In a message dated 98-10-16 14:31:06 EDT, you write:
<< rom: Sarah Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: STUDIES IN WOMEN AND ENVIRONMENT <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: family size,etc.
Originally to: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Why do these discussions always turn into a ranting and raving scream
> fest? Discuss but stop getting so personal and angry. I think most of us
> basically agree on things around here - that's why we are all on an
> eco-feminist list server. I'll admit that I occasionally like to ruffle
> feathers to stir up controversy but this group always seems to turn into
> one of those shout matches on television. It's very tiresome. Let's talk
> about something positive.
True, there ARE some gunslingers in here who will shoot from the
hip with epithets of "sexist" and "homophobic" at the drop of an ill-
chosen metaphor, but they, too, are part of the mix, and serve the
purpose of keeping us all on our politically correct toes. Joe
Hi!
I for one am not on this list to keep anyone on their politically correct
toes - I for one am not sexist or homophobic-
An ideal world would be where everyone agreed on everything that affected
everyone and everything! That and a perfect world are not within our reach!
So let's just focus on just make things better! All we can hope for is
better!
I am on this list to debate very important issues with people of different
view points and religious beliefs - I find the discussions stimulating and
educational. This list inspires me to care more, think more and at times do
more to help make the world a better place.
Let's not close ourselves into turtle shells and limit our discussions -
Eventhough it may be comfortable in there we can not remain in crawl or
undershell position through out our life - our spirits must sprout wings so
that we can rise above the noise and confusion - ) and we can't pretend that
these issues are not important. Dealing with issues that relate directly to
ecofeminism - gender discrimination, sexual discrimination, overpopulation and
the eco-crisis, religious beliefs and how the affect our behavior - in my
opinion all very important topics. Let's not shy away from them because they
may make us feel uncomfortable at times or because we can take things too
personal - this involves all of us REALLY and literally all of us and we all
have the power to change things -
Thanks!
Angela
Thanks!
Angela
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Oct 16 18:39:55 1998
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:21:39 EDT
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: family size,etc.
In a message dated 98-10-16 16:40:50 EDT, you write:
<< i agree....if we cant begin to create a safe space here in which to learn
together-collaboratively-, how are we ever ever going to dialogue with
those not holding ecofem ideals!?
there is a wicca belief that whatever energy you put out comes back to you
three-fold, and i believe this listserve has illustrated it perfectly! put
out anger, and it comes flying back......(although im not saying that we
should surpress our anger/or that anger is bad)...but i agree with Sarah, I
get tired of being angry and just want to get on with nurturing a different
way of being........
have a joyous fall weekend everyone.....
katie
>>
Hi!
Katie - I get tired of being angry myself - but it is important that we do not
suppress our anger about the Eco-Crisis- especially now that we have a lot to
be angry about - they are raping the Earth - they are raping our sisters - we
should be as ANGRY as Hell! But why are they doing it - how can we stop them
- what can we do to collaborate our efforts and come to some mutual
understanding of what it means to be part of this exquisite interconnectedness
of life! We are just beginning to understand this miracle of living - let's
unfold together and agree to keep debating the important issues! Agreeing
that we disagree and let's all still be friends is going to put icing on the
cake when it is still hot - it will melt and all you will have is the cake
again! Don't frost the lucsious cake until it is cooled! We have to keep
HOT/ANGRY about this mess we are in - and keep working at solutions!
We can have the cool down enjoy the cake with the icing and celebrate after we
have successful stopped corporate greed and hate towards women in the name of
religion Until then be ANGRY but enjoy your weekend!
Peace!
Angela
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Oct 16 19:36:40 1998
From: "Joe E. Dees" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:36:47 -0500
Subject: Re: family size,etc.
Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In-reply-to: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date sent: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:55:55 EDT
Send reply to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: STUDIES IN WOMEN AND ENVIRONMENT <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: family size,etc.
> In a message dated 98-10-16 13:46:14 EDT, you write:
>
> << And a dying ecosystem is going to support the infrastructure for all
> these good jobs for these teeming billions, I suppose! Joe
> >>
> Hi!
>
> Joe - The dying ecosystems are caused by the industrial revolution - caused by
> our definition of PROGRESS! This is not progress this is disgust! We need to
> redefine what the word PROGRESS means to us! Also the word POWER needs to be
> redefined - are we powerful as humans because we can pro-create or are we
> powerful if we can make educated decisions not to pro-create if it would hurt
> the greater good! We need to redefine these words by incorporating what we
> have learned through evolution! We need new definitions and new perceptions!
> A new world order where progress means . . .and power means . . .
>
> progress means - progressing in harmony and reconnecting with nature whenever
> we can to make things better!
>
> power means - living to our fullest potential as powerful kindred spirits who
> want what is best for the Earth, the animals and each other as equals!
>
Yes - and controlling our own numbers is critical to both our
empowerment and our progress in these terms, for it is also critical
to somehing more basic - survival; both our own and the earth's.
Infrastructure and industry are ecologically intrusive, and more of us
means more of them, less room for Nature, and therefore less
Nature left to interconnect with. Joe
> Peace!
> Angela
