous posts, we woman can and do hear about mens problems all the 
time.  We've got problems of our own and we don't want to hear yours 
here.  

        If you would like to continue this conversation privately that is 
fine with me, I'm willing to listen.  But I will not discuss this further 
on ecofem.

Sincerely,
Monte' Snellenberger

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