I think I see a reason why advice about PIDs used an axis and a spindle
might differ.  The axis servo will have a huge about of gearing so the
motor will run fast and the controller will see a lot of edges per PID loop
interval.

If Gene is using a gear tooth sensor on an 80 tooth gear and running at
1000 RPM then he is only seeing 1333 gear teeth per second.    I hope he is
not running the PID loop at 1KHz or he sees either 1 or 2  teeth per
interval.  We call this an extreme case of quantization error.   In this
case needs to be measuring microseconds per tooth or a MUCH higher
resolution sensor.

For a spindle I think a longer control loop period is in order.  Unless you
are doing rigid tapping all you car about is speed stability.

On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Peter C. Wallace <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Mon, 30 Oct 2017, Gene Heskett wrote:
>
> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:44:49 -0400
>> From: Gene Heskett <[email protected]>
>> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
>>     <[email protected]>
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Spindle pid problems
>>
>>
>> On Monday 30 October 2017 15:20:35 andy pugh wrote:
>>
>> On 30 October 2017 at 17:49, Gene Heskett <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Which is computationally less cpu usage 1, a 6 pack of mux2's, or
>>>> another pid with separate settings and just one mux2 to select which
>>>> pid gets sent to the spindle servo?
>>>>
>>>
>>> PID is not very CPU intensive, neither is mux2. I wouldn't really
>>> worry about either.
>>>
>>> You can see how much CPU time each module uses in HAL.
>>>
>>> The "lincurve" component was intended specifically for this type of
>>> situation, which is why it has outputs of the r/w style that can be
>>> connected directly to the pre-2014 PID gain pins (which for no good
>>> reason were bidirectional)
>>>
>>> But in this case mux2 seems more appropriate if it is a simple switch
>>> between states.
>>>
>>> Between pid.sh.output and pid.sl.output. When I get everything else
>> working again. Probably not yet tonight as I had to come and do
>> something about an empty skillet for dinner.
>>
>>> However, I suspect that your problem is that you are trying to use P
>>> on a controller that only really needs FF0 and I.
>>>
>>
>> A dc powered spindle is a velocity servo I think, so I been trying to
>> follow John Thorntons wiki article from 2012 where he describes tuning a
>> axis servo in the velocity mode. Is this the wrong approach for a
>> spindle that needs to have quite stiff control?
>>
>> And I just found his other description of spindle tuning, where its all
>> FF0 and Igain.  That one however doesn't describe the hardware setup at
>> all, nor does it have any halscope pictures. I suspect that the spindle
>> John was calibrating was being driven by a vfd, which is inherently a
>> pretty stiff drive.
>>
>> But when I get it back to where I can run it (I'm in the middle of moving
>> the spindle power control sequencer from the 5i25 P3 to the same on P2,
>> which feeds a different bob in a different box. And reconnecting it to
>> where I can use an A axis with those pins, and while I am up on the
>> ladder, I'll get the individual boxes bolted together to prevent another
>> short that blew a chain of 5i25's).
>>
>> I really ought to build another, even bigger box, at least another 3"
>> deeper, and 4 or 5" taller so the A driver could fit inside it. Unforch
>> that would take another half a sheet of 1/8" alu plate to go with the
>> close to half a sheet I have on hand.
>>
>> So many projects, so little 'extra' time. :)
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>>
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>>
>
> As Andy mentioned, Spindle tuning is normally done with mostly FF0 and
> then some I
>
> Johns tutorial is for tuning a position mode loop with velocity
> PID output, but your spindle is a velocity mode loop with velocity PID
> output
>
>
>
> Peter Wallace
> Mesa Electronics
>
> (\__/)
> (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
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>
>
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-- 

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California
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