Actually I think we are talking about two sides of a coin. The lab side generally knows and understands what his equipment does and how to properly test, but sometimes forgets that his responsibility is to show the rest of industry that his equipment and testing practices are actually doing what they are supposed to do.
The assessor knows and understands what is needed to show that equipment works properly, but sometimes forgets that his responsibility is not to nitpick a thing to death, but to gather sufficient information to only provide and establish believability in the labs system. These two almost opposite roles sometimes cause friction. You can have a lab that gets infuriated when anyone dares suggest or question if they know the exact when, where, how and why of data taking. And you can have an assessor that gets his knickers twisted when the lab provides less than adequate proof to show compliance to the accreditation standard. I have been in many many assessments and for the most part both lab and assessor do know what they are doing, but contention still exists simply because they are on two opposites sides of the QA coin. The lab simply needs to understand that you cannot just rely on 'my equipment works so that the end of it' and the assessor needs to understand that you cannot cross every t and dot every i everytime an assessment is done. Dennis Ward Director of Engineering American Certification Body Certification Resource for the Wireless Industry http://www.acbcert.com 703-847-4700 fax 703-847-6888 direct - 703-880-4841 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bill Owsley Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 7:14 PM To: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: RE: my last lab audit Thanks for the reminder about old Foghorn! I had nearly forgotten him. Attitude is Mind over Matter. If you don't Mind, it doesn't Matter... This email has been displayed using 100% recycled electrons and 100% pure virgin photons. --- On Mon, 1/24/11, Brian O'Connell <[email protected]> wrote: > From: Brian O'Connell <[email protected]> > Subject: RE: my last lab audit > To: [email protected] > Date: Monday, January 24, 2011, 5:35 PM > <Foghorn Leghorn voice> > That's a joke, I say, that's a joke, son. > </Foghorn Leghorn voice> > > The auditor's manger only reply was "ROTFLMAO" when I sent > this > conversation; so I decided to attempt the same result from > this august > forum. > > Most auditors are too dazed and confused to be power > tripping. > > Brian > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]]On > Behalf Of Doug > > Kramer > > Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 1:50 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: RE: my last lab audit > > > > Larry, > > Well stated, except for the power trip comment. > > -Doug > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf > > Of Larry Stillings > > Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 2:37 PM > > To: '[email protected]'; > [email protected] > > Subject: RE: my last lab audit > > > > Brian, > > > > Hire a new auditor. I know, easier > said then done. > > > > I lot of them are on a power trip, > that's why they are auditors. > > > > Basically, you need to contact > whomever runs your particular > > accreditation body and talk to them. Remember you are > a > > paying customer, and > > have options to whom your choose for your audits. > > > > Larry > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Brian O'Connell [mailto:[email protected]] > > > Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 3:31 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: my last lab audit > > > > auditor: Your software does not meet 17025 - no test > data. > > > > me: 'That' software is only for a windoze HMI, no > data being > > collected, no > > data being analyzed, no data processed. > > > > auditor: But it displays test parameters. > > > > me: There are no reports or design decisions or TRFs > being > > made from this > > displayed data. Instruments are calibrated and > tracible, and > > the program > > that acquires and processes the data is subject to > audit and > > a regression > > series for each rev. Here is the last CIG which > included all > > test driver software. > > > > auditor: I want to see the 17025-based tests for > 'this' software. > > > > me: Here is my test data (hand auditor the HMI source > code). > > > > auditor: What am I supposed to do with this? I do not > know > > anything about programming. > > > > Brian > > - > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering > Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the > list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the > web at: > http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ > Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be > posted to that URL. > > Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ > Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html > List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html > > For help, send mail to the list administrators: > Scott Douglas <[email protected]> > Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> > > For policy questions, send mail to: > Jim Bacher: <[email protected]> > David Heald: <[email protected]> > - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <[email protected]> David Heald: <[email protected]> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <[email protected]> David Heald: <[email protected]>
